Onwards and upwards.

[rd500]

Hi Barry. Firstly please go and see your GP. They have seen people deal with this before and you need to speak to someone. Secondly. Insurance will not pay out on suicde and even in your sitch an "accident"'would be investigated by experts. Thirdly. You ha e children , your their dad. That's a responsibility that is also a gift What would the loss of you do to them,

What you are dealing with is incredibly hard , you have lost your best friend and basically your world as you knew it. No one knows what is around the corner , you W could want to reconcile , you could meet someone else , who knows.

Life is a bitch at the moment but the key is at the moment, Barry has a lot of living to do Please stop chasing your wife , she didn't decide to leave overnight and nothing you say will make her change her mind back overnight

Please go to the GP We all need help, I have L/C , friends , family and when my W left I got everything and my kids. Post often so others can offer advice and support

GP. TODAY BARRY

Take care. Rd

[Fogg]

I don't know if I should put this or not but I found myself thinking this morning (not for the first time) if my life insurance policy will pay out in the event of my suicide. My W and kids will get a large sum of money and the house gets paid for. I don't want to die, but the thoughts of losing the only woman i've ever loved, my home, and all my dreams for the future are overwhelming.
It's only thoughts of the kids that stop me.

I miss my W and family, and I'm so tired guys.

Barry, this part of your post worries me alot. I completely understand those feelings because I had them two months ago. You don't want to die, but at the same time you don't want to live. Its a bad place to be in and if your going down that road you need to talk to someone to get some help. If your in counseling talk to that person, use a hotline if needed. Find someone to speak with.

Understand this. Your children will not in any circumstances be better off without you. No amount of life insurance money in the world can replace you to them. I understand your hurting, but they will not be better off. In fact, the pain you are feeling now would only be passed to your children if something happened to you. You cant do that to them. You understand how painful it is, be the man you need to be right now so you don't pass it off to your children/W. You don't deserve this pain, but neither do they.

Don't give up on things, I know it doesn't look good. It doesn't for any of us. You will be ok. I had a similar breakdown recently about detaching. I thought I was doing very well with it and then crashed hard when I realized I was just fooling myself about how well I was doing. I'm struggling to not show those emotions to my W aswell, you need to work on that. Don't let this cause you to backslide too much, understand how you are feeling, accept it and take baby steps to keep going. Nothing about this is going to be a short process but giving up or trying to force it to go faster will not help. Stop trying to control the outcome of your M, you can only control yourself and you still have work to do.

I know your tired, I am also. Nothing in life that's worth it is easy, but at the end of this you will be able to look back and see the journey was worth it, no matter where you end up.

[Mozza]

Barry,

In the first couple of months of my sitch, I remember thinking that the timing would be perfect to be hit by cancer or a bus. I also remember thinking that all women but my W were ugly. Also, I couldn't understand how anybody could have the energy to start a project. How does the world even turn with this much pain in it?

You know what I'm going to say: it gets better. Just now I'm listening to a song I discovered yesterday and absolutely love. I had stopped watching TV for 4-5 months and now I follow a few series that I really enjoy. I bought tickets for a 3-day music festival and couldn't be more thrilled and, I'm astonished to say, a little happy that my sitch allows me to do this freely. And I see a lot of pretty women around.

What must be hardest for you is that you were getting better and then you got hit by these financial problems with real life consequences. Does it feel like you'll be at the bottom for a long time or even that things are going to get worse? If so, you must know that your life will be better than today in a year, and better than this another year later.

Here's a thought: there is passion in your future. Whether it's R with W or a new relationship, you will be in love, excited, having some mad sex, going out on dates and laughing a lot. Even for myself, I don't know how it's going to happen, but it has to. 20 years is a long time, but it's still just a quarter of your life. There's a lot ahead of you.

