My First Break, Light Shines Yonder

[Zues126]

Hey Py, one thing I did that was helpful for email/text was the STBX "translator" technique. You might have seen this if you read through my old threads.

Basically I rewrite her email or text to me in a more friendly way. Suddenly texts that seem impossible to respond to are easy to do so without any defensiveness or hostility.

So if she writes: Whatever you're telling D about me you need to stop. I don't say anything negative about you and whatever happens between you and I has nothing to do with her. She needs both parents and you're only hurting her when you do talk bad about me.

Hmmmmm.......hard to respond to, isn't it?

So rewrite it the way you'd have liked to see it: Py, what's happened between us is very difficult for our D. We're both trying our best to look out for her, but I'm concerned she's blaming herself or me for what's going on. I'm trying really hard to watch what I say around her, and I know you love her as much as I do and are probably aware of this so please continue to do the same. No matter what happens I want to be able to work together with you to make sure D is ok and has a good R with both of us.

That's easier to reply to! Now you could reply to that rewritten email like this: W, I agree it's hard to watch D in pain and the best thing for her is to feel safe and loved from both her parents. I appreciate you putting her first in all you do and I will follow your lead and do the same. You're right that whatever else happens we need to work together so she can have a good R with both of us. Sincerely, Py.

Now- see how the response to the rewritten email actually works for the scathing one? And how it was validating, non-defensive, and collaborative?

I used that when I worked for a boss that sent scathing emails and it helped me tremendously. Let me know what you think.

[Pyrite]

fantastic advice ! thanks.

i have usually edited my emails until they are "clean" and then end it with

Thanks, Py.

then I have to re-edit so everything fits with that signature.

But your suggestion of reframing he message first is even better. i love it.

ps - I have paused on reading your earlier posts. Last week wasn't the best week to start. Given I know the end and I really am/was still hopeful for my W to come back. I say "am/was" - because as I posted on last thread towards the end. I am "ready to want to" abandon that hope. NOT because I dont want my family back, I do. But wanting it so badly is holding me back from letting go, and I need to let go for my own futures' sake. And that is the best chance I have of achieving anything I want, including my W back. I think I'm on the right track. Feel free to whack me again if I'm not. Ironically, again, this was my position before as well, but now I "really" want to LET GO, before I wanted to LET GO, but not "really". You see the difference

[Zues126]

Makes sense, just remember we don't always know what's best for us. I've learned to just trust that God will take care of me if I stop getting in his way and trying to force my will.

Also, you don't know the end of my sitch because it's not over. And I've never been so happy in my darn life. Some regrets, some aches, but I'm not reading articles on how to use plastic bags and helium to end things painlessly like I was during my M either

[Pyrite]

Unfortunately I have never been religious. I am/was very spiritual though. My interpretation of God would seem blasphemous to believers as it is ....unorthodox lets say. So I wont go there in case I do offend. BUT I have always believed that it is good to believe in something and better to believe in something good. I say "am/was" again because my spirituality has fallen by the wayside in recent years. Re-emerging now.

I expect a long road of failures and wrong turns. My SF quoted to me back in February, "Happiness is not a destination, its in the journey." So there is no "over", there is just where you are at now. Good for you. I hope to get there one day.

I also am not reading those articles any more which is great. Recently though I have "thought" about it. I think there is an element of "desensitization" in there which makes it easy to consider. It is not all consuming as it once was in the M though.

Anyway, two social engagements ahead of me this weekend. Stag, no kids, but thats life and the calendar I guess.

thanks for everyones help this far.

-Py

[Smothy]

I want to be in that place where I REALLY want to detach! I keep telling myself I am letting go, but something happens and I am back to hopefulness and or despair.

My BF has just given me a smack round the head (not literally) she is thousands of miles away. She said to me it seems so sudden to me because H is so far down this road than me, if I don't let go, I will never catch up and accept my reality and this will always hurt me.

[Zues126]

Sorry that was the feedback that you got. That's similar to telling someone to just "get over it". Or telling someone with depression to just "snap out of it".

The problem is that your emotions are part of you. If you decide in your head "I won't feel upset anymore because there's no reason to", all you are really doing is disconnecting with your feelings and suppressing them. They will still influence your life, even if they do so in a way that is to prove they don't have control over you.

Like my therapist- he once told me my life was controlled by fear. I challenged him because I face fear all the time. I take on roles at my job that push me well out of my comfort zone, I play pool for high stakes in front of lots of spectators betting on the match and it freaks me out, etc. I feel like every day I seek out and overcome my fears. My IC replied "Like I said, you are controlled by fear. I didn't say you were running from it. But because of your fear your life evolves around daily battles against scary situations to try to 'overcome' your fears".

Point is if you suppress emotions, even when you feel like they aren't controlling you they play a big role. You MUST take time to sit with them, understand them, and then GROW- which is nothing more than learning where they come from and starting to see things differently so the feelings retract gradually. Negative feelings are signs from the universe we need to learn something. Woe to those that try to ignore those lessons.

