This used to be easier - and a lot more fun, cont.

[TBSakaJ9]

What I would really love to find is someone just to do things with, travel with, etc. I'm told there are women like that out there and to be honest, I sort of think that some of those who don't date and are as independent as I am would fit the bill but they would rather just be by themselves - perhaps as jaded as I've become?

I don't think you are too far off here.......just having a companion to do things with is not a bad idea. Coupled with the high D rates of 2nd and 3rd MR's I think it makes sense. My mom has a friend who left her H for a younger model and her Ex never got re-married, still lives in the same house with his girlfriend of many years. So I know first hand it can definitely happened.

At minimum you are happy in your own skin and with yourself which is huge!

I have heard mixed reviews with the on-line dating scene. Quite frankly I would be a little scared to put myself out there but I know some how I would have to get comfortable with it.

Then I look at friends and while I can name several who are happily married, many are not.

I haven't taken a poll but I now look at people who are married differently and feel that I can tell someone who is happy vs not happy. Maybe it is my BD instincts!

[DonH]

even told my friends at this point I think I'd rather get a colonoscopy than get married.

So I made that comment a couple of weeks ago. Then I actually had a colonoscopy last week and have to say it may be a draw. The actual procedure was no big deal but the 24 hour prep - omg it made me soooooo sick. At least I'm good for 10 years now.

Anyhow, Christmas is less than a week away. This will be my 12th Christmas without W and 11th without a GF. I don't decerate as no one will see it but me and I'm fine without it. Yet like many other things I feel like I'm missing out in some ways. I'll be with family and such but it's just not the same. SIL used to ask, "are you dating anyone?" She doesn't even bother asking anymore.

I'm still on "paid vacation" (see my last post) and have gotten so lazy. I keep saying, tomorrow im going to get a lot done and then I do one or two thungs and say, tomorrow I'm going to get a lot done. Then repeat.

I'm feeling more and more stuck. Not majorly so just, I dont know, just maintaining. I'm happy not at all sad just not thriving. Does that make sense? For sure the best parts of my life are behind me - paramedic, firefighter, pilot, CEO, lots of traveling, etc. it's all in the past.

Ginger just reported how her C said she, and I would say this fits for others as well, should not quit trying unless they really don't want to be with someone. I quit trying about six months ago but what gives me pause is I really don't think I do want anyone. I actually got that feeling again after someone expressed interest and I'm again like meah whatever. Another poster here talks about she is rarely turned on by or into anyone. That's me! I can't remember the last time I was like "omg I want to get to know her." Nearly everyone I meet I'm like meah. Is that because when I did try I got nowhere so I'm just cutting to the chase? I wonder. I'd at least like to get excited by someone but they all seem to suuck, have issues, are crazy, can't be honest or ghost you. Clearly my trust is about zilch. Just read the boards and you see example after example after example. I just posted on a thread where a guy had 7 great dates with someone. Then poof, "I don't think we have chemistry, bye." At least she didn't ghost him. That's what it's come to lol not getting ghosted is considered a win.

I'm mostly just venting. Really I am. But even the colonoscopy was harder on me than anticipated. Who knew? I want the life back that I had from 1990 to 2005.

[Georgiabelle]

Happy holidays, Don! That’s me. Rarely, rarely, rarely (I can’t emphasize that enough:-) attracted to anyone. I *like* lots of folks. But I *like* sushi and margaritas too.

I can relate to much of what you say. Enjoy the remainder of “paid” vacation. This is a difficult but good time of year to recharge and focus on what’s most important to you. And I do concur, don’t give up on what you want. However, for me, I have to come to peace with the fact that some things may not transpire. Not giving up-but realizing I can only do what I can.

[DonH]

While I have been meaning to post some thoughts about on-line dating (OLD), something I gave up,after multiple failed attempts, this is not that post. Instead, I've been rather bothered by some events today and figured this was the place to post. I'm not really looking for answers I guess, just frustrated.

I've not been in an actual R for like four years now, perhaps it's more like 4.5. It doesn't really bother me much anymore. In fact, it was because it was bothering me that I finally gave up, ad I really have given up and dropped the dating rope. My last real date was last Fall.

So today I get a request that most people would do back flips over - including me while still married. I get a request to play sax with one of the regular bands I gig with on a 7 day cruise. We only have to play several evenings and then afternoons for two at sea days. It's beyond an easy gig. Thing is, it pays bare minimum - at least compared to my normal gigs which are never less than three figures. BUT even though it's token pay, they cover both the cost of the cruise and flights there - about $1,500 for me AND they will do the same for my "girlfriend". I was like..... Ah, girlfriend?

