Well, reconciliation isn't in the picture now like I figured it might be. Her short lived re-love wasn't real and she won't be moving back in. I did a fishing experiment and she was quick to say she wouldn't be coming back.
W has expressed again her desire to go to MC after the LS is completed. My IC / Our previous MC has decided it's not about getting a S anymore, it's all about her being able to stand on her feet on her own so she can decide to re-enter the R and M.
W is not completely shut down on me yet I suppose. I'm still out there GAL and detaching as best I can from the sitch.
After my epic hospital stay of 5 days W has seemed to be warm to me and seems to want to spend time with me. She invited me earlier in the week to a movie/dinner with S4 on Friday night and I accepted. We went out for quick dinner and a kid's movie. Had a good time.
It appears I'm being tested again, which is fine. She keeps testing me to see if I will "be a good man". Honestly, I've done some pretty sh!tty things to her throughout this separation in her mind. Some legitimate, some not. She has made it very clear that she doesn't like they way I treat her and that is the only reason she isn't willing to try for this M. Otherwise, "If you prove you are a good man we can talk about our R then."
It's a little hogwash, but partly true. I've come to realize I'm a pretty retaliatory person when I am hurt or perceive to be hurt. I've said some pretty awful things to her when letting my emotions run rampant.
That hasn't worked so far... shutting her out. It's probably because I am not successful at LOVINGLY detaching. I've either been hot or cold. All over the map and never consistent. I either shut her completely out and am somewhat cold, distant, angry and retaliatory against her... or I am pining away for her and asking her to come home.
It's all a learning process I suppose about what to do and what not to do. That's what DB is in my case. I have a W who is way out of wack emotionally and is not very mature. For some reason I am starting to believe that the fact that I do not DB properly (lovingly) combined with the fact she's a wild card all the time makes this incredibly hard for my sitch. But, maybe I'll learn something along the way.
She started saying ILY to me about a week ago, and has been saying it ever since. She hasn't said that in almost 2 months. I know I shouldn't take that with much but it does feel different.
I just need to get all of this legal crap out of the way. It really is what we've been fighting about this whole time, each of us trying to leverage emotions against each other so we can get the "best deal". Once that is out of the way there isn't much to hold over each other's head... which I'm definitely guilty of.
Throughout all of this I've discovered that I'm still not the person that I want to be. I am still manipulative in the fact that I use my financial position and business affluence to negotiate, sometimes unfairly, a deal between us when her stance most of the time has been that all she wants is to be able not to starve. A lot of you here will comment on that and say that I'm being manipulated myself. In reality, I'm the one trying to punish her still for leaving in any way I can, including trying to make her starve for this crap she's done. Legally, I can make that happen with no problem. But that doesn't make me a "good man", and shows her more of the same behavior pre-bomb. Selfishness, controlling, manipulation. And then I hide behind the law because it's OK for me to do so.
Regardless if that's legally OK to do or not, I don't think that is the man I want to be. I also don't want to be a doormat. But, I negotiate in my job for a living and always start from a very strong perspective. I'm good at it, too. My business practices which aren't practical for a personal relationship have bled into that part of my life and some is good - but not in this sitch. With me being as good as I am at what I do professionally, it has been overkill in a R. I've come to discover that about who I am. And, I don't like that.
I'll probably continue to be tested, and that is fine. I've failed almost every test along the way with the exception of last night with the dinner/movie. After the movie we all walked outside and she was carrying S4 to the car. It was very cold so I took off my pea-coat and put it over them. She resisted at first, but then S4 grabbed onto it and she pulled it closer over them. When she got into the car she took my coat and wrapped it around her. This may seem stupid to all of you, but this is very very unlike my W. She always refused gestures like this, especially as of late. Something about her wanting to feel independent and not needing me. After I dropped her off she thanked me for giving her my coat. That is highly unusual as well. She never says thankyou.
It may all seem small and petty to you here, but that's the man I want to be. That's the man I was before all this mess and before my W and I started having problems. I was a much better man then - I just lost my way.
Her car has been acting up lately and had to take it into the shop. Actually, it's my car pre-marital that she has... been having some problems as of late. I talked to her today about dropoff of S4 with me and she said that the car had been stalling again. I asked her to tell me what was going on, so she described the problems. I told her it sounded like the fuel injector had a problem.... and then she started to ask something and stopped. I told her to keep going - and she reluctantly said that she had done some googling and it might be the PCV valve. I told her that it wasn't a big thing to fix at all. She then asked if I could take a look at it, but then quickly changed her mind because "I have to be able to stand on my own two feet". I told her to drop the car off and I would take it today and tomorrow and fix it. It's at tops a 1 hour job anyways. I tried to take the lead, and it worked.
This is pretty big really. She doesn't want me to do anything ever because of this sitch. These small acts of being lead are pretty big for this sitch, and also a test for me.
----"Et tu, Brute?"---- me:28 W:24 S4 T:6 M:4 EA Exposed: 5/21/10 Bomb: 6/20/10 (Father's Day) NC w/ OM: 7/10/10 W moved out 8/21/10 http://bit.ly/aOrZne - My sitch
John... You may be young, but your W is even younger with a small child involved. She is vulnerable in many ways you are not (financially, negotiating skills).
It sounds like you both have a lot of growing up to do, but that you also have more potential for happiness than many of us here. As you' ve seen with Cat Lady, the baggage gets heavier as you get holder... Young love can be the best love if you can figure it out.
