10 Years Later - From a DB'er

[Vanilla]

Hmmmmm

Maybe not knowing what you want means not getting anywhere!

And that scarey stuff, well that's letting it be known you don't want!

A great girl is going to have to do some hard work, meet her half way.

V

[kml]

KML I honestly had no idea you do some drumming when I wrote that response. All that more funny though but I truly had no idea

Hahahaha - the entire rhythm section just gets no respect

[DonH]

Vanilla, clearly not knowing what I may want is contributing to not really going anywhere. Makes total sense. However, the "scary stuff" is the fact that I may not know what I want - that's scaring me more than anything.

It's been an interesting week. I've spent way too much time reading through the many threads here. Really has taken me back and not in a good way. There is just so much hurt so much of this BS. It just goes on and on and on. How did we (I) and the world get here?

As for me, the simple answer is I want to be happy. Well, duh, who doesn't? Second in line, I don't want to work this hard to be happy. Maybe I was just lucky for most of my life???? It really was never this much work. I just LIVED. That was it - LIVED LIFE. Even when I look way back before I had any clue what DBing was - I did it. I was an incredible DB'r just by some natural means. If someone I was interested in did the things WAW or other did I went on with my life, didn't even think about it and things worked out - often like I'd had hoped. It's only later that after learning all of this that I looked back and could see, "Oh yeah, I did that, that's why whatever happened happened." It's like it was explained.

These days it just seems so much harder. One of the things I think that may be driving it is in my 20s, 30s even some of my 40s I really didn't worry about the future. I had more than half my life to go - well more than. That's not the case anymore. I think that's what is scaring me the most. If that was not the case I don't think I'd care near as much. I just don't want to get to the end not having that kind of love again and it sure looks like that's where I'm headed.

Just trying to get more thoughts out. Hope that's the case.

[Maybell]

It really was never this much work. I just LIVED. That was it - LIVED LIFE.
...
I just don't want to get to the end not having that kind of love again and it sure looks like that's where I'm headed.

How are you going to know what you want if you don't just live your life? Otherwise you're just stuck in your head going round and round in circles.

Here's how I got where I am -- which is meant to be descriptive, not prescriptive.

There are certain ways I behaved with Mr. Fantastic that I now recognize took me so far away from the way I wanted to be. I chose him based on qualifications that my parents kind of set when I was growing up (we married when I was 25 and he was 23) which assumed that people have really consistent values. When we broke up, I finally acknowledged that his values and mine are not at all similar. So that was the first thing I knew I wanted, someone whose values match mine.

The second thing was, there are things in my life that always felt off-limits. I made those things mentally possible for myself, and then I decided that I wanted someone who would help me make them part of my life. It's similar to the values thing, but a little more practical.

The third thing was, I want someone who wants their life to be richer in the ways that I am capable of providing. Mr. Fantastic wanted a Brazilian-waxed sex-bunny who will match him drink for drink. That isn't me. I have something to offer a guy who wants to be cherished and nurtured and who values physical and emotional connection. That's part of knowing who I am.

You seem to me to be holding so tight to life. Would it help to let go a little and look around you more? There's something out there for you but if you look too hard for it you may look in the places where it's not.

[DonH]

"Would it help to let go a little and look around you more? There's something out there for you but if you look too hard for it you may look in the places where it's not."

Maybell, I'm not sure I fully understood everything you were saying but I totally understand what you're saying at the end and quoted above. That's the thing though - that's what I did pretty much from 2006-2012. During that time I dated a little, had one 6 month R but that was it. After the second R from the end of 2012 to summer 2013 afterwards I knew it was time and I wanted more. I did the same as I did previously (just let it all come to me and happen) but NOTHING. It was then everyone suggested that I needed to "put myself out there" or "try online dating" or "you need to try a little harder" or even "You may need to lower your standards a bit" I figured they may be right so I started trying harder, accepting more people, etc. I also did some of the GAL and personal things. The net result is what I've been describing here and is what has now been causing me this angst. The harder I try the worse I feel and honesty the results are the same.

