GAL is key to Detachment, & Detachment is KEY to becoming your best self AND it's key to backing off and giving her the space and time she has requested. So work on yourself and GAL.
For GAL suggestions, let me mention some of what I did when we lived in the interior of Alaska, even in the winter. I had 3 kids, including a baby (so you know I don't want to hear about how you are 'too busy' to GAL). Inertia is the greatest enemy to GAL. Overcome that, & you'll be well on your way to a happier more fulfilling life.
IMO, the more you overcome inertia, the better your R's will be with all people, including your w. Plus, you'll bring more to the table as a mate...
I volunteered at a battered women's shelter.
I coached a girl's softball team for two summers (my older D was on it. Bonding!)
I was on the board of directors for Wrestling, ( our son wrestled). I auditioned for community theater, & got cast often. I met some fun creative people.
I did stand up comedy (and yes, I still do it). I did a whole set once on a MLCs at the Improv. It went very well. Yay me.
I learned to cross country ski & I got better at downhill skiing.
I Learned to hunt big game, to deep sea fish, and became an expert marksman with a rifle.
I learned to use/ride a snowmobile ("snow machine" to Alaskans) I loved riding it!
Learned to fly a plane, and I got a pilot's license. (Bucket list item)
Went skydiving. (Also bucket list item) Loved it so much I did it again. And plan on doing it again, soon!
Edited a book. (The book ended up on the Best Seller's List. Who knew?)
I Worked out 3-4 times a week, and I really did get in excellent shape. Looking good made a world of difference to me. I found a work out partner and began socializing after the work outs.
I'd just had our last child and needed to lose the baby weight. It was not easy to do, let alone in the darkness of their long LONG cold winters).
Saw a therapist and for some months, went on ADs.
Took a pottery class (very odd for me to do, but I liked it a lot).
Joined the Officer's Wives club after 15 years of active duty & ignoring them with my snobbish attitude about women who "Live thru their h's careers".
Wish I had joined sooner! I met two women who are life long friends to this day.
Joined a writer's group- Took a class in Conversational French- Took a class in Italian cooking-
There is more, but I just wanted to suggest to you a few things you can do that do not cost a lot. Other than pilot training, most of these ^^ activities were free, or cheap.
I'm sure you can come up with several of your own.
GOOD LUCK!
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Sorry for the delayed response. Its been a pretty depressing last few days, this "detaching" thing isn't working out very well, why in the H*** am i waking up crying for 30 minutes, and crying when i go to bed? Im a very strong person, motivated, driven, work extremely hard to get what i want and im crippled right now?
Anyway this is what has happened since i last posted a week ago. I found out she saw a lawyer, she cried while in the lawyer office and couldn't stop crying so she did not hire them. She is seeing a councilor and has gone a couple times....
Meantime i have seen the kids a couple times, she is very short and to the point when we talk, very cold, as if im a stranger and the only attachment we have are the kids so that is why she feels she even "has" to utter a few words to me. It is extremely exhausting mentally to go through that. I have been on the verge of giving up, but the crazy thing is i keep telling myself there's always hope. Everyone around me is telling me to move on, its been almost 6 months, shes done, shes made her mind up, she doesn't have feelings for you anymore, she is moving on etc.... but even after hearing people say that, i still have ( very little ) light shining at the end of the tunnel and im holding on to that.
She is telling her circle of friends that she is coming to the realization that divorce is the only answer, she is scared and never thought she would be in this situation but she feels hopeful and relieved, nothing has been filed yet but this is the course she is taking.
Meantime i hear about her crying in the lawyer office, and starting to see a councilor, so i dont know what the heck to think. I have not ONCE begged or cried in front of her for the past 4 weeks, i have totally just been on cruise control but let me tell you, when im not around her im not on cruise, im a freaking wreck.
Anyway, the only think i can think to do is just stay away, give her space and dont contact her unless its about the kids. All the begging i have done has only made it worse, i haven't done any begging for 4 weeks but i haven't seen any progress either, so im not sure what to do other then stay away.
I was planning on possibly going home to visit her next week while the kids are at school, take some coffee and give it another shot, ask her if she can give us one more shot to move forward, it wont be like before, no questions, no demands, just move forward slowly, be with the kids for Christmas, go to dinner, go shopping for the kids etc...and if its going smooth i could move in. But i wouldn't bring up the "moving in" part until things are going smooth.
Please give me any advice on what to do, i feel like im going to explode and im physically getting sick thinking about this. Its insane how a marriage turned upside down can affect a person this way....wow.
Now listen to me, four weeks is nothing! She cried, so what? She's a mess! Of course she's going to cry.....what did you expect, balloons and popcorn? But just b/c she cried does not mean she is having second thoughts. It might......but who knows? I started every day out telling myself I would stay in my M. By noon I was doubting it, and by the time I got home I couldn't wait to contact my OM. This went on for months.
