10 Years Later - From a DB'er

[kml]

Hi Don -
First of all - congrats on your sobriety. Good job.

Second - let me say, dating is a numbers game, and unless you work somewhere that you meet a lot of elgible women, online dating is still your best option for meeting people who ARE interested in a relationship. (Not 100%, but most people who go to the trouble to put up a profile are actually looking for a partner). Also, online dating allows you to screen out obviously incompatible people even before that first coffee date.

I know not everyone has had as good results from online dating as I did, and not everyone is savvy at reading profiles and getting a sense of the person. If you're not, recruit a friend to help you sort through the profiles.

Or join an activity which brings you into contact with the right kinds of women in a non-dating environment, where they can get to know you more naturally before you ask them out.

Also, remember - online dating is a very artificial and strange setup, where you might be having conversations with several potential dates and then go meet one who you decide to go out with. So don't take it personally when people drop off the map after initially seeming interested - sometimes it's just that they found the right match elsewhere.

As for this:

LOL, well I clearly have high standards - both for myself and for everyone else

It's fine to have high standards when you're looking for a mate - so long as those high standards involve real things, and aren't just about looking for an unrealistic Christie Brinkley/Rocket scientist. No one will be perfect - you need to figure out what your true priorities are. If your heart's desire is a truly loving and honest reliable partner, she might come in a package that's a little overweight, or still has a kid in high school, or might be a smoker.....you need to know what are absolute dealbreakers versus when you are being unrealistic.

As for APPLYING those unrealistic standards to someone once you are dating them - THAT's controlling and needs to stop. My ex had OCD and I could never meet his ridiculous, ever-changing standards. I was never thin enough for him, even when I was - in retrospect - a good 15 lbs underweight. I was never athletic enough for him, even though I learned to backpack, ski, snowboard, rock climb, climbed Mt. Whitney. I'm a strong person and never really took it on myself too much, but a weaker person would have crumbled under his constant criticism. Don't be that guy. Try to let go and appreciate their good qualities without "fixing" them.

Also - you need to figure out how and why you might be sabotaging yourself. I dated a lot of emotionally unavailable and/or inappropriate guys in the first years after my marriage, because deep down, I wasn't really ready to open up to a relationship again myself. Once I reached the point that I was, I met my current guy - who looks all wrong for me on paper, but is actually perfect for me.

[DonH]

Thanks again to everyone for taking the time to write. I'll try to address to of the main areas here in separate reposes.

First, KML it looks like you've been here from the time frame when I was more active and actually your screen name does ring a bell. Then again, it's been nearly ten years so.. I do think our paths have crossed in years past, however. I'm betting you and I have talked before.

As for my standards, I like what I like, etc. That said, I at least try to separate business from personal and think I do a decent job of it. I am very willing to go out with someone even if at first blush it doesn't appear to be a match. Now, an obvious mismatch, no, but otherwise I very much give the benefit of the doubt as I really think it takes a few dates to get to know someone. I can't be repsulsed by them but even if I'm not attracted at first, I'll still go out as it's more personality for me and the attraction often grows. I need it both, some attraction but also intelligence, conversation, etc. It matters not how beautiful someone looks if I can't hold a conversation with her for an hour. I've always been that way. Years ago male friends would look at me like I'm the biggest idiot on the planet when a beautiful woman with no brains hit on me. They'd think I'm nuts for not taking advantage but I just can't. She'd drive me crazy no matter how great she looked. That said, let me detail a few things and you tell me if it's me or if I'm seeing things accurately.

The most recent lady was introduced to me by someone I've known for 20 years. I don't see this friend as much these days as when we worked together but she knows me extremely well, knew my ExW, etc. She invited me to meet a friend of hers who she has known for several years. This friend is 5 years younger than me, divorced for 10 years like me with a D22 and S19 headed to his first year of college. She's clearly rusty at dating. Didn't do well in she talked more than the other three of us put together. Didn't ask a lot about me. Exceeded the 2 drink maximum at dinner, only by one but at 5' 1" and about 105# soaking wet it was hitting her and she was getting louder and louder with a few F-bombs thrown in. My gut tells me she may not be a match but also worth another date or two. She was nervous, is shy one on one, etc. but was outgoing and a lot of fun at dinner. Still, it was hard to read if she was interested or not. I walk her to her car and ask if she'd like to go out again, getting an immediate "absolutely." A nice hug, innocent kiss and a little hand holding followed. That was on June 8. We talked the next night for about half an hour to which she again said she wanted to go out but had shut her computer off so would need to text me some dates. Here we are 7 weeks later. I've called, texted and received minimal response. When I give up (go dark) then I hear from her again. To be fair, she is busy with work trips and son going away. She finally tells me she's really struggling with empty nest, etc. To me, I'd think it's perfect, she has a guy interested. To her, she's either not attracted and won't say so or she really doesn't know what she wants or is scared. She has not dated anyone in 5 years. Her son became her life. She's an HR consultant with a masters. Looks ten years younger than her age, beautiful, yet no dates in 5 years! I even told my friend, not wanting to put her in a bad spot - and said, "look I'm not going to be mad or anything, if she's not interested that's fine she can just say so." I figured perhaps she was afraid to turn me down due to mutual friend. Friend insists she is interested but "that's just NAME HERE." whatever that means. And this, mind you, is one of my more successful dates!!!!!!!