I'm going to recommend another book to you: "Models" by Mark Manson. It's a book about attracting women through honesty. It is the perfect complement to NMMNG but regarding women. It's not a pick-up artist kind of book; it's a book that forces you to reflect on your fear of rejection, but also what truly attracts women. And I mention that not in terms of dating new women, but of understanding what attracts your W. You can't afford these breakdowns in front of her anymore. Your gut is telling you to make one last attempt to convince her, but your gut has to understand how she'll be convinced. I keep thinking of all the LBH and WAW around here when I read the book because it overlaps a lot with DR even.

Vapo is right also: you need to GAL. If you can't plan anything, at least go for a walk, stop for a coffee and watch people walk by. I hit the bottom when I stay home too long and I reach new heights when I get busy. You need it a lot now.

[HeavyD]

Barry

I wanted to comment about your situation and how much I empathize with you. I am so sorry about the pain you are in and the added financial difficulties. Believe me, I understand the pain.

You have your children to live for. They will need you for the rest of your lives as a guide and support and loving father. Please do not consider robbing them of you.

I know you feel down and this is a dark time in your life. Remember that this will pass and you will get to the other side.

Hang in there, I think it would also be a good idea to talk to your Doctor. There are a lot of medications that can help you deal with these understandably painful emotions your are experiencing.

I always remember the Churchill speech - never never never never give up.

I agree that distraction is the best rememdy at this point, go to the mall, coffee shop, bookstore, anywhere where there are people to watch. It makes you realize that the world is full of people and there are so many options.

We are all with you Barry.

Much support and love sent to you.

[Mozza]

She doesn't have any stress, in fact, I only ever see or hear about her having fun. She doesn't even realise how much this is all affecting me. I've never done anything in my life that warrants me being made to feel like this.

I'm not sure you're being "made" feel like this. S is something that happens to a lot of people and we all have different reactions. On these boards, you see a lot of distress, but I have friends who have been much more accepting of it and just moving on within weeks or months. What I mean is that it's not your W that makes you feel like this, it's yourself, it's your reaction. Don't get me wrong: the circumstances are dire and of course you're going to be sad and down. But don't blame her for your reaction. Look inside of you.

That's what my IC helped me to do. He made me realize that I had put in my W certain ideas about myself and that the pain was to see these things go. For instance, my W is good looking, more than me, and so she was a sort of trophy wife that validated my own appearance and worth by her presence by my side. Another thing, and it is the one that should relate to you, is that I'm not comfortable with the idea of seducing a woman, of putting my needs and desire out there. In fact, I'm terrified of it. My IC made me realize that if I was much more comfortable and confident, I would react more calmly to my stich.

This is not to disregard the very real reasons you have to be sad. It's just to explore the reasons for the depth of your pain and your recent relapse.

I begged her to call all this off (I know guys, I know) because I love her and just want this to end.

Two excellent reasons for her to end this?

It's not like we've only been married for 2 years and they've been bad - we had 20 years together before that. I can't think of a single good moment in my life that she either wasn't there for or was part of

This is crazy talk. You were almost 20 when you met your W. You've had plenty of good times before you met her and you had plenty of bad times with her.

and it's heartbreaking to see that she's happier and better off without me.

Same here. When my W left me, she stopped all her medications and IC. She was on cloud me, free at last. When I met her, she had the glow of love and good sex. Guess what: five months later, she was back on medication and worse. Your W is on a high right now, finally doing what has been a secret desire. Don't go thinking that it's going to be for the rest of her life. She has not escaped the indignities of life.

In the long run, we have to stop comparing our happiness to that of our W, or even to feel competitive with other men who might make them happy. As an insecure Nice Guy like you, it drives me nuts too -- probably because deep down it makes me feel like an inferior male who can't compete to pass on his genes. Or according to the Nice Guy approach because it reveals our flaws, which we're trying hard to hide.

She didn't say a lot, apart from that she couldn't stop this. I asked because I'm desperate.

She did the right thing by listening and being steadfast, since that's her mindset. You shouldn't be looking for reassurance from her. And you shouldn't approach her when you're desperate. Has desperation ever worked with any woman? Ladies on this board, are you looking for a desperate man?

I'm trying so hard guys, so hard to make myself think like her in that this is all for the best. It's a constant battle though because I DON'T think it's for the best...not for me.

