Awkward Situation Got Much Worse (part 3)

[joejoe1]

Tate,

Can I ask you a question? Or you trying no to hurt your wife feelings? Or you trying not to make her upset or mad at you?

Because it seems as if you are trying your hardest not to rock the boat. I think I posted it to you before, but you should read, "tough love", it's a big eye opener and how you can't condone certain actions and how you have to create that early conflict with your spouse to sake them up. You don't argue with them, but you state what you won't tolerate from them and that you are only willing to love a certain way. You make that statement from a position of confidence and certainty, never looking back if they decide that they are not willing to except the boundaries you laid out.

Without this tough love, you are not really showing your S love. A person who really loves a person, informs them of what they have done wrong. The author uses the drug addicted scenario a lot.

If you child was on drugs would you accept them using drugs? Would you allow them to use drugs in your home and would you fund their drug habit? If the answer to all the questions are no, then apply that same principle to your wife.

If your child continue using drugs, what would your hard stand be. In your mind what would you have to do to help your child make a hard decision to get help to get help. I know funding it and allowing them to use in your home, wouldn't be an option. Right!

Look at your W as a drug addicted, would kicking her out help or hurt her in the long run, not the day of.

[sandi2]

You may not see any similarity in your W with the one I write about below. I don't know if your W has always had these tenencies or not, but if she has....it may take more than you are prepared to do, before there is a positive change, if ever. Tiptoeing around her anger is not a solution for a long term relationship.

I have known a woman who has always used her anger\temper to control those closest to her. She learned how to manipulate adults at a very young age, and she was hateful and a bully to all the other children. I was a teenager at the time, and I had a front row seat to observe her behavior, and I saw things that simply floored me. When she became a teen, her behavior grew worse. She didn't get into drugs, or trouble with the law, or any thing of that nature, she just had a larger sense of entitlement, more demanding, and used her anger to control her parents, grandparents, etc.

She has been M four times, so far......and is the biggest b'tch I have ever had the displeasure of knowing. She has never had friends, b\c nobody can stand to be around her. I have always said her family ruined her when she was small. She was the only child and only grandchild and they allowed her to say terrible things to them and others, throw tantrums, scream threats, etc. They gave in to her demands, almost every time. She was never disciplined, and if one parent tried, then a grandparent stepped in and prevented it. Nobody could stand her as a kid or as an adult. Sadly, nobody could stand to live with her, either. To this day, she has not improved herself. She still wants to control those who come into her life. She puts her wants and needs above her children and her husband. She still has no friends, and her parents and GP's are deceased.

Knowing the family she was born into, I don't know if she would have had much of a chance when she was a child. They were not bad people, but they did not do this child service by treating her like royalty.

As an adult, I think we can evaluate ourselves to see why people don't want to be around us and be our friend.....and why we act so ugly to our family. I see where her life could have been so much better if she would have just stopped the selfish and controlling ways.

This seemed to be a case where the W already has the format for being a wayward W. In other words, she appeared to be wayward before she ever M the first H (who was a very nice guy). By having the format, I mean she already had the selfish nature; resented anyone that crossed her; was already rebellious toward her parents, etc. She uses manipulation, controlling, bullying, and her bad temper as her usual MO. The poor guy that marries this type of woman is just asking for a miserable MR......unless he is not afraid to use tough love when the situation calls for it.

There have been many cases here on the board like this, and adding infidelity to the mix is not a long stretch for her. I have little hope for her, b\c this has been a lifelong behavior. It may be possible for her to change, but I think she would need to want that change more than anything in life. It would take a lot of work and training. She would need a new heart.

Unlike the W who becomes wayward later, as the result of resentment, disrespect and rebellion directed toward her H.....the lifelong wayward (for lack of a better term ATM), does not have a previous positive "self" she can relate to as being the unselfish, giving, respectful, undemanding, truly loving human being. She has little to no positive experience with relationships that she didn't control with her moods. Her manipulation is second nature for her. So, IMHO, she would be tackling lifelong ingrained behaviors that would require more than experiencing remorseful feelings and asking for forgiveness. It would require her to remake herself inside out. Good intentions doesn't cut it, and the reality of just how hard it is to change, comes smacking her in the face very quickly. Can it be done? IDK, quite honestly. I think age might matter.....and how badly she wanted to change. Once the heart has radical change, it helps produce positive actions. However, it takes strong determination to stick to improvements.

I wonder if you love the person you wish your W was, and if it's the idea of losing the entire "family" and home setting scares you more than what reality holds. IDK, but I think everyone I am seeing post to you agrees that what you are currently doing is not going to be enough to change the dynamics of your MR.

