Seperated and completely lost

[JohnJC]

@Goat: Your 2 cents is worth far, far more than that.

These are some of the exact same thoughts I had one my way to the date and all the way back as well.

Going into it, I was plain that I was not looking for anything more then some innocent company. I mean it when I say I want nothing more than to be with my wife. The guilt I felt tells me that these are not just words. While my wife may not feel the same way right now (or ever again), I know that I do and I need to be true to myself.

I am not even remotely close to getting into a relationship other than my marriage. I will fully admit to being very, very lonely and not feeling all that positive that I will be able to work things out with my wife. But i will also admit my greatest weakness...I'm very much in love with my wife. There is no doubt about that.

So, you're preaching tho the choir, so to speak. I hear your words and they are echoed by my own thoughts. No more dates. At least not for a long while.

Thanks Goat. I do appreciate you tossing your hat in the ring. Your words ring true.

[GoatGal]

Ok, John.

I'm glad to read that you are a man who is not afraid to confront his feelings on issues like this.

As a man, it's hard to admit that you are so lonely. Yet, that's where many of us find ourselves, especially around the holidays.

If you're feeling uncomfortable going on a "date" then you already have identified that it's something that is not in keeping with your personal values.

That may change, depending on your circumstances.

But I think for many of us here who have gone through so much heartache, one of our mantras should be like the Medical Profession.

"First, Do No Harm."

We don't want to hurt others while we're trying to make ourselves feel better. We are learning to transcend our emotional state and focus on more important, long-term goals.

And being kind to others is at the top of my list, personally.

--(G)GGG

[Rick1963]

John what is happening is normal and part of the process. The rejection is so great that u wonder if anyone will ever be attracted to u again. Dating too soon is selfish. That person may fall in love and u will definitely will not be ready. That person will b hurt. Just so you can deal with your own pain. Learn to be alone. Let the walls cave in on you. It will hurt but it wont kill you.

I have been there.

[JohnJC]

Thank you Goat and Rick.

You're both on the money and I couldn't agree more. I don't want to jeopardize what's left of my marriage by going on a date, nor do I ever want to hurt someone else. I get heartbreak all too well, and would never want to do that to someone else, not even a little. Like you, Goat, simple consideration and kindness is at the top of the list of who I am.

I know my pain is my own and that its something only I can deal with. Alleviating that pain has to be something that comes from me and not something I use someone else for. I echoed these sentiments to my therapist yesterday after telling her about this. It just that its very hard when it's omnipresent and never, ever seems to alleviate...even a little.

Like I mentioned, if my own feelings weren't enough to set me straight on the matter, the fact that the date turned into an absolute train wreck was certainly a sign. I'm not sure that I ascribe to guiding hands from the nether letting us know where we should be, but if there is then maybe I should heed them.

I think I needed the date. Not to make me feel better or wanted or less lonely, but to re-focus my mind and energies into what my ultimate goal is: the reconciliation of my marriage.

There's a small voice inside of me that keeps telling me my wife doesn't deserve me fighting so hard to fix our marriage. The way things went down to begin with and the way she's treated me since reinforce this voice. But then then I remind myself I had a part to play in all of this as well. I may not understand it, nor get how some of the little bit that she told me caused her to leave actually caused her to leave, but I know I have work to do on myself. I've been doing lots of that, long before she left. I wonder if she will ever notice. I hope so.

[JohnJC]

Wife dropped off my son, like she does everyday, so I can drive him in (she goes to work a bit earlier than I do and I like to spend time with my boy).

Every day, I say, "Have a good day at work," or something along those lines. One time out of 10 I may get a half-hearted "you too'. Today, nothing, as is usual.

She calls me back a few minutes later to tell me she would like our son in long pants today as its cold outside. She says she has no long pants for him and no money to get any. I see this as her way of her asking for financial assistance, one of the few things she actually talks to me about. I didn't take the bait.

I don't have any money to share. I'm pretty broke right now due to her separating our marriage. So is she. I wonder if this even registers in her mind as at least a tentative reason to think about working things out (or that she could have worked a bit harder TO work things out before she left) or at least not act so cold towards me.

She breaks up our marriage, treats me like dirt after the fact, and then expects me to simply drop money I don't have into her lap. Who is this woman? I just don't get it. It's pretty frustrating.

[GoatGal]

Hi, John,

Just my .02 again.

I think getting your son in appropriate attire for cold weather supersedes any concerns you might have about your W taking financial advantage.

Buy the child some pants; be the good dad. I know you're angry, but this should be part of your "New and Improved John". He makes absolutely sure his family is provided for.

You said "Our Son", so I assume he is yours and not some other guy's?

As for saying, "Have a nice day at work" and getting no/half-hearted response from her--quit doing it. She probably feels like not the best person in the world for a whole bunch of reasons. 'Have a nice day' sounds sort of cavalier under the circumstances; to my ears at least.