As for on-line. I just checked my account. I have emailed 121 women in the last two years. I have gone out with FIVE OF THEM - none this year! Now, to be fair, I've not put in a huge amount of time but honestly - 121 and five single dates with no seconds? It's not like I'm meeting them and weeding them out, I can't even get a response. I've tried, long and more serious emails. Long and light, short and fun, short and sarcastic, funny, serious, medium length with questions about them, etc. Comments about things they say in their profile. I rarely even get a response. This includes those who on paper, I seem to fit most everything they claim to want! When I do get a response, the best I get to is, "lets meet for coffee or whatever" and then that doesn't even happen. The last three went that way. One seemed very interested and then said, I'm just not up to it." Another one said she wanted to meet but when trying to come up with a date, finally said, "I'm too screwed up to be dating." Others respond once or twice and then I never hear from them again. I mentioned one who told me how she liked my profile and wanted to know more and then had all sorts of odd excuses - like we lived too far away - first off neither of us moved in the two days it took to email and second, we live 20 minutes from each other! I see some who have been online for YEARS. Clearly they are not finding what they want yet won't respond to my message. From what I can tell, it's not me that needs to open up and take a chance on them, it's the other way around!

Clearly I must be doing something wrong? I'm not a drop dead head turner but am reasonably good looking. I only have a few deal breakers - smoking, dishonesty and large tattoos. Other than that, I'll go out with just about anyone once - again within reason.

Then, and I don't know how to say this without coming across bad or wrong but even more disheartening is about the only women who approach me are so beyond wrong for me I don't even know where to start. Some look like their hair has not seen a brush in weeks, clothes from 20 years ago, 10 or more years older than me. I'm like, really, this is what I'm left with? Again, I know that sounds really, really bad but you should see some of these profiles. I can tell you in a heartbeat I'll die single if that's my only other choice. I can just be honest. Otherwise, be groomed, reasonably in shape, clean cloths, etc. and I would not for looks alone turn them away.

Does this help at all? Clearly I could be sabotaging myself, etc. but I'd have to at least first communicate or go out at least once with someone to do that. I would never send someone a nasty email asking for sex, or sending naked photos - all things I hear guys do. Never in a million years would I do that. Yet they still won't even respond??????? I just plain don't get it - especially since I've never had this in my life - never.

The one lady that I'd love to date, lives too far away. She tried online and called it the land of misfit toys. In fact, it was that statement that got us talking when I met her in her hometown while traveling.

I'd be happy to share my profile and even photos for honest feedback. That's one thing about me, I want to hear the truth. In fact I expect it. I love to learn, want to know if I'm doing something wrong. If I can change it I will. I just don't know what else to try. I'll share parts of their profile, what I email and if anyone would respond, I'd share that too.

Then, work, well I'm self-employed and like I said somewhat semi-retired. I don't meet a lot of people that way. On the other hand, I'm on stage in front of crowds of all sorts of ages in a variety of bands. That's actually how I met the widow I mentioned in the last paragraph. You'd think I'd meet someone that way - and actually, I used to - often. But rarely now. I do meetups for things in my industry. Sadly, many are younger than me. In all of these situations, I must be choosing decent women as near all of them already have boyfriends or are married - or they have ZERO interest in dating. I can give you multiple, multiple examples of that - sort of like the one above who has not dated much in 5 years.

Sorry that was so long but I really am trying to be as open and honest and provide as much info as I can.

[DonH]

Ginger, I also wanted to respond to your comments as this is somewhat the other side of my somewhat complex problem. While for the past years it's been a lack of people to even go out with, I have a potential whole other side of concerns and what has happened to you, just to be honest, scares the crap out of me!

