25yearsMLC - 10 years later I FILE D

[Tryin2figuritout]

or maybe his feelings changed and he's justifying crap behavior by extensive marital revision
[/color]

Extensive marital revision... man, do I love this statement... All I've heard about is all the misery throughout the years and please don't discount my awareness of my flaws and contributions to the bad stuff.

As a LBS, it's so hard to hear some of the venom that spews when the WAS is in walk away mode. Will there be a point where the dust settles. Not sure.

25 - Hope you have a great day today and continue your journey to peace.

[25yearsmlc]

[quote]I feel shame that I could be such a fool, that things were not as I believed and WTF is wrong with me not to see?! This is something I'll explore in T.

Why do you see yourself as being a fool? B/c H lied and deceived you? B/c you feel you should have been smarter or quicker in seeing the truth?

In all my resentment, and other forms of anger, I don't remember thinking of my H as a fool for not catching on to my affair sooner. In fact, I believed his complete trust in me was hiding the truth much better than my attempts of covering my affair. I am ashamed, but will admit, that I knew I was taking full advantage of his trust.



feeling like a fool, maybe this is a natural reaction to learning you have been deceived by the one who is suppose to love you the most. If this person had been someone else connected in some other way.......your intelligence and keen intuition would have alerted you. Please don't beat yourself up for trusting the man you married. ((25)). That is what we are taught to do. That is the vows that were made.

I doubt your H will show any outward signs of regretting his choices as long as he is running wild in his waywardness. You mentioned pride.


Sandi, thank you for all of this b/c I need it more than I would have thought.

H is telling the world how happy he is. He is exposing and claiming it's not an affair, obviously b/c "25 & i parted ways..." was said on fb before we parted (unknown to me).

Now Posting on fb that he is "in a relationship" and calling her his new "honey" and introducing her to the family...all on fb.

About a year ago we saw someone post things on FB that were just too private to expose and sounded silly and inappropriate. Poor taste. We had both found it distasteful in the past. Neither of us understood it and he high fived me when I said I'd "never do something like that, it's goofy and way too much information." So now he's doing it. ugh!

And yeah we are still married so...

When I am objective and take my ego out of it and my wounded heart, I do think it's odd behavior. My 23 y/o niece told my sister "it's not a normal post for any age, but for a man his age, it's just weird. Not to mention we know he's still married. It's weird and So over the top..."

There is something overcompensating about it, AND OR deliberately meant to harm me.

A wage garnishment had been attached to his pay about a week beforehand. He threatened to quit his job to avoid paying. So I'm sure he was not happy about that, in fact I know he wasn't. I'm pretty sure he does not see a connection between his zero communication w/me about money, and the need for a garnishment.

(I want predictability so I can budget. And I didn't really know about OW when that happened).

He either meant to slap me back, publicly, or he's truly oblivious and goofy, and I don't care which, b/c both options stink.

So the "exposure" is from him, not me. I remain publicly silent. I'm also not the type to do exposure of an A for the reasons you and I have discussed at length here. And b/c a small part of me wants to know that he is, someday, regretful about this. It's a $hitty way to end a long m, for sure.

When I was told that he listed the date they met as the day after I filed, I smh and managed an actual laugh. (Honestly, it only makes it slightly less insane).

Sandi I do not expect any regrets to be expressed at all, or at least not to me. I wish, but In fact he's not the type to look back much and say he 'screwed up",

but he is the type to blame me for "ruining the finances"...yes he is sooo proud.

HOWEVER, I'm told by informed sources that when it comes to talking to his L, "h seems distracted and unable to focus, except to complain about paying stbxw. Hard time staying on track and has disorganized thoughts..."

Sandi, this^^ both disturbs me and - I confess, delights me.

The disturbing part is b/c I'm a decent person and don't want mental illness to be his destiny.
I still care, and he's the father of my children.

The "delights me" part, of which I am not proud, is

1) obviously b/c I want to point to it as an explanation for his choosing the tundra and OW over me.

And 2) I think it makes me feel that all is not perfect in paradise. Not about OW probably but b/c

3) **I cannot wrap my brain around h being "totally happy" (so public about it) with zero contact with me and almost no contact with our children, few of our long term friends, none of my huge family - whom he loved, the loss of half the assets and far more than he apparently expected to lose, (for someone who thought this was "coming for a long time", he certainly did not plan out the details)...seems to have mostly new Alaskan friends who "like" his fb posts and praise him.

