Becoming PatientMan II - Still En-Route, Post-D

[uRworthy]

Hiya, PM. Thought I'd say hi and make some comments, if I may.

Ok, so I'm thinking that if your xw tells you she wants to be on her own, that you need to let her be. You are divorced. This is what she wanted. She needs to live that.

And as a girl, I will tell you that you always being there has the potential to keep you in the friend zone, ya know?

You have to do what is best for you. And I think that this is keeping you stuck.

It doesnt mean that you cant be friendly. It just means that you are letting her live the life she chose and that you are moving forward in yours.

If in the future, there is a mutual decision to move towards each other, than, that is something to deal with at that time.

But I'm not sure how to handle the potential, "Want to do something/come over and hang out?" question that could very well pop up.

Um, how about, sorry, sounds great, but, maybe another time, I've got some plans. And make some:)[/quote]

I guess I'm just scared of creating distance, which in my case probably stems from insecurity.

I think you might be right. Sounds like something you need to work on, right?
No one knows what the future holds, PM. But for right now, your focus needs to be on you and your daughters.

I understand you dont have a lot of time. But you are going to have some soon. And you know, it doesnt have to be anything huge that you do for yourself, PM. Your life cant be just work, school and your children. You have a right to have something just for you.

[PatientMan]

Hiya, PM. Thought I'd say hi and make some comments, if I may.

Thanks.

Ok, so I'm thinking that if your xw tells you she wants to be on her own, that you need to let her be. You are divorced. This is what she wanted. She needs to live that.

I agree. She is sending me mixed messages by divorcing me yet still reaching out to me for support. Why is she reaching out to me?

I think she is lonely. (She doesn't really have any local friends or a support group or a therapist.)
I think I make her comfortable and secure.
I think she still has feelings for me.

BUT, and this is what I have to keep hammering into my own head, SHE DIVORCED ME, so she has to live with the consequences of that. DIVORCING ME means she doesn't want that support that a husband would give...that I *want* to give.

I think her response to this would be that she is just looking for support from a friend, which is what she says she wants to be. And if she needs a friend, it kills me to have to say I can't even be that, but I guess it's just one of those "it is what it is" situations. Maybe we can be friends, but I don't think right now...at least not in the way she is dictating it.

I think you and sandi2 and everyone else who has said it is right. As hard as it is to do, I have to let her live with the consequences of divorcing me, which means I won't be there for support.

Of course, this means she'll go looking for support elsewhere, and I hate that too, but I guess that's the part that *I* have to live with.

I guess it's just me fooling myself. I see her reaching out and I perceive it as some shred of hope, so I cling to it. Really, she just needs support to help her through this tough time. And I guess that can't be me.

Why is it so difficult for me to cut off the person that has treated me this way? This is so irrational!

*I* would be the one to do all the work to help her through all of this, and once she's back up on her feet she's going to be looking elsewhere for a mate (based on the presumption of divorce). Why should I do all the work and let someone else reap all the benefits?

Other than I love her and I'm a sucker, of course.

And as a girl, I will tell you that you always being there has the potential to keep you in the friend zone, ya know?

Good point, though it should be noted that's how most of her relationships have started. But to carry over from what I said above, we can be friends one day, but it will just take some time.

You have to do what is best for you. And I think that this is keeping you stuck.

Yeah. I guess I just don't know how to let go.

It doesn't mean that you cant be friendly. It just means that you are letting her live the life she chose and that you are moving forward in yours.

That's the message I need to convey/reenforce. I just need to figure out how to word it so I don't sound like a jerk.

But I'm not sure how to handle the potential, "Want to do something/come over and hang out?" question that could very well pop up.

Um, how about, sorry, sounds great, but, maybe another time, I've got some plans. And make some:)[/

I really need/do better with a set of rules or a list to go by my mind gets spinning so easily. For however long a time period, should I just be unavailable? E.g. For the next two months, no hanging out with XW?

I understand you dont have a lot of time. But you are going to have some soon. And you know, it doesnt have to be anything huge that you do for yourself, PM. Your life cant be just work, school and your children. You have a right to have something just for you.[/color]

You're right, and any response I have is just whining so I'll spare the bandwidth.

Thank you for your thoughts.

-PM

[PatientMan]

I need to figure out how to structure what I need to say this weekend - about boundaries and about me and XW going forward. If I'm left without some key points in my mind (both Do's and Don'ts), my words could wander and I could say something I don't want to.

Can you all help with some ideas? How to frame what I need to say?

-PM

[PatientMan]

I'm so tired of this cr@p. It's 100% effort 100% of the time and I just get to a point where I'm fed up with it. I feel like I'm unraveling today. I'm not taking care of what I need to take care of and I don't seem to care. And I know I'll regret this later, so I'm stuck...always stuck. Whether I'm stuck going 100% or stuck because I feel guilty I slipped up and didn't go 100%. It's either 100% or circling the toilet bowl of depression if I don't go 100%.

I need to keep my schedule to stay on track and hold myself accountable. I just really REALLY don't want to. So I've either gotta force myself to do something I don't want to do, or regret it later.

Unraveling.

What I'm doing isn't working. In any sense of any positive goal. Am I being impatient, or do I need to change?