I've done it both ways you say Ginger, 1. When you're not looking and least expect it. and 2. putting in the work. From 2006 to about 2012 I was not in the least bit concerned. I totally had the, if it's going to happen it's going to happen thing. To be honest, I didn't even want it to! I didn't try much if at all and was fine with it. Then in 2009 I went on a cruise by myself, something my ExW and I did nearly 10 times and loved only without a partner, I HATED it. That's the first time it started to hit me. Still, I traveled since and loved it. I go most places as a single - not to say without friends or anything but I guess as the third or fifth or seventh wheel as you put it. At this point, friends and family would be shocked if I showed up with a date. It's then been since about 2012 or 2013 that I've started thinking, clearly just waiting for it to happen is not getting me anywhere and all I'm doing is getting older and time is passing me by. It was then that friends said "get out there" "try online" etc. So I did. And it seems like the harder I try, the worse it gets. As I posted to KML, I've not had a date from online all year long! Why even bother anymore? At least when I wasn't trying it was one thing but to really try and get nothing but rejection really [censored].

All that said, coming back here, reading posts really brings me back to what a struggle it was when WAW walked. Do I want to risk that again? At least now while I'm not happy about it, I'm functioning well, doing work, going out, no depression, etc. Do I want to risk falling for someone, getting dumped and falling into a huge depression? I'm not so sure I do.

That then puts me in a damned if I do, damned if I don't, no win situation. I don't want to stay single and less happy than I could otherwise be but I for certain don't want to be down right depressed, not able to get work done, not wanting to get out of bed. If that's my two choices, I'll stay with what I've got.

As you guys might be able to already tell, I have huge self a steam. I'm very confident but always try to stay this side of cocky. I am very caring and will help people - hell I was a firefighter/paramedic for nearly 25 years. I'm a private pilot, accomplished musician, businessman. I don't have bio kids but love kids and am still involved with SD and SS ten years later! I'm told I'm rather funny but you have to get and appreciate my sarcasm. I can't tell you how many women say I'm a catch and can't figure out how the things I tell them could be happening.

Then again, all that said, I am not looking to get married again. Does that come across and scare people away? On the other side of that coin, the last date I had said the same thing to her friend "He doesn't want to get married does he?" So clearly there are women out there who don't have that as their end game. For you Ginger at your age, it totally makes sense. For me at 53 and not wanting kids, not as much.

Okay, so before I go in circles anymore I'm going to stop. Hopefully I've provided enough info for additional feedback. Again, if it will help to post my profile info, etc. let me know.

[kml]

Don....
You play in bands...... Yet you're not meeting women.....you're not by any chance a .......BASS player?????? 😄

[kml]

:-) :-) :-)

[DonH]

Lol well yes and no. I actually am a bass player but rarely play that these days. About 95% of the time I'm the sax player. Variety of different bands, music styles, etc.

That said, I think there was a joke there someplace that I missed?

[Zues126]

Thanks for dropping back to the forums Don.

I think you should change your dating profile and just have it be a quote from Shawshank, you know the part where Red (Morgan Freeman) is asked if he feels he has been rehabilitated.

I look back on the way I was then: a young, stupid kid who committed that terrible crime. I want to talk to him. I want to try to talk some sense to him, tell him the way things are. But I can't. That kid's long gone, and this old man is all that's left. I got to live with that. Rehabilitated? It's just a bullshit word. So you go on and stamp your form, sonny, and stop wasting my time. Because to tell you the truth, I don't give a [censored].

[kml]

Lol...... You're not familiar with the wealth of jokes about bass players?

One example:
What do you call a beautiful woman on a bass players arm?

A tattoo

[DonH]

See all my band jokes are typically about drummers...

What do you call the guy who hangs around with musicians? The drummer
How do you know when a drummer is knocking on your door? The knock speeds up.

Sadly drummers usually get the women!

Oh and when I'm gigging with a polka band... "He told her the three words every woman longs to hear... I play accordion"

[DonH]

KML I honestly had no idea you do some drumming when I wrote that response. All that more funny though but I truly had no idea.

I'll get on the keyboard (vs my iPad) later with some more thoughts and latest developments - minute as they may be. The more I delve back into all of this and the more I read, the more it's clear that I really don't know what in the hell I want - and it scares the crap out of me!

Five gigs in the next 7 days so no telling who I may meet. .