You want parenting classes? And she hasn't gone far enough in getting them? It's up to her? Why? Are you part of this relationship, or do you just observe and report to us here? You want to heal the relationship, then find MC or a Retrouvaille weekend and tell her, "We need to do this. Let's sign up." You want parenting class, then find it and sign up. You've been told to lead, but all you do is observe and complain.
During this time W had said ILY... since then W has not said it.
Is this a major concern for you? How many times would you have liked her to have said it?
No. I just don't believe it I guess. I use to see it in her eyes when she said it in the past. This was a very withdrawn ILY during an intimate moment...
ETERNAL FLAME FALLS STRIKES AGAIN! that place has a lot of spiritual and sexual energy
No. I just don't believe it I guess. I use to see it in her eyes when she said it in the past. This was a very withdrawn ILY during an intimate moment...
I can see why she has told you that nothing she ever did was ever good enough.(she seems to have been correct about that assessment) Now she isn't reconciling with you or making love with you correctly. Now that isn't good enough. She isn't saying it in the right way for you. When she WAS saying it with meaning, then THAT wasn't good enough for you and you beat her down emotionally until she DID stop meaning it and even stopped saying it. Now of course she isn't reconciling int the correct way for you. (when in FACT she is moving foward wonderfully)
I can sure see why she feels the way she has begun to feel. Some people really are impossible to please. I have a suspicion you ARE one of those people. It is next to impossible for someon like her to make you happy. You will do whatever it takes to bring her down to your unhappiness level. Before you did it in a different way than you are now. Now you have found a new way. You have tried to convince her you have changed, but deep inside you are still unhappy with her and with yourself and refuse to be a happy man. Total refusal. Now you are only using a different approach disguised under Divorce Busting mixed in a little.
You weren't happy before she wanted out, you weren't happy when she told you she was done, you aren't happy now..
The common demonimator here is you and unhappiness. This is really more about YOU than about her. I will say it one more time and hopefully the light bulb will go off in your head..
LEARN TO BE A HAPPY MAN.. Don't gloss over that.. Do it.
I agree, OIN I think you might have some extremely high expectations, considering you are right at the beginning of the reconciliation, that's a recipe for disaster. In fact high expectations are a recipe for disaster at any time during a relationship, it's just a lot of pressure to deal with.
You were ready to accept that this relationship was over and live without her, now that you guys are reconciling you have to just accept her the way she is right now: she is damaged, broken, guarded, defensive, insecure, afraid that you guys will repeat all the same mistakes and end up exactly where you guys were.
Or you can just be happy because happiness is a DIY type job, only you can take care of your personal happiness, let go of the expectations, just let her be.
She may surprise you over time when she gets more comfortable around you and doesn't have to stand on top of a ladder meeting those high expectations you indirectly place on her and the relationship. When she gets more comfortable and relaxed around you, you may well see that "i love you's" come in a way that you want to hear them and all those other things you probably can't do right now.
She may surprise you over time when she gets more comfortable around you and doesn't have to stand on top of a ladder meeting those high expectations you indirectly place on her and the relationship.
BINGO... She has already been a pleasant surprise. He just fails to see it now. She told him she wanted to stay and work it out. She has made love with him for the first time in seven months. She told him she loved him while making love. She told him she has always loved him. She is excited about going on a vacation with him. She wants to start a family with him.
Of course that isn't good enough now. Very sad.
Some men are never happy with what their wife wants. If she wants this, then he doesn't. If she enjoys this, then he doesn't want her to enjoy it. If she is happy, he brings her down with negatives. If she wants a baby, he tries to bring her down by telling her why it isn't right. IF she wants divorce, he then tries to tell her why they shouldn't give up.
One common thread... He takes the opposite view so that he can bring her unhappiness down to match his unhappiness. Then he feels better.
Remember.. MISERY loves company. He feels better if he can keep misery in his life.
You want parenting classes? And she hasn't gone far enough in getting them? It's up to her? Why? Are you part of this relationship, or do you just observe and report to us here? You want to heal the relationship, then find MC or a Retrouvaille weekend and tell her, "We need to do this. Let's sign up." You want parenting class, then find it and sign up. You've been told to lead, but all you do is observe and complain.
I did not say it was up to her. I researched classes/courses in our area and nothing is available to us. There are courses more intended for expectant mothers but not couples.