It doesn't have to be for the best. You don't have to agree with her. You've taken this too far. I don't think that my S is for the best, not for me, not for my kids, not even for my WW. It is what it is: reality. That's all you need to accept. It's her choice and as surprising as it is, she has every right to make it. We have no control and can only deal with dignity with the downfall.

Deep down, I still feel like I did at BD. I'm saying and doing all the right things in an effort to change my feelings about the whole thing but it's just not working. I come here and write to try and help with changing my feelings and to try to remain positive and upbeat. It's great to get positive feedback from you guys about how well I'm doing and I have found it a comfort. I can't help feeling like it's all just a sham on my part though.

I was concerned about this. Your changes had been very quick. As a Nice Guy, you adapt to meet expectations and it's possible that you've adapted to the expectations of this board. You want to be told that you're a good man, that you're doing things right. You find value in this because you don't find it in you. So you say what people want to hear.

Keep sharing what you are going through. This a large community of people who get it and are on your side.

[raliced]

I begged her to call all this off (I know guys, I know) because I love her and just want this to end. It's not like we've only been married for 2 years and they've been bad - we had 20 years together before that. I can't think of a single good moment in my life that she either wasn't there for or was part of and it's heartbreaking to see that she's happier and better off without me.
She didn't say a lot, apart from that she couldn't stop this. I asked because I'm desperate.


I don't know if I should put this or not but I found myself thinking this morning (not for the first time) if my life insurance policy will pay out in the event of my suicide. My W and kids will get a large sum of money and the house gets paid for. I don't want to die, but the thoughts of losing the only woman i've ever loved, my home, and all my dreams for the future are overwhelming.
It's only thoughts of the kids that stop me.

I miss my W and family, and I'm so tired guys.

Barry- Forgive me for just jumping in on your thread - and I know plenty of others have already posted to you already, but your post has been bothering me all morning and I want to share a personal experience with you.

When I was a teenager, my best friend's father, who was a colonel in the Air Force, was found to have been cheating on his wife with a subordinate. He and his wife went through hell for about 5 months and then she finally forgave him and chose to reconcile. At that moment the Air Force decided to court martial him and the outcome at best, would have been dishonorable discharge, which would have severely impacted his ability to get a job. So, at least primarily because of the finances, he killed himself before that could happen.

His wife and two daughters have never really gotten over it. My friend, who was a sparkling, joyous person (and the class valedictorian) has never come close to reaching her potential. The suicide casts a pall on her children as well. It is an aching sadness and shadow that grievously affected my lovely friend and that has now been passed on to a second generation.

Oh- and it affected me too. Even as a bystander.The ripples from something like this stretch to places you would never imagine. I was very close to them and I respected him so much. I happen to work very near to what used to be the AFB he was stationed at, and I never pass it without thinking of him and what a tragic, stupid and unnecessary loss it was.

Please, please, do not consider inflicting this pain on your children or your W.

Barry - you'll get through the money problems. You will. I know quite a few people who lost everything in the recession and have dusted themselves off and rebuilt their lives. You can do the same.

I sincerely hope that what you wrote was just a brief moment of intense pain and that it has now passed.

Hang in there Barry.

[rd500]

Hi Barry. Could you give us an update please ? hope your doing ok

Take care. Rd

[Barry]

Hello everyone.
Thank you all for your kind words of advice and comfort.

I didn't intend to alarm anyone with talk of suicide, or play the victim. As I say, the thoughts of my kids always stop me in my tracks. I'll be honest though in that if I didn't have them, there's a big chance I wouldn't have made it this far. I actually find that hard to digest. Surely I shouldn't want to live "just" because of my children, but that's what it's been like for me recently.
I can totally see how people get to the stage that they do it.

I'm already on anti-depressants...strong ones. I have been since Christmas. I see my GP regularly, I've been seeing an IC (although I have taken a break from it at her suggestion to attend an Emotional Wellbeing Course at my local college). I've been reading the books and talking to trusted close friends and family. I've had little to NC with W and it was all helping to a degree. I really felt like I was DB'ing well, and I felt as good as could be expected right up to the day that W made me this offer to buy her out of our home.