The good news is she put it off another day, for whatever reason. Maybe she didn't like the way the lawyer looked, IDK. Her mind may change tomorrow. You can't read anything into what she says or half of what she does. She is seeing a counselor (which may or may not be good). However, I would like to think she recognizes the fact she needs help somewhere. Every day she doubts her decision, is good. However, it is not for you to be there trying to persuade her. She has to figure this out on her own and in her own time. If you don't want to wait around, that's your decision, but if you try to press her to make the right decision.....she will intentionally do the wrong thing just to get rid of you.
What I am saying is that you cannot read into her actions much of anything at this time. She will be back & forth b/c she doesn't know what she wants to do. You, on the other hand, must be the stable one here.
You say detaching isn't working. No, detaching does work! But you are not detached. What isn't "working" (by whatever definition or expectations you have on working) is that you don't see what you want quick enough, so you fall back on previous actions (begging, pleading, crying) which totally turns her off. I mean, what woman wants that kind of man to lean on for support?
You seem to know a lot about what she does and says in the privacy of the lawyer's office and to her friends, so I assume you have sources to reveal that information? Are you talking or asking questions of her friends/family?
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Sorry for the delayed response. Its been a pretty depressing last few days, this "detaching" thing isn't working out very well, why in the H*** am i waking up crying for 30 minutes, and crying when i go to bed? Im a very strong person, motivated, driven, work extremely hard to get what i want and im crippled right now?
Now get this....it is fine to cry in private. Okay? And I would venture to say you wake up crying and are depressed b/c you are worried sick about her and what she will do. You chose the name "love14" So I think you probably love the woman, in spite of what she's doing to you.
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Meantime i have seen the kids a couple times, she is very short and to the point when we talk, very cold, as if im a stranger and the only attachment we have are the kids so that is why she feels she even "has" to utter a few words to me. It is extremely exhausting mentally to go through that. I have been on the verge of giving up, but the crazy thing is i keep telling myself there's always hope.
As hard as this is for you, she sees you as the enemy. You are the cause of all that's wrong in her life. The more you interfere and try to put yourself there in her life....the more she will blame you for her unhappiness. Not fair, I know. But there is plenty you could be doing that may help her see that you are not the source of everything bad. The main thing is to leave her alone and keep things short and sweet when you do have to swap kids, etc.
I know this sounds horrible to you, but the LBH has no idea just how turned off she is to him, and how resentful she is. She may be telling her friends she is "done" b/c that's how she feels, and she's talking from her emotions.
It sounds as if you have been talking from your emotions, too. Not good for you to talk to her out of your emotions. I'm not saying you aren't allowed to feel whatever you feel. I'm saying that from the standpoint of the WAW, she will not respond positively to an emotionally weak man (when dealing with her). Make sense? If not, I'll try to explain better.
We women want our men to be stronger than we are. There is something in our very being that desires a mate who we can lean on, and we simply cannot be drawn to a man slobbering all over the place, or clinging to our legs begging us not to go.
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Anyway, the only think i can think to do is just stay away, give her space and dont contact her unless its about the kids. All the begging i have done has only made it worse, i haven't done any begging for 4 weeks but i haven't seen any progress either, so im not sure what to do other then stay away.
You have the first part correct. But as I said before, four weeks is nothing. It takes a long time. In some cases, a very long time. That's why you have to be detached.....to survive. Once you really are detached, she will sense it. You don't have to inform anyone to get the message to her....she'll just know. She stops feeling the pressure. Right now, every word out of your mouth is pressure to her. Everything you do is pressure. You may not understand it, but nevertheless, it is. She is not the girl you M. Stop thinking of her as being that girl. She's lost. It will take time for her to find her way back. In the meantime, what are YOU suppose to do?
What are your personal goals in your growth/self improvement? What are you doing to GAL? Do you have your calendar filled during December?
Now that I've boxed your ears, I want you to know that I really do care. I hope you will post often.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I'm new to the forum, but have really appreciated your insights, sandi2, into the WAS/LBS dynamic. My W left very abruptly 2 months ago, told me one month ago it is over and she won't respond to any text or emails i send (she's kept that promise). My DB coach told me last week to go dark and i haven't attempted contact in a week. This is a second marriage for each of us and we don't have kids in common, so there isn't that opportunity to see each other or talk business.
I have one more paid session with my DB coach left and am fighting the urge to call him every day. Am hoping to start getting some more assistance on the forum. Thanks to everyone for posting.
Me: 39 W: 46 D: 7.5 S: 5 SD: 16 SS: 12 T: 2 (06/2012) M: 2 (12/2012) Separation 09/2014. No talks of D yet. No communication since 10/3/2014
Listen to Sandi. I repeat, listen to her. She was there, she's been here for years, she's like a prophet with these things. She'll say something and the next week, my W does that thing almost to a tee.
You are where we all were when this started. This is how I was thinking "In order for her to still know I love her, I need to show her how much I care. How much I want to make this work. How much I want our family to be together. How much she still means to me, etc."