[Tate]

To answer some questions...yes, I stated I feel like thriwing in the towel. I have had this thought pattern before my W said she wanted a D the first time a year and a half ago. I would try and try to be the perfect husband with no effort from her, so I would ponder whether I try harder or more or give up and move on. Fast forward to now, and I have an internal struggle of trying to save our M or kicking my W to the curb and moving on. I know now that her prior lack of effort was because she was having an affair.

[Tate]

Tate,

Can I ask you a question? Or you trying no to hurt your wife feelings? Or you trying not to make her upset or mad at you?

Because it seems as if you are trying your hardest not to rock the boat. I think I posted it to you before, but you should read, "tough love"

Unfortunately, the mistake I believe I keep making is getting sucked into my wifes argument traps. As an example, tonight I was outside working on my car while the kids were getting ready for bed. The kids were loud enough I could hear them at tge street. I poked my head in the garage door and asked them to keep it down. I asked them where my W was since she did not seem to be doing anything about them yelling at the top of their lungs.

Just before bed tonight, she brought it up and said that she did ask the kids to quiet down and they did not. She went on to say that she did not like my attitude for assuming she did not try to quiet the kids. My reply was that the kids were so loud that I stopped what I was doing to ask the to quiet it down, which they did. I should have stopped there, but I added that I did not care what she thought of how I handled the situation.

[Tate]

To respond to the questions about me not kicking her out of the house...I can ask her to leave, and her answer is "no". Then what? I cannot physically remove her...

The going dark thing is a reference to where members here simply leave their spouse unannounced for days or weeks. This shows the spouse that they are done with the marriage and gives the spouse a chance to miss them.

In my case, the kids need me home. My wife actually puts tge kids before everything, as do I. That is the only reason we are still living together right now. I handle every single car repair, home repair, taxes, insurance, major purchase, finances, yard work, home technology, etc. My wife takes care of the kids, works, and does some chores...nothing more.

[Lovelyp]

The going dark thing is a reference to where members here simply leave their spouse unannounced for days or weeks. This shows the spouse that they are done with the marriage and gives the spouse a chance to miss them.

I dont think thats what it means. Its just cutting all contact and stopping any communication with spouse. In your case since you are in the same house it is difficult I guess. it would work well if you are living in separate places. I do not think leaving unannounced would be the correct way because it is supoose to be done respectfully. Leaving unannounced would be rude. I think you are in denial and not really ready to put boundaries or ask her to leave or respect you. For her life is normal and she can still have benefits of your presence and bills you take care of and go astray. If she loses those and arrangements change she may wake up and make a decision.

[leahsue]

I think you need to go back and read up on "going dark".

I have never seen anyone say it was about just disappearing, etc. I think you're missing the point. Maybe a vet will jump in here and give you an abbreviated version of what it really means.

[sandi2]

I would try and try to be the perfect husband

The problem with many nice-guy type of H is that his idea of what a perfect H is......rarely is what a woman wants or really needs. With the Mr. Nice Guy mentality, the H tries to do everything so that his W doesn't need to lift a finger. He won't stand up for himself, even when she treats him badly. He thinks by not being decisive and letting her call all the shots will keep her in a better mood. Actually, these actions only cause her to feel a loss of attraction for you.

The going dark thing is a reference to where members here simply leave their spouse unannounced for days or weeks. This shows the spouse that they are done with the marriage and gives the spouse a chance to miss them.

No, this is not how Going Dark works. IMHO, you can't really go dark when you have children together......and especially living under the same roof with her. Neither is the motivation of Going Dark is to cause the spouse to miss you. I think it would be to your advantage to increase Getting a Life without her.

In my case, the kids need me home.

Then why would you consider leaving without notice and gone for days?

My wife actually puts tge kids before everything,

Good, then you should be able to leave her in charge of them while you Get a Life.

[Tate]

Maybe I do not understand going dark, but I do know that the one time I traveled out if the country with our current situation, my W kissed me as I was heading out the door to the airport. That was our last kiss. It seemed that she was going to miss me.

I do agree I need to be going out and GAL in the evenings. I have two nights I must be home for the kids, then two other nights I exercise and work on my own projects. That leaves three nights to GAL. It is hard to get myself to go out on those nights...I usually spend them with the kids also. So, you all are recommending that I go out anyway on some of those nights?

[leahsue]

I think the "goodbye kiss" that you are referring to ( and if I'm wrong, toss this out, because honestly, after reading so many threads, I may have confused your sitch with someone else's)...... was more that she kissed you goodbye b/c she was FREE for a bit, not that she was going to miss you. I know that sounds harsh, but I mean it in the kindest way.

Sometimes, it just is what it is. I hope I'm wrong.

Yes, get out and get a life when you can. That is exactly what we are saying.