I want to tell XW to go have a fun life. Peace out. I hope you find happiness, I really do, but you will never find someone who loves you and our children like I do. But you want to divorce me? BYE!

But that isn't very nice. And it certainly doesn't keep the road paved home smooth.

I think I'm obsessed with keeping the road paved home smooth...TOO smooth. I use it to justify unproductive behavior.

I also think I'm trying to control things so that she has limited opportunities to seek out other men.

Because *I* want her, for me. And I don't like who I am, especially without her, so I put up with her cr@p - just for the illusory chance that things will get fixed one day.

I don't know how to let go. I don't know how to move forward and past her. Maybe I can't the way I'm set up right now and I just keep running into a brick wall I've created for myself.

I really don't care what XW is doing right now. I just know that I'm hurting and I'm tired of it. And I've worked so hard, and tried so hard, and prayed, and all the things I'm supposed to do...and it's getting me nowhere. But no, I'm not sitting here giving one effing iota what she is doing or thinking right now.

I don't know why this woman has this spell over me - still, after all of this. I don't know if she's manipulating me or is just truly lost and looking to me for guidance. Should I step up and lead, or get out of the way completely?

I know my family - the family I created - is gone.

I just want to tell her to leave me alone. But that's one of those things that I'll end up regretting, so I'm stuck. Perpetually stuck.

And I'm tired. Unraveling towards broken.

-PM

[PatientMan]

More thieving from Crimson's thread:

2thepoint:
"Argh! Crimson! Do you not get it? I know you do but your words reflect otherwise.

Let me quote for you an important part of Sandi's last post to you:

Something I believe all WAW’s have to experience (and MWD agrees) is that they have to suffer some type of loss due to their decision to walk away from the M. Even if she never physically leaves the home, she needs to experience and take responsibility of whatever it is she has lost. It could be her reputation, or a relationship with her children, or her H moving on, or a number of things. But it needs to be severe enough that it works much like the bomb did to you. That is why the LBH is so motivated to work on the M...b/c it is a wake-up call, while the WAW has no motivation to work at all.

The fact that she attempted was progress made in the right direction. But if she doesn't get that wake-up call, you may be doing this same thing for a long time...or until you just crash & burn and can’t do it any longer.

You have to let her go. Completely! Cut off all but the most critical contact. Move on with your life. Let her feel the pain of her decisions and yours.

Do you remember Bustorama's post about what eventually triggered his WAW's return? He told his W very directly, to stop all contact unless it was an emergency related to the kids. If she had an emergency and it didn't affect the kids, he didn't want to hear about it. When kid exchanges occurred, he never went into the house. In fact he made a point of picking up and dropping the kids off at school so he did not have to have any interaction whatsoever with his W. He stopped doing any type of family activities with her. He basically cut her completely out of his life and he moved on. And it was only after he did all that did she finally wake up!

That is what Sandi is saying to you here. Let her go. It is your only hope to open her heart. She has to feel the loss, completely and finally.

Can you do it?"

[PatientMan]

So I'm trying to figure out how to approach the "boundaries" talk this weekend, and you probably wouldn't believe it, but I got nothing. I can't figure out what I want to say and how I want to say it. I've got so much coming from so many different places...I'm speechless.

Any help?

-PM

[ALF213]

I wish I could help, PM. I don't have the experience to give you any advice. Just stopping in to see how things are going. You've accomplished some pretty great things throughout your sitch. You're strong, you'll get through this. The only person stopping you, is you.

[Bel123]

PM- I can really feel your pain and frustration with your XW and yourself. Sometimes, I want to give up and move on as well. I usually have the tendency to keep it all in and it eats me up from the inside. That's when the angry, resentful, confrontational Bel comes out like I am seeing on your last two posts. I've also found it these emotions were triggered not only W's actions but of my expectations as well. I honestly don't really know what the solution is but I know what we are doing here in learning to work through these feelings is the right way to become a happier person at the end. I do believe you are on the right path and whatever direction you choose to go, I am sure your self-reflection and improvements will carry with you for life. Keep your head up PM!

[Bel123]

PM- Not that I have much experience in setting up boundaries but maybe if you list some of the ones that you are thinking off, the folks here can comment on it. Or are you asking people here to give your boundary ideas? Which I don’t think is what you are saying.

[jp787]

PM - I feel for you. I am at a very similar place as far as being frustrated and lost.

I know I need serious work on me and that I need to do it, not talk about it.

I know I need to let go of my rope and do my work.

I know...

I feel like if I let go, I will loose her. I can't keep going on like I am, yet I do.

To really find our way, to really fix ourselves we have to break the pattern, so that we can allow change.

Will our W forget us? No. Will they move on? That is the unknown, the fear that cripples us. I am starting to see it as an addiction for me. I mean how messed up is it that we can't can't live our life for us? Don't get me wrong PM, I am talking about me, maybe you too idk.

Boundaries. Those are difficult.

I am working with my therapist to create some that I need and how to work them so that they do not sound controlling or like ultimatums.

Dig Deep, you are just on a down part of the roller coaster. You have gone through a huge change and are bound to have extreme emotions.