So knowing that at least some of this is uncomfortable for him, helps me not delude myself into thinking this was a breeze for him. That "all is GREAT now" (now that I've been replaced ) that image he is projecting - mightily and in everyone's face-- that is possibly the most frightening for me.

B/c it makes me feel very small. Like I wasted decades of my life being loyal to someone who didn't value it much at all.

**
Anyhow, yes, yes H is a proud proud man. That is another problem with his presentation to the world or at least up there. How could he ever "regret" his choices?

How can he retract his "New honey" from his world, now? Granted, we are not divorced and all those pesky details.

I think he's cornering himself into marrying her. Or plans to. And h sees nothing risky about that. Nothing rushed or odd, as it seems h has almost no self awareness or concern about how it looks to others, including to our children. He tries to talk about OW to them, and I'm told it bothers him that they are not interested in hearing about her.

Objectively speaking, that^^ is just weird. Looking back, I now see that H never saw himself as "leaving our family" when he went to do a fellowship, or when he went alone to Alaska the first time.

He'd say he was "just up the road" for the fellowship (300 miles) and was "just checking out a job" when he spent a year in Alaska, alone. That's convenient for him, but out of touch.

So, as our son said, he "substitutes his reality for ours"...and my gosh, that is true.

God, I was blind.

[Thornton]

Try not to beat yourself up, 25.

You did everything you could to repair your marriage and you did. But H has issues that you have no control over that are manifesting in his life.

And honestly, I dont buy that H is happy for one minute. He slapped a band-aid (OW) to try to minimize the feelings he was having. The way he is publicly trying to show everyone how great his life is, speaks volumes to me. Overcompensation at it's finest.

As I'm sure you know, this R is very likely to blow up.

How did your therapy session go yesterday?

[OwnIt]

Try googling is the narcissist happy with the new woman. As I recall, you don't like labels, but this is exactly what they do. This may sound awful, along the lines of your confession to Sandi, but to see you go through the same emotions as the rest of us mere mortals is such a reminder about how all of this is so difficult and life-changing no matter how much you know and have lived through. The difference for you is that you are intelligent, compassionate, knowledgable and experienced. You will cycle through this faster than the rest of us. The short answer is no, he is not happier with the new woman. When people are truly happy, they don't need to broadcast it on FB.

[sandi2]

Sandi, would you mind writing a little bit more on pride for all of us?

I should have been more clear in the choice of words, so thanks for bringing it to my attention. I was not referring to a more healthy type of pride we feel from our accomplishments, or proud of our family, etc. I don't "think" I was prideful, in a vain sense of speaking, before my A.

I certainly was not proud of my behavior related to my affair. I think the term I should have used is "stubborn pride". We've all probably had elder relatives who struggled with some level of stubborn pride in their older years (not cooperating with what was best for them, etc).

Mainly, I am referring to myself as having stubborn pride, b/c I did not want my sin exposed. And, b/c I felt no remorse. I wanted my behavior to remain a secret, so my reputation would not be tarnished. And, as crazy as this now sounds, I did not want to disappoint people who saw me as some type of role model. (It is the wayward mindset that has these selfish, irrational thoughts). When it all hit the fan, I informed my H if he ever told my kids what I did, I'd hate him to the day I died. It was my way of trying to control the fallout of my actions.

I googled "stubborn pride", and this is part of the definition: "It can be manifest as a reluctance to apologize or take responsibility for your own actions". So, that's a light description of me after my H"s confrontation about the affair. Even when I ended the A and decided to do the right thing and stay in my M.........it seem to take me forever to reach the place of remorse. I would not humble myself and ask for my H's forgiveness b/c of stubborn pride in my heart. Not proud of my actions, but in my heart I wanted to blame my H for how he failed me for so many years. Where there is so much resentment, bitterness, and loss of respect toward the LBH......it is very difficult for the WW to let go of it and forgive her H. Our old natural/sinful side wants to hold on to all of that negative stuff in the past, and somehow try to justify our own terrible actions. It prevents a person from feeling true remorse.

