New to the journey and thank you.

[AnotherStander]

In my mind, that's what you do when you love someone; and I don't have "walls". What does that even mean?

You will have walls up after this experience, and lowering them again for W or another will be a real challenge. Walls are for self-preservation. It's not really something you do consciously which is why it's so hard to "lower" them.

Then later in the R she alludes to the fact that her walls are back up. I think this is stupid, and get a little miffed, but don't make much of it either.

It's a huge red flag when someone says that.

She is basically narrating to me the borderline traits relationship roadmap! Pull the other in close like it is the best R ever, then push them away to keep them from hurting you.

I keep laughing at all the stuff it took me to 40 to figure out...

Interesting reaction, I don't find it funny at all. My GF told me her walls were back up after we had been dating over a year and I took it very seriously. We worked on our communications and had some deep conversations and eventually months later she said she felt safe enough that they were lowered again. Next time someone says that to you then look at it as a big warning sign that says "BD coming" and try to get things back on track.

[Treasur]

My H talked about 'walls' too. Usually it's about fear.

And AS is right, we all have walls now after life has given us a kicking and people we trusted have hurt us. We'd be dumb if we didn't. I never used to have them really, or only tiny ones. It's a real conscious effort to not let the wall become too big or have it with people other than my STBXH. I try to change the wall (fear) to a boundary (self-respect) if I can.

[Treasur]

Oh, and other peoples' fears are hardly ever about us (unless we're abusive asshats!)

[Kylo]

Well, now I know a little more about walls! I'll be much more clued in to all kinds of emotional signs in a relationship. This could make the next one miserable for her! I find it funny/ slightly embarrassing that I could be told it was my fault every time and it took me 13 years to realize how out of whack that was.

I got upset all through the marriage with the arguments that didn't resolve; and I thought I was right most of the time, but I never realized something was awry on a different level.

[Treasur]

What do you think was awry, Kylo?

[Kylo]

I just meant that there had to be more to it for every marital problem to be my fault. I didn't see the pattern. It took some very in-my-face contradictions and twisting that made me look back and realize every problem we had was my fault.

The friend I went out with last night was divorced and I didn't know why. It turns out his wife was never wrong and the counselor told him his wife was a narcissist. It was good to talk about his sitch and what he went through

[Kylo]

I don't know how good I'll be at DB when it comes to talking with my W. I never think of what I should be doing until after it's over.
I have taken it upon myself to get the kids to Sunday school at 9:30, when our normal time has been 11:00. So I mention the plan for tomorrow, and she gets upset about the late notice (understandable) and how she can't do it now. (She is off-duty after the kids go to bed and won't do anything other than watch TV in bed). She seemed stressed all day which is a recipe for problems... So I have little patience with her, but I'm coming at it like: I just want to know what you're doing so I can plan what I'm doing with a side of clam down. She keeps up the flustered act and I tell her I'll just work around it and end it with a "nobody cares". I know, very bad. I just really don't care about her stressing about washing her hair and getting up early for 9:30 church. I just don't.

It is hard for me to have positive feelings for someone who doesn't have them for me. She walked into the same restaurant I was at on Friday. My dad pointed her out and I just let out a sigh and hoped she wouldn't see us, but she did.

Anyway, back to DB: hoo boy, I $uck.

[Holding]

Kylo, I can completely sympathize with what you're feeling. The phase you're in is something I call "What the heck is the point?" You're probably in the neighborhood of dropping the rope, if you haven't gotten there yet.

On the subject of walls, I'll admit this is something I used to do when my W would hurt me. She was full of hurtful comments. I know I should have confronted her about them more directly, but I was very conflict avoidant. At least for me, I realized that walls keep people from hurting me, but they also trapped in all of my feelings and drowned me in resentment.

Anyway, walls are bad.

[Kylo]

A specific question: What do I say to her when she asks me about her appearance, or how should I say it? I'm thinking I just say "You look nice." and leave it at that.

She came up to me today before she went to a birthday party and asked me if her arms looked buff, (she was going to a party for a yoga studio owner). At first I gave her a "yeah, they're OK kind of shrug" (which was the absolute truth about what I thought about them: not that impressive). She looked disappointed and walked away. I felt like I was being too cold instead of happy, so I told her to come back and show me again. She flexed and I said "dayaaam!" She smiled and liked it.

I know this is a small thing, but I think I'll be in this situation 10-20 more times. Good, bad? She still pretty much hates me. I feel like no one wants to be around a downer, or someone who makes you feel bad. The downside is if you come across as too "into them". Which brings me back to a middle-of-the-road: "you look nice".

[Kylo]

This whole thing seems to be tearing my dad up more than me. I keep telling him it is a long process, but he keeps hoping I can report signs of reconciliation. He's getting angry and frustrated. It's nice of him but he doesn't need anymore stress to deal with.

I asked the wife if she wanted to see a video review of the car we are considering and she snapped "No! I want to write this speech!" My anger spiked, but at least I kept it to an under my breath "What a bish". Another reminder that I don't have patience to give.

I'm happy that some of my friends seem concerned and offer advice, but none of it meshes with DB. My friend asked me if I was still attracted to her, and I told him that she was the prettiest 40-year old I know. He asks me if I have told her that. Ha! So then their off-base advice just kind of makes you feel more alone. All the time I have spent learning about MLC and BPD traits and literally no one else I know will understand it.