Time to let go......how?

[otw]

Thanks. I have nothing to lose anymore. I am going to post daily questions and activities. I am going to turn myself to advice. My ways haven't lead to a real solituon.

[Missmeg]

Hi. I'm a newcomer too. Sorry that we're on these boards. Have you watched MWDs Videos on YouTube? It's the same stuff that you read on these posts, and in DR, but I have found repetition helps.

I am too new to have any advice or hope to offer. I agree with you, though, that it's very disheartening to see posters who signatures include the word divorced. I would like to see more that said reconciled at the bottom of their signature. And also to read more success stories. But the reality is, not all marriages make it. And DBing Will help us, whether or not it helps our marriage.

[asitis]

So, I just caught up on your sitch.

Definitely some control issues. You say you have taken them up in IC, which is great. But one of the most important things you will need to work on is respecting her wishes in this. No questioning. No asking where she's been, who she's been with, what she's doing, etc., etc. That all reminds her of your controlling behavior.

I'd just assume there is OM or are more than one. Not because there are, but because you need to deal with just accepting that you have to have zero control over her activities right now. And I mean zero. The only thing that you have any reason to bring something up is over care of the children and equitable arrangements regarding the children.

When she goes out, it is "have a good time." When she comes back in, you are asleep or otherwise in your room with the door closed unless the kids need you.

Be friendly, but not all that available.

What are you doing to GAL? This is critical and you don't mention much other than that you have your business interests. You need to become the sexy, interesting man you were when your W met you and started falling for you. Someone who placed no obligations or commitments on her. Who she was with because she wanted to be with you, not because you felt you had some right to tell her how she should live. Give up being her H, and figure out how to be that man. That's who she fell for. Hs are unattractive to her. Any OM or just friend is fun because they don't put any conditions on her. Take that to heart and make it part of the new you. Your goal is to become her friend and lover, not her H. Not right away, as now you need to detach and GAL, but eventually. Become interesting again by figuring out what interests you and pursuing it. Obviously the kids come into the picture, and need to be an important focus (it is something you will be that no OM can, is the father of her children, so show the kids some good times and unconditional acceptance and love).

Don't fight her on the S. Don't. Ask her what she thinks is best when she brings it up. Be OK with it, and show her that you think she is an equal and someone you respect by not telling her what you think, but asking what she thinks and considering it. Really considering it. Say that you need to think about what she suggested. Then give it a couple days, and come back to her and tell her that you have been thinking about what she said and your thoughts. Keep bringing it back to asking her what she thinks is best. Not what she wants, and don't tell her what you want. She will fight you if she thinks this is about duelling wants/power struggle. You are asking her what she thinks is best. Best for the kids, best for her, best for your family (mostly the first two). Not best for you. This is your 180. You are considering her wants and needs and showing her that she can work with you and that you hold her in high regard.

On the finances, you will want to work with your IC (or better, a DB coach) very thoroughly on how to change that dynamic from father telling irresponsible daughter what she can and can't do. It will not be easy. She will make mistakes, and you need to protect yourself financially. Still, she needs to control some fair share of the families income. She works in an unpaid job that serves your family. She is powerless and dependent on the finances. She likely has never had to learn self-responsibility on this. Turning this into a cooperative partnership without the power imbalance is going to be key. It will mean that you will need to let her make mistakes and choose things you would not, while balancing the needs to take care of the entire family.

I'd also highly recommend a DB coach. They can help with these dynamics, and leave your IC a bit freer to explore your emotional wounds and needs. It is a good division of labor. Specialist on the R dynamics and generalist on the self care and attending to the underlying drive to be in control that is at the root of some of your R issues.

That's probably more than enough to digest for now. Hang in there. Prepare for worse so that you can weather the storm with dignity. And remember that the being patient advice you will get over and over here (for good reason) also means be patient with yourself. It takes time to adjust, learn, and grow. And, you are guaranteed to make mistakes along the way. Patience, self-care, and a lot of work.

[otw]

MissMeg..thanks for stopping by and checking in. I wish you the best of luck as well.

Asitis...Wow. thank you. you are very correct on the controlling issues. we both suffer them in our relationship. I have begun what you said about stopping the questions, and only asking what she thinks is best. for someone with control issues this feels like i have given up, even though i know that is not reality.
I tried to figure the financial part with her, but she kind of roadblocked. She was just not ready to do this as she stated " with our situation, I dont think this is the best idea" all i could do was say ok.

I have stopped fighting the S even though it is very hard. not seeing my children everyday is frightening to me.

I have had DB coaching abut 4 times now, so i am working on that end.

GAL...tricky area. my wife is definitely making sure she does this well. She will go out with friends often. when I eventually do, it seems to cause some kind of issue with her. In my own mind reading, i beileve it is because she is with the kids all day, then if i want to do something she is still in the same boat. i get a feeling that even though she says the kids are first, she really wants breaks from them as much as me.
I have begun attending church. I thinked this shocked her. I go to the gym daily. I am trying to find ways to do GAL activities with my children and other friends with kids. it seems i am left with them while she is out with friends multiple times a week. I dont like sitting at home and just wondering during those times ( i know detach).


i kow i need to do more for myself right now, but i have accepted that the S is going to happen and i am trying to do everything i can with my children that i can while i am with them everyday.

thank you very much

[otw]

Also, another question. on trying to do 180 and GAL at the same time. my wife said that i would always just do what i wanted while it wasnt the same for her. when i feel like i want to do things on my own then it makes me feel I am still doing the same things that pushed her away.

