and I think an important thing to note in my sitch is... what I GOT now... is something that I wanted 6 months ago... and I'm not sure I want it NOW...
So I think what the message I want to get to you at this moment zig, is that what you think you want NOW... may not be what you want in the future... that's all well and good and live in the now...
But what you get in the future will be an artefact of what you are working on, right now...
IOW, if you are working on getting some distance and some peace and quiet and distance from your H RIGHT NOW... you will likely get it... later... when what you want later... will be more connection with your H... whether he is still your H... or by that time your X...
So work NOW... plan NOW... be clear NOW... about what you think you might want in the future...
KD and cat04 - are you both trying to tell me that if i want closeness with h in the future, i should not pull back and take space now, but work on the closeness now - i'm so confused by both your posts.
cat - i thought you were referring to kd's quote - now, i don't know what either of you are trying to say
will try to write more later zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
I will try to clarify (I was actually referring to KD's quote BTW)
When I was in the throws of everything, it was really easy to say "I don't want separation". "I don't want to be upset anymore." "I don't want this change."
It was easy to say "I want my H back."
The drawback...
My H was full of spew, angry, mean, and had a sense of humor that I didn't appreciate, listened to music that I didn't like, and generally was so completly opposite what he had been, so when I was honest with myself, I didn't want THAT H back. I didn't want THAT M back.
I was changing. And I knew things would have to be different.
I was coming to a point where I started to question what I would say IF my X wanted to come back.
So I took H, the person, out of the equation.
I began to decide what I wanted ANY future R to look like, what I wanted ANY future man to be like. Whether it was H or someone else...
I just believed that when the time came for ANY man to be a part of my life again, I would know that I was making a good decision for me, not settling for any reason.
So I decided I wanted a relationship with a man. (No real idea WHO the man was, could have been Kevin Costner for all I knew.)
I decided what I wanted that relationship to look like, what sort of treatment I would need...
I decided what qualities the man would have to have in order to be the "right" man...
And then I continued on my path, just becoming a better person, living MY life and when it was time for a man to re-enter my life, it happened and it fit my picture of what I wanted and needed. It was an easy choice to make to let him into my life.
Zig,
You aren't quite there yet...no offense...
However, you can do what Kaffe suggests and understand that what you want right NOW, what you work towards right NOW, which is some detatchment and peace for yourself, may not be what you find yourself wanting down the road. And then you begin working toward the new goal.
Right now, you work towards the goal of closeness in the future, by working on you, getting your self esteem back, getting out of the drama, so that if the time comes in the future for closeness, you are healthy and able to participate in it.
Does that make any sense?
"Acceptance doesn't mean resignation. It means understanding that something is what it is and there's got to be a way through it."--Michael J. Fox
hi labug - thanks for checking in. i'm okay - just trying to get ready for my sale this friday. i have a lot of posts to reply and catch up with, but i think i just needed a bit of a break from all of this.
great 180 yesterday though - i mowed the lawn - which in and of itself was i suppose not such a big deal for most people, but for me was huge - physically as well as emotionally
h arrived to pick up s while i was mowing - i didn't stop but finished it off - in fact asked him to move the hose, while i finished.
i sensed that he was stunned - he's sort of been holding that over me: "your'e so helpless i really need to come over and mow your lawn" type of thing.
well, now i'm not!!
if he asks me about it later - which i think he might - i'm just going to say casually - well, you have your own house to take care off soon, so i'm just making sure i can take care of mine. - ooh yuck that didn't sound very good..
any suggestions?
how are you doing, labug? hope you're well
right now, i'm working on my "reactions" - learning to see where the triggers are and immediately deflecting them, as soon as i can. it's helping me a lot to stay in a good place.
zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
sorry i haven't replied for so long - when i read your post - i knew that i wasn't in the state of mind to really hear what you were saying - i'm not sure i am completely in it now either
sigh...
h pulled me into a conversation today and even though i have spent the whole week before this, really working on not reacting, i found myself feeling a bit crushed by the conversation
i'm reading MWD's chapter on last resort technique tonight - and then really wondering:
is it pursuing or chasing in some form, when i say to h "i respect that you don't want us to be together, even though i would prefer to see us work it out?" is that putting pressure on him and chasing him?
am i sabotaging my own efforts?
interesting pattern here: every time i do a significant 180 - we have this messed up conversation which doesn't go anywhere.
except then, this time, he's insisting that we talk - is that a baby step?
is he just checking the temp as they say?
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
today he said again , after almost 3 weeks that he wanted to talk together - i pointed out that he said that already and made no move to do it, so i understood from his actions that he didn't really want to.
i sort of got into a slight 'nothing left to lose' state of mind (carefully) and said that i was very conflicted about what I wanted here - after he asked me how i saw this thing between us panning out - i said that i had no expectations either way and was taking one day at a time and working on myself.
i told him that i didn't really understand what he was trying to ask me. that i had got the message loud and clear last week about what he wanted - so what was he asking me for now. he said he didn't know
at some point he reverted to the old everything was wrong with our marriage and said that the reason it didn't work right from the beginning was because "you weren't ready for a relationship"
i guess i'd had it - and replied calmly that i was tired of being the one entirely to blame for our problems and frankly i was stunned that after all these months he still felt that way. that i too had been disappointed - not just him, and that i had also been deeply affected by what happened. he said well i know it wasn't' all your fault, i've said that, and i said no you haven't - you've sort of implied it and then gone back to pointing the finger at me. you haven't owned your part in any real way
i pointed out that even though he said that he wants to resolve the conflicts between us i had no idea what he meant because as far as i could see, he'd cancelled them all with his decisions. i also pointed out at some point that he was pulling all the strings in this sitch, by deciding what he was doing, and that to stop talking as if these were all mutual decisions that we had made together.