Being raised as a Christian, I knew what I should do........but the stubborn pride held me back. I was holding on to the anger I had for my H. I even prayed that God would help me get to that place of feeling remorse. B/c I had to get right with God, then get right with my H. Every time I prayed, my mind would be filled with the issues that caused my anger. Finally, I understood that I would not feel remorse for my actions, until I could forgive my H of the past. That was tough, but I'm sure not any more so than my H forgiving me. When I let go and forgave my H for the past.....the remorse for what I had done to him hit, and I thought it would kill me. I don't know how one could feel true remorse without humility. When I finally went to him, I was broken hearted for what I had done to him, and to our M. You can't be that angry at someone and feel remorse for betraying them, b/c the anger prevents the humility.

I believe it is wrong to accept a so-called apology for having an affair that just says, "I made a mistake".....as if to brush it off and pick up where the the MR left off. An affair is not a mistake, as if making a typo. It was a conscious decision made from a free will. (The fact that the person was vulnerable, or whatever, makes no difference in getting the heart right toward the one that was betrayed. In fact, being vulnerable, angry, or whatever, just gives more self justification for having an affair). It should take more than just a simple "Sorry you got hurt" to the betrayed spouse. There should be evidence of a change in attitude and behavior. The apology should show obvious sorrow & humility. If there is no evidence of changed behavior, then I would doubt the sincerity of a changed heart.

I don't know that I've explain my process a little better.

Thanks to 25, for using space on your thread.

[BluWave]

I have very little time at the moment, but I had to jump in. This thread is fantastic. Sandi, my H has said so much of what you write, almost identical. One of the main reasons it took him so long to end the A and come back to the M was his stubborn pride, which was his worst enemy. (I also did not DB or pave the way. Not at all). In fact I can recall several conversations we had--while he was gone and after he came back--that were very similar to your post. He felt the same way, and it was a constant internal struggle.

I also appreciate what you wrote to TxHub, but I wonder if you have done enough self exploration? Admittedly I have had reservations about my M and have viewed my H as "tainted" in some way too. It is much simpler to keep him in the blame, than look at myself and where I went wrong. Since he came back, he has done everything he can to make it work. The A was such a huge assault and what led to the separation, so it was the main focus. So while nothing I did justified his A and leaving, I must better understand how and where things fell apart. I have blamed OW a lot, but really, it was him that left me, not her. If things were better in the M, he would not have been vulnerable to the A to begin with.

I know if I want this M to work--and to genuinely reconnect with him, not just function well-- then I must focus on my side of the street. That is all I can control anyhow. He has said more than once that he "feels beneath me." It doesn't behoove me at all, or my M, to keep (subconsciously) him beneath me. That is not how I want him to feel either because I care about him. I know that in my head logically, and I hope I can get my heart on board soon. I don't believe I could have a successful reconciliation without truly understanding and forging H for the A. That will only come if I can understand why he became vulnerable to it in the first place.

Wish I didn't have to run back to work, but had to chip in.

Thank you for this conversation!
Blu

[25yearsmlc]

Try not to beat yourself up, 25.

You did everything you could to repair your marriage and you did. But H has issues that you have no control over that are manifesting in his life.

I understand this^^, and agree with it, mostly. I didn't realize how resentful h must have been at me or his life, to have justified leaving 10 years ago, (though he never faced that it was he had done). And he was very repressed the past year with lots of dark parts I may not ever know...wish we had explored it, yada yada yada

So that's stuff I WISH we had done but que sera sera.

The other piece is my own personal work, including things I became complacent about, which I can discuss more later. But in sum,

I have to get out of h's head and keep him out of mine, or I'll stall out and spiral.

That's a big immediate need of mine now.


And honestly, I dont buy that H is happy for one minute. He slapped a band-aid (OW) to try to minimize the feelings he was having. The way he is publicly trying to show everyone how great his life is, speaks volumes to me. Overcompensation at it's finest.

Well, I know My h cannot be alone for long. (In contrast, I never have lived alone, till now. I'm fine with it so far).

Yes The way he posts on fb is, at best, weird as he11.

No it's Not the behavior of a content adult, let alone someone with children, or friends who had no idea we had split, and of course, let alone a spouse to whom they are still married and who deserves better. Clearly he's furious at me, which is on one hand, mind boggling, and on the other hand, totally logical in h's world.

Time will tell what role his very stubborn pride has, since evidently several people have told him they don't get the whole Alaskan thing and to slow the A down, to no avail,

or maybe he's nuts

or maybe she's the perfect fit for the new h...