I know tomorrow night she has a night planned to go out again. She asked if she needs to find a babysitter for the the kids. I told her no and that was all. I have to find something to occupy the time witht he kids and get out of the house early. I can not stand being there when she is getting ready to go out. It is mentally challenging for me to detach during those times then while she is gone.

[otw]

I know right now i am just talking to myself in between respones but this is my outlet and my bouncing board.

Question
I plan on taking the kids to an amusement park next week, it would be overnight not far from us but 2 different places to go for the 2 days. Do i just make plans and tell her we are going and have my mother come so we are an even number or do i offer the chance to my wife? remember we still live in the same house in separate rooms and kids know something is wrong but not that we are on the verge of separation of living.

thanks again

[ILYNOT]

I have been there and offered, she obliged, we went but we didn't hold hands, no emotions so it was more of a disaster then anything, she was in a completely different world than we were.

Time to let go of the rope and begin doing things on your own like she is, no need to invite her, but do let her know that you are taking the kids that day, etc. She will probably use that as an opportunity to go out anyhow.

Let her get whatever she is going through out, eventually the fire will burn out. By that time you will have become the best dad, the best person you can be.

[otw]

It is a tough call. We are still very civil. I am taking the kids somewhere tomorrow and not inviting her. This trip will be a little bigger though and we discussed before.

I will not be looking for any one of interaction between us by any means. It is more for the kids as the summer winds down. We will still have some time all living together before the separation agreement is worked out and someone moves.

I am considering everything though.

[asitis]

for someone with control issues this feels like i have given up, even though i know that is not reality.

It may feel that way, but you are actually taking control of it. You are doing what will work. You are making a big change that will improve your R (even if it doesn't save your M) and will improve your chances for healthy Rs in the future (be they w/ your W or someone else). That is taking control and fixing things. It takes a whole lot of control to not do the things we reflexively do and to change our dysfunctional habits.

I tried to figure the financial part with her, but she kind of roadblocked. She was just not ready to do this as she stated " with our situation, I dont think this is the best idea" all i could do was say ok.

This is something to work on w/ the DB coach then. Get some other eyes on the situation that understand they dance, esp. your particular dance steps.

I have stopped fighting the S even though it is very hard. not seeing my children everyday is frightening to me.

Great. Yes it is hard. The missing the kids & worrying about the impact on them likely wont get much easier, at least it hasn't seemed to for me and most others here. You have to get to a point where you do the best you can and accept that this is what it has to be right now. Just be there for the kids when you do have them. Give them the security and stability and unconditional love they need at this very unstable time in their lives. That's all we can really ever do with kids, as life doesn't always cooperate, and certainly they won't always have things go their way no matter how much we want to protect them. And, play with them. At their level. Get down and see the world on their level and be a kid with them. Child-like wo/ being childless. This will do more to help them process their worries & emotional confusion than anything else. It allows them to feel safe and relaxed enough to open up to you and let you help them.

I have had DB coaching abut 4 times now, so i am working on that end.

Great! I'm very glad to hear this.

GAL...tricky area. my wife is definitely making sure she does this well. She will go out with friends often. when I eventually do, it seems to cause some kind of issue with her.

Don't worry at all about this causing issues with her. This was her choice, and you need to take care of yourself. This is about both of you getting what you need within the context of sharing responsibility as co-parents. She doesn't want to be M to you. Fine, you aren't stopping her. So it is now a quid pro quo relationship. It is a negotiation. If you want this time, then I need this time. If she balks, then you tell her this is not an option. This is the reality that she has created. She can not be happy with it, but that is the way it is going to be.

Now see if you can do that without being too confrontational, but you need to be firm on this. She needs to feel what it is going to be like as a result of the choices she is making, and you have every right to a life as well as she.

Tell her this is not working, that the the kids will do best if both parents are getting equal time with them, and that it is not sustainable if one of you is not able to have time to take care of themselves or bears too much of the burden. Then ask her what she thinks would be best? Don't make this I want vs. you want if you can. Make it about what is best for the kids and the two of you. Enlist her help solving the problem.

If that doesn't work, then you'll have to move to a different approach that is more confrontational and adversarial. But no matter how bad you feel about "making" her unhappy (you participated in this but so has she), you need to show that you need to be treated with respect and fairness. If she won't then you will enforce that right. Again, this was her choice, not yours. There are consequences to choices. This is just the hard reality.

Good luck.

And, it is good to write out responses to your own posts like you are. Do what helps you think through these things.

[otw]

Thank you for checking in and responding. You make alot of sense. I want to keep giving all the advice here a solid chance. I am sure I will need to be smacked around from time to time. I am going to post as much as I can to be sure I am not missing something that may be a big deal and don't think it is.

Thanks again