Such a bummer on an otherwise great gift. Who would not accept a free cruise for two? The leader of the band was certainly willing as was the guitar player. Both are married. The drummer goes through GF like water but has been with the same GF now for about 14 months - although based on her comments this last weekend that may be coming to an end. Then there is me, the extra in the party if 6 or 8 or 10.

The same thing happened two years ago with a group cruise THAT I RAN. We sold just over 100 cabins with about 220 people. I tried everyone I could think of to find someone to go with me. I finally just said, release my cabin and I didn't sail on the cruise that I orchestrated. It makes me depressed and feeling like a loser just thinking about it.

I think that's a good part of why I feel so shltty again now. I feel history repeating itself. Now this may be worse as I'm not going to give away a free vacation just so someone else can go. I can't really sell the other ticket - not ethically anyhow. If I don't find someone, unlike last time where I could bow out, I would still have to go. I really even wonder if the promoters would perhaps force me to room with another musician I may not even know. That's a definite NO F'N WAY. Not going to happen.

I really do well by myself most of the time. It's just times like this... I should be on here saying, I was just given a seven day cruise for two. Instead I'm depressed and not sure what I'm going to do. That [censored]!

I do have ideas, and 10 months to figure it out - well, figure out who my "date" will be that is. They want my answer now. I've already gotten all sorts of suggestions not limited to taking the 32 year old best friend of the leaders daughter. "Do you want to go on a cruise with my dad's friend". I know her somewhat well and she actually may. I just feel like a creepy old man just thinking about it.

Have not thought about her in forever but I really hate my exW today for what she did to my life.

[kml]

Do you nbnot have a good friend or buddy or sibling that you would like to take? It doesn't have to be romantic. (Although I'm secretly hoping a woman will appear out of the ether in the next ten months.)

[Coconut]

Don, I say go for it.. Take the gig, do something you love and enjoy the vacation.. If your worried about them pairing you up with someone else (which I completely understand) find someone that will sign up and just not show up.. Heck, have anyone agree to sign up, even a co-worker if need be, if they just don't show they won't be able to fill in the last minute cancellation. But if there's someone you'd enjoy the experience with, invite them, make it clear your ok if they cancel, you just want the spot filled, no pressure.

I've been on several cruises (living in so. FL did have its perks), and they are awesome for what they are. OLD [censored] for men (im sure you'll eventually get to your post), but being in the spotlight doing what you love is living, don't give that up.

[bttrfly]

^^^ I not-so-secretly share kml's secret hope

xoxoxoxo

say yes, and see what happens

[JRuss]

Of course you say yes to the gig! And be amazed and joyful that you're so [censored] good at the sax that people will give you a free cruise just so they can hear you play. That is incredible! Know every day that you were blessed with a talent few get to have, and that, to your immense credit, you've worked very, very hard developing that gift, to the point that you're a professional musician -- how cool is that?????!?

Find joy in your life, and it will project out of you. Women -- themselves healthy and happy -- will find it deeply attractive and won't even know what it is, exactly, just that they want to be around you. Right now your posts exude heavy melancholy. Melancholy, while completely understandable for all of us, is not attractive to anyone other than co-dependents and fixers. I think you have a lot of self-awareness and have a strong ability to spot damaged people and are good at steering clear, but that melancholia is what's attracting those sorts of folks to you, and a bad, unhealthy R avoided is better than getting ensnared in one, it's not what you want (based on the longing that comes through in your postings).

Be joyful and grateful and amazed at the wonder of a life! Think about this: We're clinging to a rock that is hurdling at thousands of miles an hour through a vast universe we know almost nothing about. We have developed language and art and the internet and human language, and we feel pain and sorrow and joy and happiness, moment by moment. There are right now cheetahs trying to eat antelopes in Africa and 8,000,000+ humans packed onto Manhattan Island. And all of it is incredible. Life is an incredible, fantastical adventure. Feel it, believe it, and it will come out of you, and you'll attract and find someone awesome really quickly. Your biggest problem (you're a pro musician, remember) might end up being how to choose between awesome ladies.

That's how I see it.

[DonH]

Thanks for the initial responses here. I think I need to provide a little more insight - and at the same time help me process through as even the first posts have helped me explore more within myself. I might break this into two posts or at least two sections since there really are two main themes and sides to this.

I'll start with the business end of it. It's clear by Coconut's suggestions the business aspects are being missed and this is a good part of why this is so hard for me.

First, if I go this will be, I think, my 10th cruise. I've never paid for ONE! How cool is that and how lucky am I - I know this, but sometimes forget it. Being on stage for me is just my job. It's no big deal. It really is not - especially at my level. I've performed with some B or C level "stars" from time to time - names you perhaps might know, but not like some of my buddies in the industry have and do all the time. It's possible you might know some of these players - but only if you watch RFD Television. Still, it's no different for me than it is for any of you going to your job.

