Hi - I'm really new to these forums but love what I'm reading here, and have MWD's book and am trying to digest as much as I can. Also have read a lot by David Schnarch and many of the concepts are very similar - so there must be something here.
My situation is this: M for almost 17 years, 2 kids (S15, D12). My parents had a blowout D when I was 14-16, both parents totally checked out. Was awful and I have always had the position that I don't want to pass on that legacy/pain to my kids, no matter what.
W is very left-brained; grew up with two parents who couldn't handle emotions, so she is very passive-aggressive and lets resentments build and build. Past year got off antidepressants which she was on for 10+ years).
She told me in late 2015, after her mom was diagnosed with terminal cancer, that she wanted a D. I told her that we need to try to work on things. We've been to MC but every time there's a disagreement, she brings up D as her default position. Mom died about a year ago, and W goes in waves of being very kind and outright hostile to me. Blames me for everything, looks for reasons to justify her angry positions.
Sex is in the crapper. Hasn't been good in a while, but it's pretty much non-existent now. When I bring it up she gets furious and tells me how much she hates me and wants a D, marriage is over. Says sex feels like rape to her. We talked about open marriage 3 months ago, but I realized that's not for me and told her.
We are both educated, have successful careers, adore our kids and have a really incredible infrastructure of couple friends, all with kids the same age.
Asked her for a lunch date on Wednesday, she spent 2 hours telling me it's over, she is so angry, she can't get past resentments, doesn't trust me, I don't trust her, will be better for our kids, she can't live like this any more, etc. I told her that I'm not on-board, this is not something I support. Keeps "asking me" for a D. But...when she got home from work, she said she bought two new chairs for our kitchen table, so we could have 6.
This weekend, she has been as pleasant as can be. We went kayaking twice together, out to breakfast afterwards, lots of family activities, went to a party last night with a ton of our friends, etc. Hasn't brought up D at all. Talks about activities we have planned together in the coming weeks. In fact she just got home from the gym and is really cheery.
I can't find any evidence that she's hired a lawyer or made any real steps to D, other than trying to push me into it, which I'm not inclined to do. No evidence of a PA either, although I have been looking.
Totally confused on what's going on. Would appreciate any thoughts and kind words on how to bust this situation!
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I think I'm dealing with a WAW situation, but I'm not totally sure, and could use some advice from you smart and experienced people here. I've been reading MWD's book, and a lot of David Schnarch's stuff, and the concepts are similar which makes me think there's something to the methodology here.
Situation: Both of us are 48, well educated, M almost 17 years, 2 kids (S15, D12) whom we both adore.
W asked for a D in late 2015, after her mom was diagnosed with cancer (had a similar bout when W was 12, she almost died then). Request was very similar to the WAW - she had thought about it a lot, sat me down, tried to walk through her vision/story of how this is going to work, and what steps we are going to take to prepare kids, etc. I asked for MC before doing anything, saying we weren't finished yet. W agreed.
W grew up the emotional one in a household of engineers/scientists that did not allow much show of emotion other than moderately happy. She was on a variety of depression meds after our kids were born, for 10 years, just stepped off of them less than a year ago.
My parents had a blowout D during the time when I was 14-16, both were totally unavailable to me. Was a disaster, actually. Promised myself I would never bring that kind of carnage on my kids, and I am constantly praised (including by W) on what a great dad I am.
We have been through some MC, which hasn't been so great. She keeps the conversation on her wanting to be D, I want us to build and move forward. I've been in IC which has been really good for me. Her mom died a little over a year ago, which was really hard for her.
Sex life has been minimal at best for the past several years. Some my fault, some hers, but now it's to the point where she is so angry when I bring it up, just broaching the topic brings her to come back to the D conclusion.
We went to lunch on Wednesday (a rare thing) after we had a date on Tuesday and I suggested sex in a somewhat humorous way. At lunch she was furious and once again "asked for" a D, marriage is over, we're done, I'm through, you're to blame, etc, etc. 2 hours of this. I remained very calm.
Then she came home and said that she bought 2 new dining room chairs to complete our set.
This weekend (Labor Day) she has been a dream to live with. We went kayaking on Sat and Sun, out to breakfast, did things with the kids as a family, went to a party with a ton of really good friends...things couples do. She got home from the gym incredibly chipper and has been very pleasant and engaging. She's talking about things in our future.
No PA that I'm aware of, and I've looked really hard. She says the problem is me, not anything extracurricular. Can't find any evidence that she's hired an attorney, either.
I have no idea what's going on, or how to fight through this. Seems to me that people who want out don't do the things that she's doing. So many mixed messages. Help!
Thanks Cadet - I apologize if there was a double entry on this topic, didn't realize that the forum doesn't post right away.
I love these links and will read all of them. The thing I'm struggling with the most is our kids...they aren't privvy to any of this, and although I want to GAL and detach, I want to be there for them, and I'm not sure how to balance it all.
I want to think that's where her fog will be lifted...if this ever gets to the point where we talk to the kids, they will shatter her visions of how "fine" they will be. She has no idea, but I do, because I've lived it.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Regarding Wonka's reply - yes. W already thinks I'm too controlling and sees efforts to improve myself as manipulation (it isn't of course). Book is hidden, copies were given to both of us by our MC, who basically fired us after that.
She saw me furiously typing earlier, asked what I was doing, told her it was work stuff. She's curious.
She saw me furiously typing earlier, asked what I was doing, told her it was work stuff. She's curious.
If you don't want her discovering your posts, I suggest you give her no reason to hunt for them. Know what I mean? It would be better if you left the house to do your posting, rather than furiously typing away while in front of her. Don't underestimate what she'll do.
At this point, it's a little early to know what's going on with her. I suggest you do nothing that puts emotional pressure on her. Every time you take a step toward her, she will take a step back.
Look at the 37 rules to get you get you started.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I want to think that's where her fog will be lifted...if this ever gets to the point where we talk to the kids, they will shatter her visions of how "fine" they will be. She has no idea, but I do, because I've lived it.
If she comes from a broken home I wouldn't count on it. The kids didn't stand in my W's way, she chose to still leave and even told me she knew she was being selfish and the kids are resiliant they we will be great because we will be the best co-parents ever.
Sandi - Thanks. BTW your posts are fantastic and an unbelievably helpful perspective.
Re: "Do nothing that puts emotional pressure on her. Every time you take a step toward her, she will take a step back."
Yes. I've seen this live and in action. But when I step away, the response seems to be "see, I was right, he's an a$$hole and is not available, so I'm justified in getting out."
My gut tells me that the right thing to do is to be a beacon of light for the kids, and a strong rock for the family. But I can't tell if that's naive and the exact wrong thing to do.
I'm hanging out with a buddy tonight but haven't told her my plans, which is highly unusual for me.