Retrouvaille weekend is available in our area the weekend of 09/10/10. When I first researched this and told W about it and she told me to send the link to her email and she would read it later, which I did. I am not sure if she ever read it or not but she certainly had not brought it back up. After reading your post I said to W "I'm going to sign us up for the Retrouvaille weekend, it sounds like it will benefit our relationship." W replied "It is on the weekend and I cannot take time off of work." What more can I say?
I did not think by me posting on this forum in attempts to seek advice and vent was considered complaining. If that is the case, I rather complain here than to my W.
Originally Posted By: gucci loafer
Quote:
No. I just don't believe it I guess. I use to see it in her eyes when she said it in the past. This was a very withdrawn ILY during an intimate moment...
I can see why she has told you that nothing she ever did was ever good enough.(she seems to have been correct about that assessment) Now she isn't reconciling with you or making love with you correctly. Now that isn't good enough. She isn't saying it in the right way for you. When she WAS saying it with meaning, then THAT wasn't good enough for you and you beat her down emotionally until she DID stop meaning it and even stopped saying it. Now of course she isn't reconciling int the correct way for you. (when in FACT she is moving foward wonderfully)
I can sure see why she feels the way she has begun to feel. Some people really are impossible to please. I have a suspicion you ARE one of those people. It is next to impossible for someon like her to make you happy. You will do whatever it takes to bring her down to your unhappiness level. Before you did it in a different way than you are now. Now you have found a new way. You have tried to convince her you have changed, but deep inside you are still unhappy with her and with yourself and refuse to be a happy man. Total refusal. Now you are only using a different approach disguised under Divorce Busting mixed in a little.
You weren't happy before she wanted out, you weren't happy when she told you she was done, you aren't happy now..
The common demonimator here is you and unhappiness. This is really more about YOU than about her. I will say it one more time and hopefully the light bulb will go off in your head..
LEARN TO BE A HAPPY MAN.. Don't gloss over that.. Do it.
Originally Posted By: robx
I agree, OIN I think you might have some extremely high expectations, considering you are right at the beginning of the reconciliation, that's a recipe for disaster. In fact high expectations are a recipe for disaster at any time during a relationship, it's just a lot of pressure to deal with.
You were ready to accept that this relationship was over and live without her, now that you guys are reconciling you have to just accept her the way she is right now: she is damaged, broken, guarded, defensive, insecure, afraid that you guys will repeat all the same mistakes and end up exactly where you guys were.
Or you can just be happy because happiness is a DIY type job, only you can take care of your personal happiness, let go of the expectations, just let her be.
She may surprise you over time when she gets more comfortable around you and doesn't have to stand on top of a ladder meeting those high expectations you indirectly place on her and the relationship. When she gets more comfortable and relaxed around you, you may well see that "i love you's" come in a way that you want to hear them and all those other things you probably can't do right now.
just my 0.02 cents.
I will provide an update of the past couple of days. I continue to re-read the two above quotes....
M: 27, W: 25 Together since: 01/31/00 M: 10/4/09 (8 Months) ILBNILWY: 01/24/10 EA confirmed: 02/10/10 (Busted). Road to Reconcile began: 07/10/10 Retrouvaille: 09/10/10
I'm glad you talked to her about Retrouvaille. Yes, it is the weekend. And thousands of people with jobs, and kids, and all kinds of encumbrances find a way to take 48 hours and go. Because saving their marriage is worth it. I hope you will get her to reconsider. I met many people on our weekend who said that they went to a lot of trouble to attend, some flew in from other areas, some drove 10 hours to get there, some left important jobs. Making the marriage a priority over everything else is the first step to making it better.
After my exchange of posts on this forum I get ready for work. W Remains sleeping in bed. I catch up on the latest posts here and then it HIT ME. Gucci when you asked "Why do you always want to ruin her dreams" I felt empty. I never seen it that way.
I did some research on parenting classes and books and sent them to W in email.
I let W know I was leaving for work. W asked that I call at 930 as a wake up call for her, I told her I would do so. I kissed W on the forehead and then left for work.
For most of the night what you said Gucci lingered on my mind. I am crushing my W's dreams. I am making her more miserable than she already is and if she were to tell me that she no longer wanted our M again I would do exactly what you said....become "Mr. Dad."
