My coach always seems to suggest a slightly softer approach. His point is that anything giving the appearance of being punitive will engender resentment and defensiveness on the part of the other person, and "he's never seen that work".
He'd probably suggest something like: "you know, I've never been here before. My #1 goal right now is to work on myself, and be the best version of myself I can be. I'm not quite ready to hang out, and I need to be true to myself and maintain my self respect".
Originally Posted By: along
reframe, I am running into a similar sitch. My WW is letting the OM coach and manipulate how she is dealing with me and the settlement of our D. Want to be strong but not too, but also don't want to come off as weak. Been there too long.
How did your coach suggest you handle those sitch? I could not afford to keep using a coach so I am doing this on my own. It is so hard, especially when you are dealing with NGS also.
Me, H-39, W-33 T11, M3 No children Bomb 10/17 - "Not sure what she wants" Bomb 2 12/17 - forced convo it did not go well. W moved out 3/18 OM Confirmed 4/1 D Final 9/27/18
"you know, I've never been here before. My #1 goal right now is to work on myself, and be the best version of myself I can be. I'm not quite ready to hang out, and I need to be true to myself and maintain my self respect"
waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy too wordy!
if you don't want to go with my gung-ho approach, I'd do this:
"thanks for the invite, but I am unable to do that right now". and then leave it.
Get rid of everything about self-respect, working on myself blah blah blah... she doesn't give a $hit.
Be as succinct and pithy as possible with being assertive and pleasant. Don't go into explanations about what you're doing and what not. They don't care.
thanks again. You provide excellent advice here. The coaches tend to be a bit "softer" - I wasn't advocating this approach, just responding to "Along" who asked how my coach would suggest handling this.
He generally encourages a much softer approach. Up until a few weeks ago, I tended to agree with his approach to.
Now, I think being a little more assertive may be in order.
Me, H-39, W-33 T11, M3 No children Bomb 10/17 - "Not sure what she wants" Bomb 2 12/17 - forced convo it did not go well. W moved out 3/18 OM Confirmed 4/1 D Final 9/27/18
Being firm doesn't mean not being nice. I think Maika's point is that validation means to be succinct and stick to the point of validating. Don't offer up more info than you need to. The thing about needing to work on yourself etc is too much info. Plus Maika's example leaves a lot of mystery. She will wonder "Why can't he right now? Had he moved on to someone else? Why is he so busy? Why isn't he not jumping at the chance to be with me?" Etc.
The point of succinct validation and detachment (again, do this so super nicely that she will be coated in sugar afterward!) is to get her to want to know what is up. To be curious! She will then initiate contact much more. She will push for meeting up even harder. It will drive her crazy wondering why you aren't agreeing to get together and what you are up to!
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Today the wife messaged me and mentioned that she was seriously considering buying a van and solo traveling for awhile.
She also posted on facebook looking for affordable liberal cities to possibly move to. (I unfollowed her there, a mutual friend told me about this)
I mentioned in our conversation that I thought she said that she didn't want to be a nomad any more (we had planned on traveling together) and she said she wasn't sure what she wants, but she needs to do some soul searching and she can't do it here.
This struck me as a glimmer of self awareness on her part, of a realization that she needs to ACTUALLY work on herself. Perhaps a start of the journey toward her coming around.
A few hours later she posted that she had a therapist appointment, and she was dating a beautiful soul and was getting everything she needed.
It appears that it's still a roller coaster ride with her.
Me, H-39, W-33 T11, M3 No children Bomb 10/17 - "Not sure what she wants" Bomb 2 12/17 - forced convo it did not go well. W moved out 3/18 OM Confirmed 4/1 D Final 9/27/18
A "beautiful soul" that has no problem dating his married students. Not that I'm bitter or anything.
Me, H-39, W-33 T11, M3 No children Bomb 10/17 - "Not sure what she wants" Bomb 2 12/17 - forced convo it did not go well. W moved out 3/18 OM Confirmed 4/1 D Final 9/27/18
Honestly at this point - stop engaging with her. I know that you're not initiating this, but whatever she's telling you, just take it and let it dust off your shoulder.
