New to the journey and thank you.

[Kylo]

Thanks for the reminder Joe. You take in so much info it can be hard to remember. I like always happy!

I was starting to think the wife may never move this forward, but she has mentioned twice getting financial info together in the last few days. However, this is a far cry from actually sitting down with me to discuss. She has big plans until the work needed to do them comes around.

I talked to the MIL today (she needed advice). It was funny because she kept mentioning how she was always treated so poorly by my wife. Essentially turning it back to poor her. "See what I've dealt with all these years?"

1. Uh, we're talking about my divorce here.

2. It is true that my W has treated her mother like crap; but I think the two divorces, piss poor parenting, and the NPD had something to do with it!

I actually get along with the MIL just fine.

[Kylo]

I talked to the MIL again today, and it's funny how someone not familiar with a MLC ask questions. It's tedious to answer.

Anyway, she tells me how she hopes W and I can be friends. She relates how she wanted to kill her first husband at the time of their D, but now values him as a dear friend.

I can see what will happen in my head. When I get over this, since the kids are involved, I'll be fine around her. But when I think about it now, why would I want a friend who breaks promises, is illogical, feels in competition with me, tries to bring me down by never saying anything positive, and was willing to hurt my kids because she couldn't control her emotions?

I'm going to an IC next week to get some insight, assess my odds, find out what I need to fix.

[OwnIt]

I'm there with you. I will never be friends with mine. The lying, cheating, and child abandonment are too much. I don't care how much he might turn his life around from here, the destruction is too great. I don't wish him ill, I just don't want him in my life in any capacity. My kids can make their own choices.

[AndrewP]

Kylo - thanks for the visit to my thread.

Yeah - the whole "we'll still be friends" thing. I've not read back in your thread to see if that was a factor with your W or not or just with your MIL.

I think that this is something that a very lot of us are baffled by / trying to cope with. Coly23 I know has a similar thing going on (waves) but maybe not quite the same. I've been here for a bit though and I've seen it as a very common theme.

It may be part of the whole "I didn't do anything wrong and you should continue being the person you always where while I ran off to dance with the fairies" thing that seems to happen to quite a number of our former partners.

In my case she brought this up a few times when she was home and as she was leaving. I wasn't hugely surprised when it came up during the separation meeting even though to me it was hugely off-topic.

It has set me off "spinning" for the first time in a while though asking myself what would it take for me to be "friends". I just don't see that happening. For me to even come around a bit she'd have to be honest with the kids etc about what happened. They know the basics from me now. I am positive that she won't do it though. She'll want me to buy into her own narrative which currently may be what she told her lawyer that there "was" no affair and that she hooked up after she left which perhaps she believes herself. Anyone with half a brain and was around knows that to not be true. The smug looks and petty actions which she used to use to control me are all still there though. I'm just more resistant to them now but it turns out not completely.

I can't see being friends with someone who won't own up to their actions. I'd call it mistakes but she may not look at it that way. There are a bunch of other things too that would be required to make her look like a half-decent human being to me again as well.

Will I be able to be "civil" to her? I was during the meeting but it is and probably will be the sort of civility I would give to someone who ran over my cat and drove off but then pretended that nothing happened when I saw them on the street.

Sigh

Sorry for the possible thread-jack and thanks again for the visit.

[Kylo]

To simplify it: Be a good friend to me, and we will be friends!

At this point, they aren't being good friends.

[Kylo]

So I'm liquored at the end of the night listening to Sheryl Crow circa college (what happened to her?), and I'm thinking of all the deep conversations we never had. She never wanted to wade out of the kiddie pool. I don't think we were too old to have lost our starry eyed hope for the future. It would be nice to have someone who could talk about more than gossip. Maybe having no basis does this to a person.

[Kylo]

That last post wasn't helpful... Anyway, I went with a friend to a bar to watch the big fight last night. I didn't have much interest in the fight, but it was fun being around a bunch of people who were into it.

I'm hungover and feel awful, but I still got the kids to Sunday School.

I think when I go out, it is the only thing that can make her feel anything, or at least makes her show some feeling. She stumbled across "be careful" as I left the house. Going out is the only thing she asks about. And she decided today at the last minute to go to a concert tonight. I know this doesn't mean much other than I need to keep going out.

[Kylo]

Need some clarification/help: Trying to Detach I think is making me cold to her. I still need to be nice and happy. I think I'm taking it too far for the sake of detachment. I'm thinking I should go ahead and bring myself, upbeat and happy, and if it runs into pursuing, so be it? And by running over, I mean a question or sentence too many (nothing about the R). Basically living my life how I want, and she just happens to be living here.

[TBSakaJ9]

Kylo see below. When I am around my W I act normal like nothing is wrong. I try to be happy, upbeat and always looking good! I don't think happy and upbeat is considered pursuing I think if nothing else it will probably confuse her and make her wonder why you are so happy when she just dropped a bomb on you.

Healthy Detachment, Part 1.

I. Detachment

Detachment is critical to the process of altering and repairing a relationship.

Attached, we take personally ALL that is said, not said, done and not done.

When our ego gets wounded, we are more inclined to do/say things that undermine our goals.

When we are Detached from the actions of another, we can meet anger or indifference with love.

Met with love, we are in a position to diffuse the situation, and transform it in a way that will be in alignment with our goals.

On the flipside, detachment allows us to play it cool when we do get a positive reaction from our spouse. It is a way to break the distance/pursuer cycle.

Detachment is not withdrawal. It is not indifference. It is not the mind saying, ‘I am not getting what I want - so I must pull back.’

(*Though there may be a time in which You DO seek withdrawal & indifference, it's not now).*

It is the natural acceptance that we alone are responsible for how we act. We cannot control another person, but we can control how we respond to them.

We are responsible for our own actions (no one else is).

We are responsible for our own happiness. (No one else is)


PART II Detachment

Detachment is the:

* Ability to allow S the freedom to be him/herself.

* Holding back from the need to rescue, save or fix S from being sick, dysfunctional or irrational.

* Giving S "the space" to be him/herself.

* Disengaging from an over-enmeshed or dependent relationship with S.

* Accepting that I cannot change or control S and it was never my "duty/job" to do so.

* Establishing of emotional boundaries between me and S, so that both of us might be able to develop our own sense of autonomy and independence.

* Process by which I am free to feel my own feelings when I see S falter and fail and not to feel responsible for his/her failure, faltering or learning.

* Ability to maintain an emotional bond of love, concern and caring, without the negative results of rescuing, enabling, fixing, demanding or controlling.

* Ability to exercise emotional self-protection and prevention so as not to hang on beyond a reasonable and rational point.

* Ability to let people I love and care for accept personal responsibility for their own actions and to bail them out when their actions lead to failure or trouble for them.

* Ability to allow S to be who he/she "really is" rather than who I "want him/her to be."

[Kylo]

Thanks Joseph. I have some parts of detachment down, but was missing the "love" in the equation.

I came home happy today (with this newfound freedom to be happy and detached) and I think she was surprised and liked it. Thinking back on it, I realize how she is usually not happy. Never is there laughter from her, and almost never a smile. I know from earlier she said she didn't like being here and wanted to get out.

I have plans for Friday with a friend who is divorced, so I hope for some insight and a good time. As an added benefit, this guy is a real lady killer. I have had a decent number of friends that were elite in this area, but this guy is the pinnacle. Hopefully I get some reflected glory to boost my ego.

In the meantime, I've been reminding my boys how much I love them. I've done this all along, but I'm making it a little more clear now. I'm hoping this can carry them through when the D drops. In a way, I think they are getting used to do things with one parent at a time, so maybe the transition won't be so hard.