I'm getting it! I plan to begin gathering the knowledge I'll need to proceed here. I'm going to have my case evaluated and find out what my options are.
I haven't been whining and pleading. I've been upbeat and positive. She knows that I have the potential to be very strong and take charge. She's been with me for 12 years.
Vince B M=10 yrs T=13 yrs M45 / H 44 2 Boys 5 & 8 D Day: 7/16/13
1. Get legal advice, fast. 2. Do not pursue your wife. 3. Show back-bone and resolve. 4. Believe that she wants a divorce.
If she sees you are preparing yourself, emotionally and practically, for a divorce, she will realize she's playing for keeps. You won't come back crawling to her. Her actions have consequences. This will show strength. Don't be an a**hole, but, remember, you are not her best friend or husband anymore, not UNTIL she says she wants back in to the marriage. She just came off an emotional affair(probably a physical affair).
Start using the Last Resort Technique.
Decide you can "wait" in terms of divorce action for a limited amount of time. If she's pressing for a divorce and you are dragging your feet, (either trying to save the marriage OR not sure what you want) it will get ugly.
Most importantly, under the assumption that you are getting a divorce, be clear and know WHAT YOU WANT. I kid you not. Don't be ambiguous.
If you are not rich, you can't afford a knock-down contested divorce in court. So...once you know what you want, make your wife an offer and stick to it. If she doesn't accept your proposal then get yourself 2 Lawyers to agree to practice collaborative law (who refuse to go to court and fight. It's a form of divorce law.) If they do that, find a good mediator, come up to a fair agreement, and then have a lawyer look over the agreement and sign.
Your wife's good will now (pretending not to want anything3) will erode once she's talked to a lawyer.
Now here's my personal observation. I've been on the DB boards a lot in the old days. You've had the Divorce Remedy in hand the first time around, you went to Retrouvaille and did some triage in the marriage after the first affair. The marriage deteriorated again and she's in a second affair and wants out AGAIN.
I've seen this scenario several times. Even Divorce Busting superstars (who used to coach us with their success stories) who saved their marriage the first time COULD NOT do it a second time. Their wives wanted out, and cheated, AGAIN. It plays out one of two ways: you either hold on to a spouse who wants out and end up losing everything (including your house) OR you accept that this person doesn't want to be married to you and isn't faithful, and you move on successfully through a fair settlement and divorce. I know two superstar divorce busters who ended up in divorces the SECOND time their spouses chose to cheat. One ended up frozen like a deer in the headlights and lost his house, the other actually "led" his wife through the divorce and came out a champ.
Sorry to say this, but a repeat cheater is not likely to be a good long-term spouse. It's not about you, dude, it's about her.
On a more personal note, I was lucky. I came out with a good settlement. Shared child custody, paying minimal child-support and no alimony. I thought I busted my divorce. Then a couple of years later she wanted out again and started cheating. My only regret: not having divorced her the FIRST time around. I wasted years of my life.
1. Get legal advice, fast. 2. Do not pursue your wife. 3. Show back-bone and resolve. 4. Believe that she wants a divorce.
If she sees you are preparing yourself, emotionally and practically, for a divorce, she will realize she's playing for keeps. You won't come back crawling to her. Her actions have consequences. This will show strength. Don't be an a**hole, but, remember, you are not her best friend or husband anymore, not UNTIL she says she wants back in to the marriage. She just came off an emotional affair(probably a physical affair).
Start using the Last Resort Technique.
Decide you can "wait" in terms of divorce action for a limited amount of time. If she's pressing for a divorce and you are dragging your feet, (either trying to save the marriage OR not sure what you want) it will get ugly.
Most importantly, under the assumption that you are getting a divorce, be clear and know WHAT YOU WANT. I kid you not. Don't be ambiguous.
If you are not rich, you can't afford a knock-down contested divorce in court. So...once you know what you want, make your wife an offer and stick to it. If she doesn't accept your proposal then get yourself 2 Lawyers to agree to practice collaborative law (who refuse to go to court and fight. It's a form of divorce law.) If they don't do that in your state, find a good mediator, come up to a fair agreement, and then have a lawyer look over the agreement and sign.
