still struggling

[Jim1234]

Thanks Joejoe. I just can't imagine what's running through her head, but I guess that's not uncommon.

After reflecting, I think she might have been testing the temperature by bringing up the settlement agreement at one point. The good news is that I didn't really comment. At this point, I don't really care if she sends me a draft or not. But I think I will follow AnotherStander's suggestion and wait a month or so of feeling this way before suggesting she push the settlement agreement forward.

Some of the posts on other people's threads have really made me realize that I'm not trying to reconcile with W, but with the kind loving wonderful woman W was 20 years ago, and she's gone. So if we reconcile, I'll be stuck with the W she is today... and do I really want to spend the next 20 years with her? No thank you.

[Jim1234]

Looking for some advice....

W said in a previous convo that she'd like me to continue paying child support while the kids are in college, as they still need financial support. It was hard not to laugh in her face, but I didn't and told her I'd think about it. She's going to want to talk about it again soon, and I'm not quite sure what to say.

I want to strike the right note between detachment, validation, and "no". I'm thinking something along the lines of "This was your decision to get divorced, your decision to stop working on our marriage, your decision to move into another house, your decision to buy a dog and two cats so you had to hire a pet sitter when you went to work. I'm sorry you find yourself in financial difficulty. It must be very hard for you. But it's no longer my responsibility to fund your lifestyle. After the child support ends, I'll be happy to pay half for things like new clothes if you provide me with the receipt."

Thoughts?

[Jim1234]

Something happened this morning, and I'm just wondering what the community thinks....

Got up this morning after the kids went to school, came downstairs, and found a note from W, who just returned from overseas. "... I stopped in this morning 'cos we landed early and I was dying to give the kids a hug."

On the one hand, I don't really care. Glad the kids got to see her.

On the other hand, I am pretty sure it's inappropriate for her to be in my house without my knowledge, but I have to say I'm not sure I care.

[Holding]

Jim, just some random thoughts...

It seems the kids let her in. Can you realistically stop them from letting her in? Would you want to? What kind of message does "Don't let her in" send to them?

I can't remember the details of your sitch, but is your house the marital home, where she still contributes to mortgage payments?

Can the kids let you in to her place if you stop by there unannounced? (Not that you'd necessarily want to)

Maybe just send her an email that says "In the future, please let me know when you will coming to the house."

[Jim1234]

I am in the marital home, but she's not responsible for anything here anymore. I don't remember if she gave me the key back. I don't really care if the kids let her in, I just thought it was unusual and figured I'd ask about it.

[NicoleR]

Jim,

It doesn't sound too suspicious that your wife came today if she was just returning from overseas and missed the kids. Hopefully any other time she'll call first though.

I still haven't read each and everyone of your first threads but your wife sounds like an atypical case. She didn't have an affair, right? It's strange that she wants to be alone at this stage when the kids are still in the process of graduating and moving out. Why not wait a few years? Have you figured out a root cause or it's just a combination of everything that went downhill?

Your thread seems to touch on so many of the legal and financial issues that arise when a couple divorces. Has your divorce actually gone through? I'm sorry if I missed that as well, but I guess you're further along in the process than some of us.

Do you ever still wish to reconcile with your wife?

[Jim1234]

No, Nicole, no affairs, just an unhappy marriage, and in retrospect, I share a lot more blame than I imagined at the time. During the long slide downhill, I said and did some things that destroyed her sense of safety and security in our marriage, and that was when she really just checked out. I didn't really understand that until it was too late.

My situation isn't really further along, it's just taking more time. If she wants a divorce, I'm not doing it for her, so nothing's getting done. It would be typical for her to let it languish, but part of me hopes she doesn't really want the divorce.

It's funny you ask that. I've been hoping for a reconciliation for a long time. But the Thanksgiving episode helped me achieve a lot of the distance I need, and I now realize that I'm trying to reconcile with the woman she was 20 years ago. She no longer exists, and I don't want to spend the next 30 years of my life with the woman she is today.

[NicoleR]

Jim,

To me you sound like you must be much different now than you were previously. You're here on this board, helping others and making sure you're making the right moves in your own situation. It sounds like you've had a lot of realizations. If your wife checked out surely she'll see the way you are now, at some point, and reconsider.

It sounds like just as you've been making changes, your wife needs to go through that same process for herself to be someone you'd want to be with. How does your wife act around other people? Does she still seem the same around her friends and family? I ask because I also see my husband is a totally different man to me, but when he's around other people he's the same funny, kind, thoughtful man he used to be to me. So it seems his changes towards me are just an act to show his disgrace with me.

Your wife may wish to be her old self again but has too much resentment. It's so hard to know what the other person is thinking.

It seems like there is still hope for your marriage. Maybe your wife is thinking more than you realize. Maybe you need to do some crazy unexpected things like fly off to some exotic island or organize a community event with a creative theme to challenge yourself and bring out your spontaneous side. Maybe you can try some new clothing styles. I just imagine from a woman's perspective that for your wife, seeing a little mystery and excitement might intrigue her. Maybe you're already doing those things but it seems like there's still hope for you.

[Jim1234]

Nicole, the divorce has been a catalyst for introspection. I've realized that I contributed more to the demise of my marriage than I thought, and I'm making some changes, rekindling friendships, etc. So that's all good.

I don't think she is going through that process, or cares to. I can safely say she harbors a lot of resentment, years' worth. If she ever reconsiders, it will take a looooong time.

We get along very well. It's a very amicable divorce, so far. We still run in the same social circle, mostly (she's become closer to people I don't care for), and are polite, if not warm, when we see each other.

I'll try things along the lines you suggested, but the resentment runs so deep, I don't see it having much effect.

[Jim1234]

This divorce has been a catalyst for introspection, and this board has helped me realize how important a sense of safety and security is to a woman, emotional, physical, financial, marital..... I realize that there have been any number of ways I have violated that sense of security.

I saw W today, had a quiet moment, and apologized for repeatedly letting her down in this area. I think she immediately got defensive, mentioning that I've apologized for these things before. I told her that yes, I have (for being disrespectful, for projecting my wants and needs onto her without understanding they weren't her wants and needs, therefore failing to meet her wants and needs), and as time goes by, I'm realizing just how far I fell short. I think she was expecting me to ask her to reconsider reconciliation, but I just said goodbye. I think the whole conversation kind of caught her by surprise. I'm pretty sure she was expecting some sort of pressure from me, and I'm pretty sure I didn't put any pressure on her, so that was good.

Also, and this is important, I wasn't expecting anything to come from this conversation. I felt I owed her an apology for a past wrong, and I gave it. I asked for nothing, expected nothing, got nothing, and frankly, don't care. I think that's progress.