Oldtimer 4 years and counting

[Treasur]

I feel like I am just numb to it all. The man I married and loved and adored and vice versa has vanished.

I think that's the hardest part for many of us is accepting that our former spouse is well and truly gone. That is the case for many of us- it isn't a matter of our spouse just changing their mind and they need to change it back again, it is a situation where -they- have changed in deep and significant ways. They really are not the person we married and knew before.

Had this thought driving home today. My mother with dementia keeps asking about my H and wants him to visit. The MiL that loved and supported him for 20 years while his own mother told him what a POS he was constantly. But there's no point. The H I knew who was tender and kind and enjoyed my mother spoiling him no longer exists. He probably wouldn't care. He'd probably see it as pressure and might fear she'd give him grief. (Ironically she loves him and only knows he's been ill, she's just worried about him and wants to see him before she dies.) He definitely wouldn't do anything. Same H who was happy for me to share paying £400 a month towards his grandmother's care for 3 years and organise her 100th birthday party...pffft...counts for nothing in MLC land.

So no point. I do think, even when the rope is dropped, it's still hard now and then to wrap your head around the scale of the change in them. And why they couldn't change to be a better less crazy version! In RL, people don't get it all. Coming here helps us keep ourselves sane, I think, but it still makes my jaw drop sometimes. It is a useful reminder though that it is NOTHING to do with us or our M. It is quite possible to end a M without doing a 180 on who you are or your own values....but not in MLC land.

Sad though. My H was a really decent human being and now he isn't.

[AnotherStander]

And why they couldn't change to be a better less crazy version!

RIGHT????? I guess maybe that does happen, but the spouses who are gifted with that "awesome spouse" transformation have no need to come here to talk about it, LOL!

My H was a really decent human being and now he isn't.

I really feel sorry for those of you dealing with full-blown MLC. I went through Dante's 9 circles of hell (plus a few more for extra credit), but my XW was nothing compared to the world of crazy some of you are dealing with!

[Citygrl]

Thank you for your responses. I have been writing on everyone else's posts when I should be getting advice not trying to give it.

While I was away, I face timed husband as he was texting again in very minute panic about me now foregoing mediation. Conversation started very businesslike and told him after six months of him failing to disclose finances and his lawyer not responding to mine, I needed to protect myself.

Sometimes I always slip into the conversation that I don't get why the delay as he is the one that filed and then went for the Nisi, etc. I am always extraordinarily calm and professional. No emotion. Anyway told him what was happening and I haven't ruled out mediation but the courts would force deadlines.

Didn't tell him that I didn't really like the Mediator and was afraid New Ukrainian girlfriend was going to end up pregnant. Takes a lot for me to keep that kind of stuff in.

Conversation than turned to small talk where he told me he " ended his relationship with OW2". Of course I knew why and how it ended and he didn't mention new Ukrainian. How am I supposed to react to that info? Why does he feel the need to tell me? After a moment of silence (his trick that I am adapting) I just said something along the lines of I don't really care about that.

Conversation than turned to his parents, how "busy" he is at work (sick of hearing it) and then really fun conversation where we laughed a lot like old times. At the very end of the conversation he said how it was really nice to talk.

I hung-up not upset or confused but conflicted. Feel like he looks to me for affirmation that I can't give because as a boundary for me I can't get sucked back in to being his bestie when he is off with other women. He kind of treats me like a mother. Ick.

That is the crux of it. I have tried to be his friend but cannot reconcile doing that when he then takes OW on fab vacations and stays where we stayed, etc.

He/we are/were really good friends with his ex wife and her husband and that is not the same mutual break-up of marriage we had. He needs to be liked and I know carries so much guilt about what he did but not enough to want to change.

Could never tell the difference between cake eating and his need to be liked. There were times when he would come over and do things around the house and we would cook things for each other but going NC doesn't faze him either. I get no reading on him. Same with divorce. He files then it drags and then he does something. Soooooo confused. Any ideas?

[AnotherStander]

Conversation started very businesslike and told him after six months of him failing to disclose finances and his lawyer not responding to mine, I needed to protect myself.

Good job!

Of course I knew why and how it ended and he didn't mention new Ukrainian. How am I supposed to react to that info? Why does he feel the need to tell me? After a moment of silence (his trick that I am adapting) I just said something along the lines of I don't really care about that.