- So then do I just leave it up to luck or to fate?

- Have I changed over how I was in earlier life? Is that's what the problem is?

- Is it my age bracket now? I was married at 38 so most of my previous "success" was from about 20-35. Is that part of it - women post D in their 40s and 50s are not like those I dated in their 20s and 30s? It seemed those in their 20s and 30s are much more interested in dating - those in later life, not so much.

I have so much to give. I have the time and the money to not only date but travel, etc. And I do those things, I really do - planning another trip for October right now. I'm booked tonight, tomorrow, Monday, Wednesday and Friday of next week so far. But it's just getting really old doing all of it by myself.

[Vanilla]

OK Don

So what exactly do you want?

And happy is far too general.

V

[DonH]

As I said above Vanilla, I'm starting to think I don't know what I want. I'm admitting that. I agree with you that "to be happy" is too general and was trying to elude to that as well by saying that's pretty much what anyone wants. I want someone that I can cannot with and do things with beyond a purely friend basis. That doesn't mean we have to be sleeping together but I don't hold hands, snuggle or romantically kiss as an example, any of my friends and miss that. At this point I'd even do that with someone I'm not totally into in hopes "lowering my standards" helps.

Performed at our state fair today. People everywhere. What I mostly see are couples, married people and couples, dating, on a date, whatever but couples. Again, getting sick of it.

Then run into the friend that introduced me to one of my recent dates. You could have picked me up off the floor when she told me this friend is "interested." I'm like, huh? The girl who usually doesn't initiate texts, sometimes doesn't respond at all, then out of the blue contacts me to go out and gets weird and abruptly leaves at the end - that friend? She's INTERESTED? That's how she shows interest? Again, for the love of God please someone give me a normal woman! Also got the feeling this friend may have scared her off by being protective of me. To be fair, this date is like in last place anyhow but still, putting the fear of "don't you dare hurt my friend" into her may not have helped things.

Other previous date still has not contacted me. I've dropped the rope with her, now on day, let me think here, 8 or 9. Did see she went out for her birthday with S19 golfing and to dinner this past Saturday. I swear if it were not illegal and totally creepy she would date her son. That boy is her life - no two ways around it.

On a positive note, I do feel more myself the past two days. Clearly back to acting as if and just sort of taking some steps back. Thing is, that's where I was three years ago getting the same results after I crossed over to where I am now - and after all sorts of people insisted I "try online dating," "put yourself out there," "Lower your standards a little bit." So I did and now I'm backing off of that. Rinse, wash, repeat!

[Vanilla]

This isn't about lowering standards, it's about finding a great woman in your life.

The trouble is that your idea of a great woman is something you see as 'fixed' and anyone else other than the idea is 'lowering standards'.

The best person for you may be different from your ideal.

Reframe so that your choices are more flexible and that's not lowering your standards, that's looking for love in more places.

As yet I am not ready to date and thus I don't go out to the places I will meet someone appropriate, don't go online and thus as a result I am not going to meet someone new. My heart isn't open to even light casual dating. I am bruised battered and needing healing. My ex looks happy with his RIT, he moved on easily whilst I haven't. Maybe I never will be ready and I prepared to accept this as a consequence of a very damaging R.

We will see, perhaps I can be in an R again.

All I see is happy couples too, and I know things aren't as they seem in life.

V

[Maybell]

Then run into the friend that introduced me to one of my recent dates. You could have picked me up off the floor when she told me this friend is "interested." I'm like, huh? The girl who usually doesn't initiate texts, sometimes doesn't respond at all, then out of the blue contacts me to go out and gets weird and abruptly leaves at the end - that friend? She's INTERESTED? That's how she shows interest? Again, for the love of God please someone give me a normal woman! Also got the feeling this friend may have scared her off by being protective of me. To be fair, this date is like in last place anyhow but still, putting the fear of "don't you dare hurt my friend" into her may not have helped things.

Other previous date still has not contacted me. I've dropped the rope with her, now on day, let me think here, 8 or 9. Did see she went out for her birthday with S19 golfing and to dinner this past Saturday. I swear if it were not illegal and totally creepy she would date her son. That boy is her life - no two ways around it.

