Feeling he's in MLC, but in D process

[ciluzen]

I'm doing better today. Thanks, job and Mel. Headache is small now; just dealing with pulled muscles on the sides of my neck and some bruises.

I did get a text from H yesterday asking how I was. That was surprising, as he has been avoiding commenting on or asking me anything about me since he moved out. I gave a brief answer back and then nothing else from him. I allowed myself to be amused/slightly happy that he texted, though.

Trying to keep a calm balance with GAL and relaxing alone time. When H left, holiday season was just starting to ramp up. My way of dealing with the emotions was to throw myself into activities right and left and fill my time driving from one thing to another. I joined tons of meetup groups. When I was by myself at home I just wanted to curl into a ball and cry. And I did do that...a lot.

I'm now at that point that I'm dropping a lot of those meetup groups and my alone time is much calmer. I'm taking two online Gale courses (free) through the library, meditation and statistics, as sort of a practice for going back to school. Its amazing how out of practice you can get on just being a student after 25 years!

In a few weeks our house will officially be on the market. H has promised to help with the house every weekend. We'll see how that goes. We still have a lot to do.

I've put out the idea of Easter breakfast to both girls, but our family is a little broken right now. My oldest begged off because she and her husband "don't want the two families to fight over time on holidays". Haven't heard back from D23. Not sure what to think. It just feels broken, but I'm not too upset by it. I plan on going to church Sunday and whatever happens beyond that happens, I guess. Its just so weird. Last year I made bread baskets for the girl's and D25's (at the time) fiancee with eggs and gardening supplies (seeds, seedlings, gloves) and a little bit of candy-their requests. This year...sounds like nothing. As I said, BROKEN. New holiday tradition.

Not having as big a pity party as that sounds. Just putting down thoughts as they occur. I never asked H what he was planning on. I'm tempted to invite him to church, but he would probably decline.

[ciluzen]

So....journaling.
D25 called to say she received a text from her MIL saying that she wanted her family for Easter dinner and another text from my H wondering what was up for Easter. She said, "Im sick of this c%$p, so I'm going to ask if he can just carpool with you and D23 and come over here for breakfast." She's an hour away.

As I was driving back from a GAL activity, she called to tell me H was planning on skiing with D23 AND ME on Saturday and might just consider that the Easter get together. ?!! News to me. And totally leaves D25 and her H out (too far for them to drive and they are new home owners/broke). Its all about my MLCer right now.

Then H called, so I let her go until later. He mentioned the same thing, but explained that he knew we had a lot of work to do on the house and wanted to use Sunday for that. So, apparently I am skiing with H and D23 to celebrate Easter a day early and working on my house on Easter and leaving D25 out completely. I need to think a bit about this. Its probably the last holiday we'll ever get to spend in the family home. I might have to stomp my feet a bit for breakfast at the house. ughhh. I don't like this.

It is interesting, though, after H not wanting to spend any part of Christmas, New Years or any holiday together he would want to include me in skiing for Easter. That seems to be the activity he's ok with me and seems to like to be around me. Good memories tied in?

[melweb]

Cil--it seems like in a moment of clarity, they go "Oh yeah, I really do like/love this person," but then go "Wait. I am not suppose to being doing that!"

I hope you get to spend Easter with your girls. Wherever, however. You decide.

[ciluzen]

Mel,

This ride, I tell ya!

I woke up to no power and had to wait til I was out on the hwy on the way to ski to get in contact with anyone.

D23 wouldn't answer her phone so I called H who texted back that he was already at the lodge. D23 ditched out on skiing today, but I went on up and H met me there and seemed to be looking forward to skiing with me. Go figure...never know which H I'm going to get. He had even buried two beers in the snow on one run (he had time before I got there) which we sat back and enjoyed at the top of the mountain in a sunny spot.

Snow was great, sky was blue. No R talk. At lunch, H started to pay with a debit card...a different bank. So I now know he has opened his new checking account (I was wondering when he would). Funny. I asked him to start the process of getting my name off of the joint credit card, but he hasn't yet. I'll remember to talk to him about removing names from accounts, now.

It was a good day, fun and relaxing. He called on his way home to chat a bit, as well.

Things I did notice (and have been noticing):

He "glosses over" or ignores my mention of certain things. Me going back to school, his "ladyfriend" if I bring her up (but not her family), many of my activities, or attempts to bring up efforts in trying to decide what my living arrangements will be after the house sells. And anything sexual. This is the guy that can turn anything into a sex joke, so I've been throwing that at him once in awhile. Crickets. Like, totally ignores and is quiet...doesn't even change the subject. Its strange.

He tells me how hard he's working and how tired he is and how he has no money. How he doesn't do anything but work, sleep, eat, and (right now) ski on the weekend. I feel like he wants me to know how hard his life is so that I should be happy that I'm not with him. That I should feel lucky that he left and am able to have a life.