Now, back to the free cruises. The first was a gift from a hotel that the organization I was CEO for did a lot of business with. They didn't want to lose us so they gave both me and another high level exec a 4 day cruise. At the time I was dating the woman that would become my exW for about three months. When we sailed we had been dating about 6 months. It was a perfect opportunity. Perhaps there is "PTSD" coming from that?

From there I got the idea to run group cruises for this same organization I was CEO of. These cruises were highly successful taking as many as 500 people - never less than 200. That netted me suites on the ships. I've also done two previous band cruises - where I just performed but had nothing to do with running the cruise - sort of like this latest offer.

Then I got D'd and a few years later ran another group cruise. I went by myself for the first time. I had an "owners suit" - one of the best cabins ever! I WENT BY MYSELF AND HATED IT. Now this was only a few years post D, but it's still in my head. More "PTSD"? These things are in many ways for couples - at least the ones I ran were. You do dinners together and take great couple portraits, shore excursions with, etc. It really hit me to the point that I never wanted to go through that again. I still have a group photo where the staff are all in the front row - two by two by two and then me on this love seat by myself with a group of 300 in back of us. That's why when I ran this last one a couple of years ago I refused to go by myself. I tried everyone I knew and no one could get off work, had vacation time, had the money or wanted to go. I released the free cruise and stayed home. More "PTSD"?

Now let's look at the business of what is really going on here. In essence, I'm being given $3,000. That really is the case. I then use that money to purchase two $1,100 cruise tickets and two $400 flights. In fact, I MIGHT (not sure) get a 1099 tax form at the end of the year and then have to pay taxes on this money. It really is income even if money does not change hands. Obviously, they don't send me a check, but just book things for me, but it's no different than if they did give me cash. Sure I can deduct my travel and cruise but NOT that of my guest. So to just put anyone's name down and them not go really is just like taking $1,500 and lighting it on fire! Oh and then paying income tax on the money I just torched.

Add to that, I know and work with these promoters. It's not like I'm "screwing the man" here or some huge cruise line who might not know or care. If this guy found out what I did, he'd likely never hire me again - or a band I was any part of. Word would spread quickly. I would not blame him. How would you feel if someone you hired did this to you? Id' be far better off telling him not to book that flight and he could save $400 or perhaps give it to me or split it with me.

I'm telling everyone this because it really is part of why this is bothering me. For the other guys in the band or anyone in an R - it's an incredible opportunity. Take your wife or GF on a free vacation, make a little money to pay for some expenses while you are there, work perhaps 20 hours during the week and come home. For me it's not like that - and that's what psss me off. You really have to have a GF or W for this to be an opportunity.

_____________________________________________________


With that understanding, you may now see how this is more complicated. It also could put stress and expectations on anyone who might go with me. Not only am I giving them a $1,500 gift, I may be paying taxes on it!!! That's a huge gift for anyone not in an R. Now, just as I would not expect sex after taking someone to a high end restaurant and perhaps to some expensive outing, I would certainly expect she be enguagued, interested, likely a kiss, hold hands, whatever. I most certainly would not expect that she flirt with other guys or meet someone else or something. Same here, I don't want someone leaving the cabin at 9 AM saying "see you later, have a good day" or something.

On the other side, what might whomever goes with me be thinking? "What is Don expecting for such a huge gift," etc. It really complicates all of this. Nearly all of my good friends are married. I have one brother - married, my mom and dad are still both living and actually may go anyway. My good guy friends are married. None of the above are going to go without their wives. They just are not. Plus, at least for me, girls do this stuff all the time. Guys... not so much. In fact as I'm texting about this with the drummer he made the comment "you could always bring a guy and pretend you're gay." Not a totally true statement but there you go. I won't even get into my homophobia. LOL

I'll stop there for part II later. Hopefully this gives some of the background as to why this may be bothering me more than nearly anything else has in this arena since last year. And that in itself bothers me! I really had dropped the rope and have not cared much about women or dating. To be honest, I've been rather certain I never want to get married again for some time now and for the last six months, I've gotten to the point I don't even want a GF. For the most part that fits me just fine - until something like this comes up and smacks me upside the head. I'll address that aspect of it and some of Jruss great points later today.

Thanks everyone!

[Vanilla]

Ask Doodler as a mate to go.

Pick someone explain there will be tax and it's not a free ride. Ask if they will do some admin work for you so they too are business related.

Talk to the organiser and explain, you are single etc.......

Start a singles cruise company, teaching band skills....

Heck looks like an opportunity to me.

V