Put the work into yourself and the R if she's open to it. Don't crowd her, and realize she's trying not to feel so vulnerable by being more independent.
Good Luck!!
However it goes down, do be the man she will respect as the father of her child, no matter what.
John, I went back and read your entire thread from the beginning... WHEW! Speaking as a potential WAW, in my 2nd EA (I decided when it started up it was a sign of a problem, and was led here by SSM) --- There are just SO many opportunities and situations here that from the perspective of a WAW, I think were saying she wanted you -- in the biblical sense!
A girl doesn't do a panty show, have you wax her, etc. If she doesn't want sex. I KNOW she said there would be none -- but, for future reference... Say "Baby, I'd love to wax you... But I can't do that without it going someplace. I love your body, and that's too much of you to ask of me."
Now I don't know if all these opportunities are in the past, but my H is also a Daddy to me. If somewhere along the line he told me " I want a marriage with a healthy sex life" and we dealt with me feeling lonely in concrete ways (help me make a plan), then I don't think I would have gone online and fell into EA.
(sorry for typos...doing this on my phone)
Honestly, to me, the EA builds my confidence, makes me feel beautiful after just being a housewife all day. Until I came here I thought of it as a woman's version of porn. I am a super SSW!! and can't understand why husband doesn't pursue me like other man do, but literally is willing to bend over backwards for me over the years. He works ALOT, is on the computer ALOT, is always there for the kids, is great about housework, cooking, and errands. I'd trade all of that for sex and the intimacy. I feel alone, and now angry for all the years I've stayed in otherwise good M, mostly for my kids. I like my husband (except for certain gross guy stuff), he used to be my best friend, and I feel like I gave up career and family for his career moves over the years... Now, am I too old to GAL...?
Isn't it interesting how many of the issues are the same whether you are the WAS or the LBS?? Sometimes it's hard to really shake things up enough to get your H's to change... And like your wife says... Will they stick? Hmmm... So sad to do all this work to make your spouse a better person for the NEXT partner. John, in your case... I for one think your W loves you and the EAs were an attempt to fill a void -- I honestly didn't think of my flirtations as EAs until I came here. John -- you guys are SO young! It's too bad you couldn't 't have had educational pre-marital or post-marital counseling on communication skills etc. without the desperate circumstances:(. That is one thing my H and I benefited from during the 1st year of our marriage.
I relate to so many of your wife's issues... Pregnancies (unplanned), childbirth, relocations, husband gone all the time, caring for a young child and trying to work some education and career into that for yourself is exhausting. I hope you can both get past all the anger/distrust and grow up together. Many of the posters on here seem very jaded and seem to always assume the worst of your W to me -- (as in calling the L). I guess they haven't raised a 4 year old little boy 12-14 hours a day!!!
To me your wife sounds insecure, lonely, frustrated and was seeking a way to fill the emptiness that developed with your golf binge -- she should have learned to play with you, or picked up a hobby with some friends, but Oops... Bad choice! Seems like she missed all that sex from your Gift Card?
I love the interest in me as a WOMAN (not Daddy's little girl to be taken care of) -- BUT, deep down I know the OM can't hold a candle to man my husband is, and the LOVER he could be to me. I started feeling rejected by my H very early in the marriage sexually, so I'm not comfortable initiating sex(at this point we're in separate rooms, partially due to kid/health issues but I continued it for years once I lost attraction).
He loves her! And on some level, I think she still loves him. With intense relationship education... It could work. And, there is a 4 year old involved! As a WAS, EA-er, etc. -- It's still my husband's love I REALLY want! But I'm much older than this girl -- her pre-frontal cortex Is barely fully developed for God's sake! I don't think this is intentional on her part at all -- it seems pretty normal to me for a 24 year old, with young child, no education and a broken relationship. I'm surprised she's not more mental than she is!
Oh, John...! I just wishI could sit this girl down and have a talk with her. I just get this vibe she loves you, but you guys have your wires crossed! I hope she is doing some work on herself, because that is what I think could make her the wife that could make this R work!
You're probably spot on about my W. I never rejected her physically, but looking back what lead to her EA was me not being there spending quality time really LISTENING to her. I was a horrible listener and I was away from home alot. By the time I saw it, it was too late.
So many of my older female friends (including hers!) have said the same exact thing - "I want to sit her down and shake her and talk with her." I do too, but she has shut off all friends of hers that don't agree with her perspective of the sitch. Furthermore, her own mother won't talk to her about it because she doesn't want to get in the middle and/or doesn't agree with D as an option. So, my W is left nearly alone to make this decision and keep it.
She does love me. But she can't picture a life with me at all right now and doesn't think that is going to change. Those are her words, not my mindreading. I can't change those feelings and thoughts.
I can only give her a better option than what she has.
----"Et tu, Brute?"---- me:28 W:24 S4 T:6 M:4 EA Exposed: 5/21/10 Bomb: 6/20/10 (Father's Day) NC w/ OM: 7/10/10 W moved out 8/21/10 http://bit.ly/aOrZne - My sitch
She does love me. But she can't picture a life with me at all right now and doesn't think that is going to change. Those are her words, not my mindreading.
What do her actions say? Cheating, asking for a divorce, leaving?
Nothing says, "I love you" more than that. This is where I don't get it, John. Anything that feeds your ego, you accept. Anything that doesn't, you apparently put little weight on.
Wish ya luck, but I have a feeling luck is where opportunity meets preparation.
M-47,W-40,No kids D-filed 5/27/2010 Piecing - 10/21/2010 -=Soon to be banned=-