This read to me as very much lacking in compassion for others. I don't know what your experience with the second woman was, but I'll tell you from a woman's perspective, I'm not initiating a ton of communications. I want to be chased. WRT the first woman, If dating is awkward for her or you're sending signals that you're not that interested of course the dates are going to end awkwardly. I might tell a friend I'm interested but there's a big asterisk there and the bar goes up every day you don't pursue me. Not saying that's where her head is, but I don't read a ton of concern for her perspective in there and it makes me wonder what YOU'RE offering these women. Especially if you're ranking her "in last place." Gross.

Similarly, for the woman whose son is her life... Maybe he is. There was a long stretch of time when I only got up in the morning because my kids needed me. Who are you to judge if she wants to spend her birthday with a person she knows loves her?

Finally, this whole "lower your standards" line of thought is repulsive. People are people; no one is of a higher or lower standard than anyone else. If you meet a woman and instantly start judging if she's "good enough" for you you're never going to be able to see who she is. Frankly it makes you a terrible relationship risk because you're always going to be looking for the ways she DOESNT meet your criteria. If you can't meet a woman wondering what makes her tick and looking for what you can offer her, rather than how she can enhance you, you're never going to learn what you need to be fulfilled.

Rinse, wash, repeat? That sounds suspiciously like doing the same thing over again and expecting different results. You arent going to change your destination by changing the pace at which you travel the same road. Change the highway.

[Surfer]

DonH.

Interesting to read your sitch. Whilst I am sorry to read about some of your history, in a way, I bounce between feeling horrid being here and also greatful for the journey. We would all rather not be but if DB gives you anything it gives you, understanding and therefore empathy for others. That can never be a bad thing. Anyway back to your sitch.

Having reflected on the above is it possible that you are scared of, or frustrated by, rejection? Perhaps the answer lies in your comments here - where they have not come back to your texts etc. It's frustrating you particularly when they say they 'are' interested at a later date - I get the 'WTH is with that point' BTW, but are you caring too much about what they think and do? Just put your cards down and show them - if they are not into your cards or the card game, fine. Not everyone will find you to be their Mr Perfect, you don't them - why would they?

RE: What you want. It's not so broad as being happy. I agree with at, but perhaps it might be as simple (even as narrow) as being with someone, in a relationship that works, that makes you feel secure in yourself. But the thing that comes across in your posts is 'them being happy' is not mentioned (i.e you caring that they are happy). If you are in DB you and your previous partner (or partners) have messed up. You haven't both made each other happy. I am as guilty as the next. DB'er personally and don't want to repeat that pattern. I want to make either my WW happy (if she is able and willing to change too) or someone more deserving than her. But they key is making 'her' happy (whoever that is) I think. BTW I am not naive enough to think my actions can make anyone happy permanently, but the little things can give a little boost and if done often enough. They really do help your connection. However, the negative things, if repeated enough, can do exactly opposite and fast. I think we all know this - I am probably therefore repeating this to myself here!

If you are not so secure in yourself right now - and this is coming across in the dating 'game' (and who is on here) the goal is surely to find that security in you first. An example here, reflecting on the above is being sufficiently secure that you really don't give a damn if they like you or not, when you talk to a lady. You give a damn about "them" and what they are telling you, as you are genuinely interested, but their reaction - if they are not interested - no you don't want to be 'interested' in that (to the point of upset or frustration due to rejection), just recognise their reaction and think okay, wrong hand or wrong card game, neither are in your control.

Maybell makes some pretty strong comments above. The one I like in particular is in the final para. You need to change your destination/journey. Are you doing cheeseless tunnels? More of the same - in terms of behaviour. It sounds like you are exacerbated by the same old same old. What about changing your approach.

Perhaps having no expectations and focusing on fun would be the simplest way to look at it. This all probably sounds terribly cliche DB stuff. But that's because when we give less of a hoot and have fun - we do just that and let's face it people like to be around people that are fun to be around.

Just thoughts.......hope they help a little.