As I'm sure you know, this R is very likely to blow up.


I hear you, (& my ego likes hearing that, I admit)

and while it's statistically likely to end, I'm forced to ask, so what?

B/c I cannot imagine us apart forever, and yet I cannot imagine taking him back.



How did your therapy session go yesterday?

New therapist was today and she's a Godsend.

Talked about everything from my mom dying, to having the last child leave for college, hearing a murder & finding the victim,

to moving for h's job, again, to "Alaska 2.0," and OW,

to my illness/implications, to h's AWOL and now here we are...

it's a lot - and it was condensed into 16 months and she got me to realize

I have permission to not have this all figured out yet.

Here is what I "Know".


H did not treat me well or how I deserved, for X amount of the past, and he sure isn't now. While I regret our m ending, I do not regret filing for D, given the situation.

H is responsible for his r's with our children. I won't ever hinder those r's, but I will never explain for him, again.

Goals for now

Learn to accept that my marriage is over and that I will be fine, anyhow.

*Yes, yes, I know of course that MIGHT change, in theory.

(It'd take years of work on his end just for me to know of any change in him, let alone to piece. Besides, if it happens I'll cross that bridge then.)

I cannot get to the other side of this ordeal if I keep looking over my shoulder to see what h is doing or thinking or feeling.

H cannot be a factor in any of my choices anymore

Embrace that this^^ reality is actually freeing.

How can I best take care of myself right now?

[Thornton]

It appears to me that you are doing everything you can to process this loss and begin to accept it for what it really is.

Thanks for continuing to post. I often try to mirror what you are doing for yourself (when I'm not obsessing, of course).

[25yearsmlc]

Try googling is the narcissist happy with the new woman. As I recall, you don't like labels, but this is exactly what they do.

I will google it b/c hey, we all have our wounded ego moments and fears. FWIW, it was my youngest child who labeled h a narcissist and I balked. Anyhow Thanks



This may sound awful, along the lines of your confession to Sandi, but to see you go through the same emotions as the rest of us mere mortals is such a reminder about how all of this is so difficult and life-changing no matter how much you know and have lived through.

yes it is. Even when you "know" you will be alright, there are dark nights of the soul for each of us.

Nights when our worst fears about ourselves OR about our future, take hold

b/c our cognitive guard is down when we sleep or dig too deep into our own shadows...
and we have to climb back up and out of our hole to see the light again.

The difference for you is that you are intelligent, compassionate, knowledgable and experienced. You will cycle through this faster than the rest of us.

Thank you.

Having DB'd before, I said then that I'd never go through this again. I knew for me it was a once in a lifetime ordeal.

And while some of the emotions are the same, the 2 additional pieces are that A) it's better b/c I really will cycle through this faster and not waste nearly the same mount of time on things I have no control over

2) it's worse b/c i cannot believe it's happened again and b/c I see almost no chance of a recon again. That's regardless of what h feels or wants down the road, too. Which is sad


The short answer is no, he is not happier with the new woman. When people are truly happy, they don't need to broadcast it on FB.

OMG so true.

WACKY GOOD THING today...so on my way to the therapist office I found $40, just bills and looked around for anyone walking near me. Nope, no one.

Okay, thanks, universe. So then I meet the T and she's great and helpful.

So then I go to the grocery store (driving my sweet car which I've soooo missed)

and I meet the same cute guy in the store, the one who walked my groceries home last week, twice.

He's very attractive & warm. My peeps have teased me about him being my "new bf".

So today I'm pretty sure he asked me out. (Yeah, I'm rusty but he for sure is interested).

Yes, I KNOW I'm not ready to be in a r.

But dang, I am ready to have a cute guy ask me out. And it was really flattering.

Today was a lucky day.

[25yearsmlc]

It appears to me that you are doing everything you can to process this loss and begin to accept it for what it really is.

Thanks for continuing to post. I often try to mirror what you are doing for yourself (when I'm not obsessing, of course).

So, your day is 1) "do what 25 said she is GOING to do, then

2) obsess

??

Sigh...I relate. Sometimes I think my time is spent this way

1) "do what you tell others to do (take my own advice)

and then

2) rehash all former obsessions, sprinkled with new updated ones, ignoring own advice."