I agree with detachment as being a major goal for DBing...I just think there's a difference between going through the process, learning those lessons, growing, truly changing your point of view, and achieving a point where your emotions no longer flare up because they no longer have things to tell you...vs. suppressing, compensating, medicating, avoiding, distracting, and lots of other things people do to try to convince themselves they are detached.

Slow and steady is the way of this journey, there are no short cuts. When you can accept that head on you'll be on your way to peace.

[Pyrite]

Smothy,

i get unravelled ALL the time. I am having a great day. Wall behind me that is boundary to W is in place. I can peek over without breaking apart. I can see in front of me. I'm controlling me. BUT then "something" happens. it has happened a dozen times before but one e.g. is that a letter arrives adressed to my wife, her maiden name. In the first week after separation she too off her ring, changed her name everywhere, and ordered new business cards.

Then its back to square one for me.

It kills me as well when my W says she is hurting so much. Fine, I can understand that she is, and I played a big part in her making the final decision to walk-away. But she has moved on. On the days when I dont have the girls I am, or have been a wreck. On the days when she doesnt have the girls she is at the movies, or a restaurant, or in bed with OM.

Has she grown as Zeus has discussed. I dont believe so at all - if she had we would not be where we are, she would be whacking me up side the head to grow together. She has compensated/avoided/distracted her way out of it. Do I envy this? superficially - absolutely! Really, no, because when the fog clears those same issues which were an issue for me in the R will still be there. One of the biggies was that I didn't seem to be the person she was in love with so no amount of growing would fix that. Her other issues that could be developed - are they show stoppers, would they cause her future relationships to suffer? STOP!!! WTF am i doing - i'm worried about the possibilities in her R future in 2-3 years time.

Rewind - "It kills me as well when my W says she is hurting so much." I think this is where I need to stop myself. OK it is hurtful for her, not LIKE it is for me, maybe more or less than me, but i'm not in place to help her. she doesn't want me in that place anyway. spitefully, out of anger, i want her to recognise how much she has hurt me and feel how she has let me down. this comes full circle, that was how our M became.

sorry Smothy, this is becoming a cathartic exercise for me. I think after the first time we separated (she left) when we were dating (because I was focused on my study and neglected her) i put the reigns on her. I never had to pull the reigns though because the next few years were great. Then, for whatever reason (babies, project house ,etc), things weren't so great. I felt neglected. leaving was not an option for me, I tried to get through to her (IF ONLY i had've done a better job, tried harder, etc ), so I pulled the reigns and tried to whip her into shape. i got her jumping through some hoops, but ultimately pulled harder and harder on the reigns - until one day they snapped.

so Again, like Zeus' story, FEAR lead me to putting on the reigns and then pulling them until they snapped. Good news for me is that now I am sitting here with broken reigns and I am faced with either going out and getting me some new reigns or abandoning the need for them.

I dont know really how you can judge your progress in terms of NOT letting fear control your life (negatively) without being or putting yourself into that situation. But i think you can realise when that's what you WANT to do and be like. Right now I know that a R is out of the question, with anyone, especially my W, because I am more scared than ever. but i do WANT to not be scared. I would love to be able to honestly say I am not scared of a future in which my W is not part, my family is gone.

Of course, there is one overlying thing (my W) which I can say would alleviate my feeling scared. But I can't change that, or work on that. All I can do is work on the underlying reasons. The things I am telling myself she would give me. Provide those things for myself and maybe I won't be so scared. Then a R would just be like icing on the cake, and not be required to make the cake.

[Pyrite]

that more addressed the despair side of it - but i think you hit the nail on the head - the hopefulness is equally as bad.

i used to think NOT. i used to think that reigniting my hope by reading between the lines of an email or something was a positive. but really I was just pushing away "letting go" - STILL DO. will do for quite some time i expect. but i think this is where you have to get to. and as Z said you can compensate/medicate etc which is what 99% of WAS/LBS seem to do- and i must say it is NOT like these ppl learn nothing. well not always - so I think there is benefit to compensating, distracting etc - because you do need to forcibly heal at times - just not ignoring.

[Pyrite]

She said to me it seems so sudden to me because H is so far down this road than me, if I don't let go, I will never catch up and accept my reality and this will always hurt me.

i get exactly this same advice almost everyday. it is perhaps over simplistic and not commensurate with DBing but i dont think it wrong or completely at odds with DBing either. "accepting your reality" - thats the hard bit I think.

In my case, my W has said in no uncertain terms to many ppl, that she is never going back. She is 100% the victim, has practically been battered, will never forgive me, will never say sorry for anything she has done or said. In reality this is only hardening with time, and her new life with OM draws a firm hard line against me. I am becoming a smaller and more distant past. She isn't softening, she isn't analyzing the M and what part she played. She has moved on and moving further on everyday. She is convinced the kids are better off now and will life will only improve for them. Better off now is absolutely wrong, improve is a certainty, but maybe they would have suffered if W stayed in M for another year.

So "reality" is that there is almost no chance she will ever want to come back. Then there is where I am at as well. BUT maybe we can also include in that reality that "I am going to be a better person at the other end" and "their decision to leave and/or their decision/non-decision about coming back" is not going to change that.

[Cadet]

So "reality" is that there is almost no chance she will ever want to come back.

That is an EXPECTATION.