Your wife's good will now (pretending not to want anything3) will erode once she's talked to a lawyer.
Now here's my personal observation. I've been on the DB boards a lot in the old days. You've had the Divorce Remedy in hand the first time around, you went to Retrouvaille and did some triage in the marriage after the first affair. The marriage deteriorated again and she's in a second affair and wants out AGAIN.
I've seen this scenario several times. Even Divorce Busting superstars (who used to coach us with their success stories) who saved their marriage the first time COULD NOT do it a second time. Their wives wanted out, and cheated, AGAIN. It plays out one of two ways: you either hold on to a spouse who wants out and end up losing everything (including your house) OR you accept that this person doesn't want to be married to you and isn't faithful, and you move on successfully through a fair settlement and divorce. I know two superstar divorce busters who ended up in divorces the SECOND time their spouses chose to cheat. One ended up frozen like a deer in the headlights and lost his house, the other actually "led" his wife through the divorce and came out a champ.
Sorry to say this, but a repeat cheater is not likely to be a good long-term spouse. It's not about you, dude, it's about her.
On a more personal note, I was lucky. I came out with a good settlement. Shared child custody, paying minimal child-support and no alimony. I thought I busted my divorce. Then a couple of years later she wanted out again and started cheating. My only regret: not having divorced her the FIRST time around. I wasted years of my life.
I'm getting there. This is a very troubled women, my W. She has struggled her whole life with esteem, identity, searching for this unattainable "happiness" she claims is eluding her.
I think I'm coming to terms with the fact that she IS going to divorce me. I'm not going to push it, but when the time comes and she requests info or documents, I'll comply.
I'll meet with an attorney and learn my options.
At some point, she'll be faced with the real truth and suffer for her decisions. Any negative impact that our children experince as a result of her desires and actions will fall directly on her.
My position will always be, I don't want this and never did.
Vince B M=10 yrs T=13 yrs M45 / H 44 2 Boys 5 & 8 D Day: 7/16/13
Remember, do the Last Resort Technique for your own sanity, health and self-respect. Read it again. Read it closely. It's how to act WHEN your spouse says she wants a divorce.
You can take a *little* time to wait. There might be small window where this might change her perspective. Chances are, it won't. Wait a *little* while. I'd say no more than a month.
However, you can't sit there and passively respond to her initiatives to move forward with a divorce. The longer you wait and drag your heels, and the more the initiative she feels she has to take in divorcing you, the more she'll be in the driver's seat. This means she is more likely to engage a shark for a lawyer and then you'll end up in an adversarial divorce, constantly on the defensive. Remember, your dynamic up till now has been her DRIVING the change, upsetting the apple cart and you RESPONDING (often in fear, desperation, being off-balance).
You said you will wait for her to divorce you and then you will comply. NO!!! Don't just comply. Decide what YOUR post-divorce life should look like and then move in that direction. Move forward in your divorce, don't get dragged into it kicking and screaming or even stoically. Once she's clearly on the path to divorce, YOU take control and lead her through it, to your desired ends.
Remember, the emotional stance, "I don't want this and never did" is what you feel NOW. It's normal. You are probably experiencing some kind of PSTD. However, it's a complacent stance and rather debilitating when it comes to advocating for your own rights and desires. When you get to the point where you have accepted that you are getting a divorce AND realize you deserve better than a cheating spouse, your attitude will change. There's a great website to help with this, it's called Chump Lady. It's very funny but quite empowering, check it out when you have the time.
On a personal note. I suggest you go see a solid therapist for yourself. Someone that can help you process your feelings and give you the courage and clarity to advocate for yourself and the children.
Well, it seems that at least some aspect of reality is beginning to ebb its way into my W brain.
She is realizing how her finances are going to be effected by her decision to leave our M.
After she started her new job, I mentioned that it would be nice if she would contribute to the general expense of operating the household. She stated that she planned to just as soon as she took care of some looming expenses of her own that had piled up.