The thing I was missing in all of this is it always is "I" or "me." She doesn't 'feel' that she cares about you or your feelings. In fact, she's gone because she felt you didn't care about her feelings so why should she reciprocate? So when you beg and plead it just looks like you're being selfish. It makes no sense, because in reality its the opposite of this, but she's not in reality right now.
It took some time for me to detach and even when I thought I did, I still hadn't. Even now, I'm not fully detached. But I can tell you that once it started to happen, our interactions started to change. I started to not take her spew, but more importantly show her if she wants a D, these are the things that need to happen. Well, I can tell you that they don't think about everything when they leave.
Today, I had the most relaxed conversation with the W we have had since BD. We had nearly no contact for the last 4 months Why was the conversation good? She was comfortable with the topic...a separation agreement. Well, as we were going through, I could see the concern in her that things were happening she didn't quite plan. When she realized that she couldn't spend Xmas eve or morning with the kids based on our schedule, she tried to get me to budge. I told her this was the schedule she set up. Then she got angry at me. Well like everything else; it was a dose of reality for her.
As many folks have told me. We want to help them....but guess what; we are the last people on earth that they want help from. I tried to help my wife cover up the A with the OM's GF. Know what it got me? Her cake eating for a weekend and then shutting me out from any communication another month when she didn't like what I had to say. My new mantra is 'Tough Love' not sure exactly what that means fully, but sandi has been the closest to me understanding what I need to do.
Last edited by MCS; 12/03/1405:05 AM.
M:36 W:37 T: 15 M:11 S6 D5 BD: 8/10/14 IDLY: 8/12/14 S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids) D Mentioned: 10/15/14 Confronted about OM: 10/15/14 EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13 She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Been a rough road, almost 7 months. She called me a couple days ago wanting to take a step forward, a very small step but atleast a step. I was super happy, but unfortenatly according to her, I started acting like nothing bad has ever happened, so she withdrew today, to the point that she told me everything is her fault, and that I should just go out in the world and live my own life. She appologized for everything, and said she just can't do it anymore, she needs to get some control back in her life, she is tired of crying daily and feeling like a nobody, she just wants to grab on to something and take a step forward, take a breath. She can't get past he hurt that I have caused, so she told me that she will file for divorce this coming week...
I'm in utter awe, I do not know what to do. Is this really happening, after nearly 15 years and 3 children? I told her to please give us another chance, but she said that I am still the same as before, I will never change and she doesn't want to give me a "10th" chance. I told her it won't be the same, it will be better, but she said it won't because I am me and will always me me. What she doesn't realizie is that I won't ever be he same, I have so much to give and my eyes are open, but I'm not getting the chance to show her. I can't explain the grief I'm feeling, when you are shut out like this, it is extremely painful.
So, am I nuts for thinking EVEN AFTER ALL THIS , there's still hope?
Hey love14. I'm not at all a vet... but I think you know the begging you did there pushed her away. What would happen if you surprised her by saying... "you're right W. I understand you can't get past the hurt. You have to get some control back in your life and so do i. I've got to go. Take care of yourself. bye." something like that that tells her that you are accepting her where she is and walking away yourself. Not at all intuitive. A huge risk if you look at it intuitively. But that is DB.
Don't fight her. Say you accept what she's saying and that show your courage by doing it. You showed her you're nuts about her. That is the problem she currently has with you.
Did she call you after a period of NC? Even if she didn't from now on don't send her a letter, or a text, or an email. Don't call. Anything you say now about how you think or feel will hurt you. If she contacts you... listen to her so you don't "start acting like nothing bad has ever happened" again. Surprise her by not chasing her. Take a chance and let her wonder about you.
In the meantime... do good thing for yourself. Become a better you. If she files... don't beg. Accept it with grace. Act as if you're moving on. That's DB. I mess it up all the time. But it works. Sorry about where you are. It is terrible. You can make it.
If she's talking D now... it is VITAL that you don't beg or contact her again. You've got to be the strong one. Strong enough to SHOW HER SHE IS LOSING YOU. If any part of her wants you... that part wants to see that strength.
Last edited by HPoirot; 12/08/1403:07 AM.
Me: 44 W: 45 S: 11 Married: 15 Together: 18 BD: 9/29/2014 OM discovered: 10/16/2014 I left her behind: 12/14/2014
Do you know why she pulled away so quickly? B/c you acted super happy. As much as you want to feel happy and start all over or act as if nothing ever happened, you can't afford to do it with her, yet. B/c she does not feel it at all. It kind of scares her away, like the squirrel in Divorce Remedy.
One reason a WAW acts so coldly to the LBH is b/c they don't want the H to get the idea everything is okay. It is their way of saying, "We have problems and things are not normal".
I could just give a small smile and my LBH would get excited. I would instantly pull back. I was not ready for him to get all happy acting b/c I could not feel hope like he was.
Do you know what she was referring to when she said you had not changed?
Have you had that deep soul search yet? Made out a list of goal? 180's? GAL?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
So I think you probably love the woman, in spite of what she's doing to you.