As long as R is not brought up, he acts like my good friend. Platonic good friend. A buddy. I can play that game...for now. I'm interested in seeing where that goes, though. Is it just for while we have to work together through selling the house and dividing things up? Because its easier to do if we're friends? I'm not sure how that will be when there's no reason to see each other anymore.

For now, I'll be his friend. I'll be here if he needs to talk or needs help. I'm moving forward, but it really is interesting to watch what happens when I don't initiate contact. Summer is coming, and with that, ladyfriend and her family and friends will be at the vacation home on many weekends. How much will I hear from him, then, I wonder. I guess I'm getting more detached. I'm not as angry as I am curious, at this point.

I'm fairly certain that will change, as well, though.

[job]

I'm glad you had a good time on the "mountain". Listening to him chatter away can give you some insight into what he's doing w/his life. Sounds like he doesn't have a whole lot going on. The things he's telling you are not to make you glad you aren't w/him...he's just telling you about his life at the moment. BTW, they all cry about having no money. They want you to think that they don't have any...but they spend it all on themselves, their toys and their fun. They want us to feel sorry for them...don't!

And, yes, they do tend to gloss over things and will deliberately ignore things that you mention. As long as you do not bring up the relationship, he'll continue to chatter away and be a "friend". Just remember, the description for "friend" w/the mlcer is not the same as what we are familiar with.

You've got a very good handle on your situation...continue to listen and validate. You'll be surprised at what you hear if you don't offer up advice, etc. Dig deeper for patience as you continue to move forward.

[ciluzen]

Thanks, job. I'm trying. I'm pretty busy trying to sort my own life right now, so it has become a lot easier to not dwell so much on his every move (except when I post!). I like that I can go back through the posts and both see the transformation from when I first started (his and mine) and re-read advice that I might have forgotten.

I guess one of my fears that had me thinking a bit last night, rolling it over in my head, was based on something H said when he was being open a week or so ago. As I've said, his mom has Alzheimers and it is a big stressor to him, although he tries to act like its not. He spoke of a dr. friend of ours describing memory being like a book shelf. If you keep putting books on it, at some point the books at the far end will fall off. I worry sometimes that the good memories of me and our girls will start to fall off as he does more things with ladyfriend and her kids and her friends kids, and that memories of their good times will still be on the shelf.

He loves families...told me that when he was in high school he couldn't wait to have a wife and a bunch of kids. High school! Our kids are basically grown now. But they have pointed out that many times that they feel "replaced" as H started being super fun "uncle H" to the kids in our social group and "flirty almost single guy" to all the moms. As I've said, I felt more and more out of place in our group.

So, today I am going to do Easter breakfast with my girls at D25's house. I encouraged H to go (lightly) yesterday, but he mentioned going to church (lady friend's church) and later coming out to our house to work. D25 was also going to again encourage him to join us, but I don't know how that went. His priorities right now...not family. Not HIS family. He's so blind.

He also won't see the successes of his kids. He complains about how expensive D25's house was, how small, how far away. Not excited that it is a beautiful house in a great, vibrant, sought after neighborhood and THAT THEY WERE ABLE TO BUY A HOUSE! He discounts her job, but she is in a great, well paying position at an award winning design company and having offers come to her from other companies because she's good! And she loves her job! The negativity toward the child that was once his buddy is weird.

My other D he goes back and forth between saying she is smart and gives great advice and calling her a "basket case" (she is in treatment for anxiety and depression, but doing well).

Both D are confused by his actions. I've tried to explain MLC to them and depression. We've all agreed to try to be patient with him, but it is painful to watch how he treats the entire family.And how we are all somehow the one's to blame, the disappointments in his life.

Ah...well. Happy Easter everyone. I'm off to drink peach bellinis with my girls and SIL.

[job]

Happy Easter! Enjoy the day w/your family.

Your h will not forget the many wonderful and happy memories that he has made w/you and your girls. Keep in mind, even if he were to get Alzheimers, they remember things of the past and tend to forget what the present day holds for them. They regress to children in many ways. Did you see the movie about Benjamin Buttons? This movie reminds me a lot of what the MLCer goes through a bit.

You do realize that your h is very jealous and resentful of what his daughters have accomplished thus far in life? Of course, he's going to put down anyone that is successful and doing great right now, because he's not getting the attention and being put on a pedestal for what he's accomplished.

Actually the negativity towards your D25 is not unusual. They tend to gravitate towards one child more than the other. Is he closer to your other daughter? He's projecting on to her how he feels about himself.

I can understand how your daughters would be confused about his behavior. Maybe you need to share some of the books that you may have read about MLC w/them. It would help them better understand some of his behavior. Jed Diamond's books are great and they may help as well.

Enjoy your day! Maybe you'll get lucky the Easter Bunny will come along and drop a few eggs on his head! LOL!

[ciluzen]

So...Easter was odd. Had a nice time at D25's house. D23 was sick with a cold but she came with me to infect us all as we ate and chatted.