So, our understanding was she would begin to cut me a check each time she got paid. Well, since then, she dropped the bomb and when I asked for a check last night she wrote out a check for a lesser amount than we had discussed. When I brought it to her attention, she became bothered and silent.
Later, after we put the kids to bed, I asked her if there was something I did to put her in a foul mood. She paused, and said no. She was bothered because a) earlier, she explained why the check was less because she had some expenses she needed to cover and was angry at herself for sharing her personal financial business with me. b) she's realizing that moving forward with her plan is going to effect her significantly financially.
I thought to myself, duh! Of course this is going to effect you financially...emotionally, psychologically, spiritually, socially, as well as your relationship with our kids.
I could sense how quickly she is capable of snapping into the mode of a raving witch as well.
Now I'll need to play this cool and lean toward the "LRT", allowing her to come into her own with regard to how all her brilliant decisions are going to come to fruition and how they will effect her the rest of her eternally happy life, away from me.
Vince B M=10 yrs T=13 yrs M45 / H 44 2 Boys 5 & 8 D Day: 7/16/13
W and I have discussed what we both see in the near future. we want a minimal disruption to our two boy's lives.
W suggested a "nesting" type separation where each of us goes away for a few days at a time while the other remains with the kids, giving them a solid, comfortable and safe home.
At this point, she said she has not filed for a D and for the time being, we can see how this works out until we decide on anything long-term or permanent.
I'm open to this idea, as it does allow us time apart without paralizing both of us financailly.
I met with an attorney who advicates for men in divorce. It's essentially a fairly cut and dry scenario as we live in a no-fault state. If W and I can come to terms re: who gets what and who goes where, the court will accept our terms and sign off on it. With regard to her affair, he said that may be considered in a settlement, should it become adversarial, but only minimally. He did mention that we could subpoena the two douche bags who W had A with as a "negotiating tool".
My desire is to keep the house and have W find another place as she is the one who wants out. The attorney said because of her very poor credit history, she would be unable to refinance the house, which is in my favor.
W has also stated that she doesn't want my money (401(k), IRA, etc.)or stuff and I don't want hers either.
I guess we'll see how things go before any drastic decisons are made. So far, we have all been existing in a very amicable and friendly way.
She shares her events of the day with me, we both prepare and serve dinner to the family. We went to the cider mill for a nice Fall outing last weekend. We're all going to my sister's big Halloween party for this weekend.
I'm trying to give her space and not prying anymore, as I know that really pisses her off and is one of the reasons she stated in her letter for not wanting to be with me.
So, for now it seems ok, but I don't know when or if she'll file for D.
Vince B M=10 yrs T=13 yrs M45 / H 44 2 Boys 5 & 8 D Day: 7/16/13
I've been feeling alot of anger over the past few weeks. I'm realizing that W is going to file for D. She has begun to close herself off a bit and doesn't share much with me.
We are in separate bedrooms and I get a generic good night and hi in the morning.
I've found literature and pricing on condos, townhouses and storage units among her stuff. She's also gotten together with a handful of her girlfriends, individually, for lunch over the past couple of weeks. Two of whom encouraged her to leave me during her first affair.
So, I can assume she's looking for support and encouragement that she's doing the right thing. And, I'm sure she's getting plenty of their blind guidence!
I saw a text to one that said she's looking for a place and will file for D soon.
So, that's where I am. I spoke to an attorney and got some info, but I can't afford the $5,000-$7,000 to retain him. I've been looking online at a free divorce guidence site which provides the forms and information for answering a divorce complaint and countersuits.
Still hoping W is planning to leave my assets alone and not challenge my staying in the house.
I'm a little confused on how to behave right now. Should I try to talk to her about her plans and hammer out some agreements?
Maybe go dim and act like I'm on my own?
I don't know. Suggestions??
Vince B M=10 yrs T=13 yrs M45 / H 44 2 Boys 5 & 8 D Day: 7/16/13