he did ask if we could talk together - next week after my show was finished and i had more time. i said that was fine, but that i expected him to call and ask since he is the one saying he wants to do it.
towards the end i brought up what had happened between s and me yesterday - how s used the same strategy he does and that i'm sick and tired of being treated that way. i told him that i had told s that he and his dad should sit down together and talk about why they do that with me and make me the bad guy - when my only intention is to please them and do things that make them happy - if only they asked clearly for it. how they sabotaged their own efforts at the very happiness they wanted by twisting it and putting the blame on me - that they didn't trust that i would respect what they wanted, and so instead of just asking for it, they created this messy situation where everyone landed up feeling terrible.
s pulled the same thing that h did last week. said something to me, and then the next day, insisted that he didn't and started blaming me for remembering wrong. s and i talked and i explained to him that if he wanted something then he was to say it loud and clear - and if he changed his mind, he could say i've changed my mind, not instead insist "you didn't remember it right", and keep arguing and then acting angry or being a martyr about it. at some point i out and out asked s - do you know someone else who does this same exact thing - and he replied without hesitation - his father! that's when i told him that maybe the two of them could sit and talk about why they feel the need to do this .
when i told h about this, i was thinking he would be angry, but instead i think i got through and he replied that he really really wanted to talk about this more, but he had to walk into a meeting right then (he was at work, and he called me) and could we talk about this later. i said that was fine.
he keeps saying he wants to be friends and not have any angst between us.i managed to point out to him and he agreed that the angst was on his part - and after a bit of gentle prodding, he admitted that he felt great guilt, and that even though he's brought up the divorce he doesn't want to hurt me. that even though we are not together he cares about me and it does concern him a lot that even though he wants a divorce he doesn't want to leave me high and dry like he doesn't care. i just responded that i knew he cared about me a lot and that this was of course very difficult for him, but that he should do what he truly wants to do. later in the conversation, i pointed out to him, that more than the angst, it was his deep anger that was standing between us- and that it was there all the time and i felt it very strongly
i got the feeling that he was trying to take the divorce thing back, without saying it outright - oh hell - who knows!
sorry for the extremely long rant. i don't know if i just bunged it up fro good - or if something got through.
i can SEE the pattern - but i can't seem to get myself OUT of it. i haven't reacted as strongly as i did in the past - but strong enough that the rest of the afternoon, i was unable to focus. and i am mad at myself - why do i let him pull me into his drama? i told myself earlier this week - be careful, keep your distance - he will try to sabotage your week - just before your show - and that's just what has happened and i've let him.
does this smack completely of co-dependence ?
sorry for the long long rant - just had to get it off my chest
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
i know KD - i see what you're saying - and i can almost feel it, but not quite. i still want to reconcile our marriage, and even though all this crazy stuff is going on right now, my deep deep instinct is telling me to stay calm and wait a bit longer.
he screaming louder than before - almost as if he is trying to convince himself - and that's different from before , in some way that i can't quite put my finger on.
i asked him during the conversation today whether it would make him feel better if i agreed with everything he was doing. he immediately replied no!
lots of mixed messages. and in spite of his actions -and all the stuff he is saying - there is something telling me that he is just trying the very first steps of just starting to feel his way back in.
i may be way, way off base here - but i want to see where this goes - before i decide for myself . i need advice on what to say when he keeps screaming how right this is for all of us (i did tell him today, that he should speak for himself and not use s and me as justifying why he should leave) - am i being too blunt, outspoken?
i know that there are good things for me - either way this goes - of that, i am becoming surer each day. this marriage is not the be-all and end-all for me.
i'm getting my life back, and would like to share it with this man - but as cat04 pointed out - what i'm seeing in h's behavior during this sitch - yuck - i don't want that.
each day i find out more and more what i need to work on within myself, and i am focusing on that as much as i can. my reactivity - emotionally , to everything is way over the top and i really need to be much much less of that.
of course right now, i feel incredibly vulnerable, both with s and h and even find myself getting emotional if i feel the slightest rejection from s. i have to be careful about that - i am focusing on how neither of them are responsible for my happiness.
i guess the divorce conversation - or barrage - really brought a lot up in me. to have to deal with all of what's been going on, to have made enormous effort to keeping peaceful for all 3 of us in spite of everything and then to have the divorce thing yelled at me over the phone in a bout of deep anger really pained me.
respect and trust - those are definitely at the top of my list of things that i DO want.
oh well - tomorrow is another day and at least until friday and my show is over, i will NOT deal with h in anyway except to do with son.
thanks kd for all your help zig
me 46 H 38 M10yrs T 11 S10 BD ow 8/11 h filed 9/25/12
"if i could define enlightenment briefly, i would say it is the quiet acceptance of what is"
Hey Zig, I've been waiting for you to come back so I could share a thread that I'm finding really helpful in dealing with the mlc stuff that my H has been displaying.
Given the parallels between our sitches, I thought you would find it useful too.
Warning - it's a very long set of posts, but it is SO worthwhile to read from start to finish - and the best thing is, Ta Da: there's a happy ending!
Anyway, have a look at AliSuddenly's story - for me it's been a sanity-saver.
It's in piecing and, as she documents in painful detail, there often seemed to be absolutely no hope along the way.