She wants to travel, she wants to do therapy, she wants eat banana pudding for dinner - who gives a giant f#$%ing $hit. You give ZERO f#$%s about it.
She's dating a 'beautiful soul' - man, I just threw up a little in my mouth reading that. So much disrespect and having no qualms about how you're feeling.
None of this is a glimmer of self-awareness. Someone who is self-aware wouldn't be saying what she's saying. You have no idea why she's going into therapy - maybe she wants to get rid of her guilt. Who knows?
What do you do now? Give ZERO f*&$ks.
There are serious examples of LBS's here who just hung on to their partners and didn't go dark and found ways to keep in contact and engage and let the disrespect continue. They added MONTHS and MONTHS to their healing and recovery period. Don't do that.
To clarify - she didn't saw the second bit to me. I thought her realization that maybe she needed to be alone for a bit was a glimmer of self awareness.
It was something she posted (publicly) to instagram.
She routinely posts vomit inducing posts about how self actualized and wonderful her healing journey is there. That said, it's still her posting something publicly knowing that I can see it, and clearly having zero regard for my feelings. To be fair, she's demonstrated (many times) over the last few months that she has very little regard for anything besides what she wants.
I really wish I could just not engage with her man - I'm doing "OK" with all this except on the occasions when I have to interact with her, or when I see crap like this.
Me, H-39, W-33 T11, M3 No children Bomb 10/17 - "Not sure what she wants" Bomb 2 12/17 - forced convo it did not go well. W moved out 3/18 OM Confirmed 4/1 D Final 9/27/18
My coach always seems to suggest a slightly softer approach. His point is that anything giving the appearance of being punitive will engender resentment and defensiveness on the part of the other person, and "he's never seen that work".
He'd probably suggest something like: "you know, I've never been here before. My #1 goal right now is to work on myself, and be the best version of myself I can be. I'm not quite ready to hang out, and I need to be true to myself and maintain my self respect".
Reframe- I assume you are talking about your DB coach? This forum belongs to Michele and is intended to help people in applying some of the details of DB'ing that may not be clear in her books. But her coaches are the experts. Even though some of us have been here a long time, we are not formally trained like her coaches are. Sometimes our advice deviates from what a coach may be telling you, and if so, then in my opinion the coach's advice trumps ours. Always go with your coach's advice because the coaches are trained in Michele's concepts and know the intent inside and out.
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His point is that anything giving the appearance of being punitive will engender resentment and defensiveness on the part of the other person, and "he's never seen that work"
I absolutely agree with him, but that doesn't mean you need to go out with her whenever she asks either. You've just got to learn how to strike a balance- learn how to refuse without it sounding punitive.
Quote:
"you know, I've never been here before. My #1 goal right now is to work on myself, and be the best version of myself I can be. I'm not quite ready to hang out, and I need to be true to myself and maintain my self respect".
I think the intent is there, but it's too wordy. It sounds scripted. Maybe just "Thank you for the offer but I'm just not ready for that." I think that makes it clear that you're not trying to punish her.
aaahhh man reframe.. you are in a tough spot. We've all been there.
I see Maika is fighting the good fight.... listen to him.
I'll be honest with you... she is not working on herself, she is not self aware of anything accept, of course, what her wayward mind wants. It's just bla bla bla words man. Whatever she has to tell herself to justify her actions is what you are hearing. She will not be ready to work on herself for a long, long time if ever. Heck, my wife didn't realize the mess she was in for a solid year. Even then it took another year for her to realize that she had to look inward. And you know what helped to get her to that point... me going dark! Don't care what she is doing.... and if that's not possible.. then act as if. Then one day you wake up and you actually don't care (go watch swingers). It's the fog man... that's all it is. The sooner you realize this and accept the better off you will be.
What was your response when she said she was going to buy a van and travel solo?? I would have ignored that for sure. And that's not being mean or being vindictive. SHE was the one being mean by telling you that.
Tell your friend to stop giving you details about what she is posting. If you want to know, you will ask. I had that convo with anyone who mentioned what my WW was doing on social media... and you know what... I never heard details of it again.