Maybe try to keep it matter-of-fact:
"Hey, W---I'll be at a meeting until six, then I've planned Spaghetti for dinner."
Just the facts. Or nothing.
You should have no expectations.
So even saying "See you later" can sound like pressure if she has plans.

Let HER initiate the "Have a great day at work". Then you can say "You too, W." with a nice warm smile.

Remember the 80% rule.
Let her take the lead and set the pace on day-to-day communication. If she isn't wishing you well in the morning or saying "sweet dreams" to you at night, neither should you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Again, you sound angry. We all get angry. But make sure you don't make your son pay for the anger you really want to direct towards your wife.

That can be a 180 for you. Can you yourself go buy him some pants? That might be different... and would show that:
1. You heard her concern about the cold weather
2. You're taking care of your son's needs
3.You put the effort into shopping for him on your own, and even put some thought into what you would like him to wear.

Just an idea...

Focusing on keeping your communications at 80% of the warmth, content--whatever--that SHE gives out, will keep you busy.
Except for spite and anger. That you should NEVER give back to her.
You should always be polite and caring towards her, as you would a neighbor you're friendly with.

Think of how you might respond to various scenarios ahead of time. Good preparation and practice will serve you well when those unplanned moments of emotional interchange pop up.

The last thing you want to do is come off as uncaring about your son at this point, right?

Hey, it's a learning experience. Just be aware of things like this, OK?


--(G)GGG

[GoatGal]

John,

Could you please go to your "Profile" setup and add a signature similar to what I have?

Ages, dates, children, etc. It helps all of us keep things straight.


Thanks!

[edz]

Hi John

just catching up with your thread, some parallels to mine sounds like we've been at this about the same time as well. Check out my posts as it looks like I did a lot of the same things you did at the begining, the people here are great as you've found out. The most important thing to remember (and boy do I try) is no matter what you do YOU can only change YOU and the relationships YOU have with others. You can build your relationship with your kids (again see my thread) and you can change your behavior but theres nothing you can do, think, say or otherwise project that can get you into or change your W's mind. Just work on you and hang in there.

And never forget sandis rules (said by someone who sometimes forgets all of them - DOH!)

Ed

First Thread
Eds Thread 1 (August 2014)

[JohnJC]

@Goat: Your two cents is always welcome!

I will get my son some pants. That’s not it. It just seems like the few times we actually have any sort of conversation, it ends up with her proclaiming something about her monetary troubles, like its exclusively MY fault that were under such financial stress. I guess my frustration and resentment about the situation makes me keep going back to the thought of, “Well, this is what you did. Face up to it and realize the fallout you created.” I guess her continuous denial that her actions had any negative repercussion on any one but me make me…well, angry. I’m likely too sensitive about it, as the denial is thick, but I can’t help it. But I don’t show it. But I do need to learn how to detach.

And, yes, the boy is ours. We have two step daughters (her’s from her 1st marriage; this is my first marriage her second). He is our only biological child together.

I always try to be polite and caring towards her. That part is not hard. I do love her with all my heart. When I say I hope she has a nice day, I always mean it. I always have. I just wish she would return it, even just a little. It just hurts that were together for so long and she chooses to be this way. I know that I should not try to make sense of it – quite a few good folks on here have told me this – I just wish it was…different. It doesn’t need to be this way.

It is, indeed, a learning experience. But I do feel like I’m cramming to pass the quiz sometimes. And that I’m going to fail it no matter what I do. But I won’t stop trying.

Thank you, Goat. I sincerely appreciate your perspective.

@EDZ: Thank you very much. I’ll have to take a look at your thread as well (thank you for the link). I’ve been reading the first book and I have studied Sandi’s rules (she’s been nice enough to pass on some amazing insight and advice on my thread as well). The outward stuff is where I’ve been focused; the inner stuff is just not doable for me at the moment, to much turmoil in my psyche, but I am trying to make it into something I can accomplish. I will get there, I;m sure, but its going to be a very long road.

[JohnJC]

Went to pick up my son last night and actually had a brief, but nice, conversation with my wife. No meanness or talk of money...it was such a small thing, but made me feel good. I did leave before I blurted out anything stupid.

She sent me a message later on that although I was supposed to have my son all day that she would need to pick him up for his counseling session in the morning. I was going to reply later on, but i forgot. She called and texted me back ad midnight to remind me again. I didn't reply...no to be mean-spirited, but because I so badly wanted to start a conversation.

They are at the appointment right now and I'm filled with feelings of missing her so much. I know, if this works at all, that its going to be a long road. But I just wish I knew if a reconciliation is even possible. My feelings for her, something I used to consider a strength and something that brought me strength, is now my ultimate weakness.

A glimmer of hope would be very welcome.