I called W at 930 as she requested and our conversation went as follows
ME: "Hey sleeping beauty, did you rest OK?" - in a very upbeat confidant tone.
W: "Yeah, it was OK" - W's tone immediately become pleasant and upbeat as well as a result of my greeting
ME: "So Raven (our dog) was not a problem for you?" - Dog gets a little crazy sometimes
W: "No"
ME: "Work is slow right now, hopefully it picks up"
W: "Oh, that stinks"
ME: "Tomorrow sometime maybe we could sit down and go over the finances for the trip. Plan things out, I am excited about going"
W: "Me too"
ME: "Also I was thinking we should start a fund to prepare the house for a baby. We can convert the exercise room and tear the rug up" - Not saying it would happen right away but letting W know that I am also excited about starting a family someday.
W: "Yes, it would be nice to lay down a new floor and there is a lot of space in that room." - W sounded very surprised and please with what I had said. I detected happiness in her voice.
ME: "Do you want to check out the polish festival tomorrow and see what it is all about"
W: "Yes"
I had to go and so did W so we ended the call with an exchange of good nights.
later on, (Sunday morning) W called me as she was on her way to work. W spoke briefly talking about our plans for the day.
I returned home from work in the morning (sunday). When I walked in the bedroom W had propped up a stuffed plush dog (A gift I got her several years ago because it resembled a dog we had that is now passed. W loved the dog) up on my pillow. It made me laugh. I had TM w that I thought it was funny and W replied "I'm glad, I did it on purpose"
W returned home from work. I was hope and ready so we could go and attend the festival. I decided to make some lunch and also prepared a plate for my W.
W walked in the door, was heading for the fridge when I showed her that I had prepared a plate. W said "thank you" and proceeded to eat.
We finished up with our lunch. I asked W if she wanted to go over plans for the trip and she said "maybe later"
We headed out the door and to the festival. While there W seen some baby clothing and became excited. So I joined W in the excitement and we looked at the clothing together. W did purchase a few things.
We then headed back home carrying on conversation about various things.
We get home, W said her shoulder was hurting, W asked if I could rub her should which I did. I suggested to W to go into the spa pool and relax. W and I went into the spa. We goofed around and W said "Why don't we go back inside" we went back inside and ended up ML.
W suggested we go to another festival and watch the fireworks, I said it was a good idea and decided to call off work. W then decided that she did not want to go and wanted to lay in bed, watch TV and relax. SO I joined her. We had conversations and at one point I said ILY to W and W said in response "I hope so. ILY2 but it is hard for me to show it"
W became irritated by what, I don't know. I asked W if she would like to go on the computer and do some planning for the trip. W got annoyed and said no...tension began to built between us. I just left W alone, went on the computer and started to look up destinations for the trip and W fell to sleep.
Last edited by OfficerInNeed; 07/19/1005:14 AM.
M: 27, W: 25 Together since: 01/31/00 M: 10/4/09 (8 Months) ILBNILWY: 01/24/10 EA confirmed: 02/10/10 (Busted). Road to Reconcile began: 07/10/10 Retrouvaille: 09/10/10
I'm glad you talked to her about Retrouvaille. Yes, it is the weekend. And thousands of people with jobs, and kids, and all kinds of encumbrances find a way to take 48 hours and go. Because saving their marriage is worth it. I hope you will get her to reconsider. I met many people on our weekend who said that they went to a lot of trouble to attend, some flew in from other areas, some drove 10 hours to get there, some left important jobs. Making the marriage a priority over everything else is the first step to making it better.
I will bring it up again. I just don't want to push it on her or pressure her to the point where she gets annoyed. I will give it a week or two and try to develop better relations on our own and suggest it again.
M: 27, W: 25 Together since: 01/31/00 M: 10/4/09 (8 Months) ILBNILWY: 01/24/10 EA confirmed: 02/10/10 (Busted). Road to Reconcile began: 07/10/10 Retrouvaille: 09/10/10
I heard about the sex. I'd keep having sex with her, every day if possible. I also would not talk too much and I would try to turn off analysis of her. Over time she will naturally open up, and you will view her the way you need to for her to return to the role of your "wife".
I also liked when you where finding things to do outside of the house, not to game her, but for your personal enjoyment.