H was a no-show. Went to church with his "other family" instead. He did call as I was dropping D23 off to tell me he still wasn't feeling well and that he would be out later to work.

He came out much later than he wanted and was still not feeling well, so we started going through things in the house that he wanted to keep so I could box things up. Then, my emotions hit me... hard. "How can this not affect you? Isn't this in any way sad?" Thus commenced a big R talk. And some tears. We were both able to stay in a bit of control, though, and get through it. It just feels both so hopeless and, at the same time, like H shifts a little each time. Thinking about it more? He admitted that he had given up on things and felt bad about it; our house, our marriage. But no turning back. We agreed that we needed to be on the same page in working on D stuff, what to keep, what to sell, what to donate, what to trash.

We were able to get back to our task and end the day on friendly terms. He did ask what I was going to do after D; what my plans were. I told him about going back to school and how I hoped to buy a house at some point in the future. It was as if he had never heard me say those things before (I had...many times). MLC mind!

Not the Easter I wanted, but the Easter I got wasn't horrible. Still waiting for the Easter Bunny to drop those eggs on his head.

[job]

I'm sorry Easter didn't turn out the way you had hoped, but at least you were able to spend some time w/your D25.

The MLCer does tend to be sick quite frequently, so I'm not surprised he said that he wasn't feeling well. I'm glad he did come out and work w/you in packing up things. Don't beat yourself up for getting emotional. It's difficult when you have a h on the run and you are packing up a lifetime of stuff and moving on w/your life w/o your life's partner there w/you, i.e., sharing in everything.

I do hope that you are feeling better today.

[ciluzen]

Job,

I don't know if H is jealous of D25. He always had a very close R with her...they look very alike and have many of the same personality traits (fun, gregarious, quick sense of humor, seemingly very sure of themselves but kind of insecure underneath). They were "buds". For some reason, he has taken a dislike to her new H (as soon as they met!) and this has damaged his relationship with her. I think it is partly because he somehow sees sil as a rival, but also because he sees that sil has traits out in the open that H also has, but tries desperately to hide (awkwardness, insecurity, anxiety around new situations or stressful situations). He sees him as the epitome of weak. I have taken the time to see his strengths, though. H doesn't want to be around him...at all. And sil has never done anything wrong...except marry H's daughter.

D23 and H always butted heads while she was younger. He used to say she would do things purposefully to tick him off or as a slap in his face. His relationship now with her seems to be a little more respectful. He listens to her advice and ideas, even though he refers to her as a "basket case" as she is being treated for ADD, anxiety and depression. She is going into the psych field and has a gift in working with teens with difficult/criminal problems. He has gained some respect for her opinions and new found calmness in analyzing a situation.

I don't think he is jealous of what they've accomplished. I think he doesn't see it as accomplishment. He is a health care professional. He actually looks down on D25 for being in graphic design...even though she works as hard as he does. No one works as hard as he does. I think he's more jealous that they have their whole lives ahead of them and time to make mistakes (he feels he doesn't?), but he is controlling enough that he thinks if they would just listen to him they wouldn't make any mistakes.

As we were in the thick of R talk on Easter, I mentioned at one point when I told him he sometimes took things as a personal slap, that he used to think D23 was doing bad things to slap him in the face. He said he had given up on that idea. He sounded very sad as he said he had given up on a lot of ideas...our marriage, our house...
I'm not sure what he meant by that.

Also an interesting note (to me at least). He has mentioned in R talks (I guess R talks to me are more "relationship" than "reconcile" at this point) that I am embarassed by him. He used as example a pair of crazy patterned ski pants he wears. He was relating the story of when he bought them and how I was so embarassed and kept saying, "your not going to buy those?!". As he told the story, it went from me being embarassed to me being angry, then me being livid! He insisted that I was angry and that I was then angry at the whole shopping experience and that I was angry at him for making me go. And then that I was angry at him for even wanting to ski! So basically he went from me being embarassed of him to me being angry that he was a skier and therefore I didn't like him. This was in 10 minutes. This was an interesting insight into his line of thinking that I hadn't really seen before. Scary, actually. How do I overcome that?

Of course, I found myself defending and explaining myself during our talk. Tried to ask him questions to better explain himself and then allow me to defend or explain my side of each story...all the wrong things.

I am glad we were able to pull out of it and end on a calmer more friendly note. But I can see that he wants everyone to just leave him alone and let him do what he wants to do, without judgement. He doesn't understand how he is affecting others. I told him D25 was very upset when he chose to not come to her house for Easter and he looked truly puzzled. "Why would she be upset?" He has no idea.

Each time we have these interactions, it oddly just makes it easier for me to detach. I'm realizing how little is left on his side other than "comfortable and familiar". I'm not even sure he thinks of me as a friend. And this after a really fun day skiing together. At least I'm becoming a better skier through this.