We'd initially agreed on a six month separation (obviously I hoped that we would R at the end of this period, or at least make a start on piecing), but she didn't even get a third of the way through that before letting me know she wanted out. I found it really difficult to deal with that and it really knocked me back to day one again. I've struggled ever since then really.

My GAL has been terrible lately. I've had no energy, no zest for life, just sadness and heartache. I know GAL works as it got me through the first 6 weeks - I need to get back to that, but without ANY thoughts of R now. It's just not going to happen.

My PMA (needless to say) has been awful since then too. It's almost like W saw me that day, and thought "Barry looks like he's really coping well and looks great - let me just knock him back down to Earth". I'm sure it wasn't that deliberate but OMG, how did she expect it to make me feel??

I've hardly see the kids lately either (I have talked to them on the phone of course). This is partly because I've been in a bad place emotionally and I don't want them to see me like that any more. It's also that I can't go to my house to see them, we can't relax in my parents house, and I'm so worried about the immediate future that I haven't wanted to spend any money on anything (fun activities with the kids etc) until I know what's going to happen.

I will add here that W has not stopped going out (not with the kids - she hasn't done anything with them), or spending money on herself. She doesn't need to worry about money - only when Barry will be able to come up with a way to get more.

I know it was a stupid thing to do but I sat in front of my W and sobbed my heart out the other night and she litteraly didn't care. Honestly, my W has always been the sort of person to offer comfort to a tramp in the street if she saw someone upset. She's wrecked the only life I ever wanted and I'll never forget that. Maybe one day I'll forgive her...but forget - no chance.

I respectfully dissagree Mozza when you say that I've not been MADE to feel like this. I understand your point in that it's my reaction to it that's the issue but I wouldn't be in the position to make any kind of reaction if W wasn't doing it!!! I'm normally prety good at rolling with the punches in life but this one feels too much like a knock-out blow.

When I spoke of feeling like a sham, it's not that I come here and write things that I think you all want to hear so that you'll send me away with a pat on the back etc. I was trying to say (badly maybe) that not just on this forum but in "the real world" too, I've been trying to "fake it till I make it", or act "as if" I'm accepting all of this. That was also working up to a point, I HAD started to accept it.

If I hadn't been stopped in my tracks by the finance issues, I would have filed already.
The momentum behind my progress came to a screeching halt then.

I'm still in limbo as of today, but I just wanted to say thank you to you all for your concern.
I'll keep you up to date with any changes.

Barry.

[rd500]

Barry. Glad you posted. If your on the ADs then they don't seem to be working This is one of the toughest things you can go through. We all know how you feel but things will get better. Don't hide your feelings on here because the vets will offer constructive advice if they know what's really happening.

It sounds like a cliche but you will be happy again. Take care mate. Rd

[Barry]

Thanks for asking about me RD.

I told my GP the same thing about the AD's when I saw him last. He said to stick with them and I'm sure they are doing something. I do have moments of clarity in between everything else. If I'd have got them sooner (last summer) then maybe I wouldn't even be here now...but I didn't, and I am.

The bitch of a best friend has been posting status's on WhatsApp all day today, rubbing my nose in the fact that she and W are so close. She's not stupid, she knows I see them (I actually put one of my own asking her to please stop), but she continues. Her profile pic is always of them two together, and she's just put one on of them practically kissing. I hate her so much.
That bitch better not dare to speak to me ever again.

This is partly why I know there is no chance of R between W and I.
Unless she moves away or dies, this friend is always going to be around muddying the waters and sticking the boot in. Yes...I'm bitter.

It's W's birthday in a couple of weeks (this is the same day that I moved home last year coincidentally). I won't be sending a card, buying a gift or anything like that. In fact, I've arranged to go and stay with a friend for a few days instead. I did that so I didn't have the option of standing out in the cold for hours waiting to see if she brings someone home (as I did before) when she goes out clubbing with her new, younger, single friends.

I need to get away from here.