I'm guessing there's a bit of CYA going on, now that you've put him on notice that you're not just going to roll over on the D he's probably trying to give you the impression that the door is still open in the hopes that you'll go easy on him in the D. Good response!

At the very end of the conversation he said how it was really nice to talk.

I hung-up not upset or confused but conflicted.

Why were you conflicted? Did you allow his throwing you a few crumbs to give you hope that maybe things will turn around? I am convinced his motives are driven completely by his own selfishness right now. Don't fall for the act.

That is the crux of it. I have tried to be his friend but cannot reconcile doing that when he then takes OW on fab vacations and stays where we stayed, etc.

Don't you think that maybe dropping him as a friend would be the healthiest thing for YOU?

I get no reading on him. Same with divorce. He files then it drags and then he does something. Soooooo confused. Any ideas?

That does happen a lot, same with my XW. I wonder if I hadn't finally pushed the D through if we'd still be married and living separately today. Once I removed the pressure from her she just completely dropped the D. And yes, it is confusing. But it seems that way because they ARE confused. They don't know that what they're doing is the right thing. They're torn and conflicted on the inside even though they don't usually show it on the outside.

[OwnIt]

City, why do they say these things? Last time mine was here he gave me the count of his sexual partners to date (clearly a lie). Since he was a virgin when we married it is obviously a painful number since we are in fact still married. And trust me, I opened the door to nothing that would have brought that out.

I hear you on the friend thing. I think I tried that for a while for the sake of the kids and then thought, wait a minute. This guy lied to me, cheated on me repeatedly, walked out on his kids, treats me like enemy number one, constantly plays games, and is continuing to screw around without moving forward on our divorce. I would never be friends with a third party under those circumstances and this guy did these things TO ME and TO MY KIDS. No thanks.

At this point I manage a sort of snarly civility, and only then when I need something from him (which I go out of my way not to need). This was not an agreed breakup. Nothing about this was normal in my case or yours. Friendship with someone who is incapable of being a friend is not really an option.

I have a couple of things about my situation that are making it easier at present: 1) he is still paying; 2) he leaves me alone; 3) I never get the mushy, confusing stuff; 4) my lawyer does not want me to divorce him. Given these factors, I'm just living my life and letting him do the same. I've stopped interfering when he is awful to the kids and they are doing ok with it.

Although I'm a lawyer, I still don't get all this nisi and absolute stuff that you are Treasur are dealing with. My advice, do what feels emotionally right. If you don't know what that is, then do what makes your life the easiest. Don't factor his welfare in at all. Don't wish for some pie in the sky after he gets sick of eating all those sour cream laden Ukranian dishes.

[Citygrl]

Thank you both for weighing in. I really needed to bounce those feelings off. Today I am feeling creeping doubt about filing in court. Like OwnIt bills are paid, no questions asked. Now, I am going into the unknown with more costly legal bills. I keep telling myself that it is just to get the financial disclosure from him but that he will freak out and turn ugly when he sees my financial requests.

Although lawyers all say it would be good to get half, I had a new imaginary conversation in my head. Basically, when he will inevitably tell me I am asking too much, I willl turn to him and ask, "How much does it cost to start over?"

He forgets that I relocated and gave up my family, friends, and career to move here (in the middle of nowhere and very isolated) and start a new life. He is just living more of his status quo with a successful business (until it isn't when disclosure comes into play). He makes me so mad. Jerk. D#%k.

[Stuck72]

One thing I never admitted to friends or family is that I had given myself the five year MLC deadline. I know I could get hammered for admitting that even here but I had heard so many stories of the MLCer seeing the light after five years.

I looked at timelines too, but I kept pushing it out as they passed. You are done when you're done and there's nothing wrong with believing there is hope out there in the future. Timelines are bad when you get angry that your situation didn't turn around by a certain date.

Sadly, it did remind me that so many people are coupled up or have families with whom to travel. I am really good being by myself but am also very social; so, don't think I will repeat solo trip.

I had this problem too. It's too hard to go alone. Do you have a girlfriend from your old life in the states who would enjoy meeting you someplace fun? Or you could find a travel club?

Am scared at what I will find with his financial disclosure. He has been spending and now it looks like mediation not an option as I cannot trust him.

I take it he didn't show up?

While I am on my roll, will also say that I feel so much shame in my failed marriage. I don't know why.

Please cut yourself some slack. You couldn't do it alone. If you didn't see it coming, he wasn't communicating.