Help

[MESSIMADE]

I could really use some good advice my friends

[timehealsall]

We only thought we were best friends. Friends don't ruin other friends marriages.
There was phone sex and she wanted to meet for sex and I agreed to (was never going to) but I always canceled on her with some excuse hoping that it would finally go away-dumb idea. I have not had sex with her since prior to meeting my wife.

No, no, no!!!!

Friends DON'T HAVE PHONE SEX or make dates to have SEX.. Even if you didn't go through with it, this is WRONG!!!!

You cannot be friends with this OW. THAT IS A NO NO!

I'm hurting for your wife. I think she needs to have her time. She is very vulnerable right now and her emotions are raging.

She should be laughing and enjoying her pregnancy, instead, she is thinking her marriage to you was a sham and she is now trying to figure out her plan for when this baby comes. You took that from her by your stupidity!

I'm sorry but I can't help but empathize with her right now. You did a sh!tty thing by NOT being honest with her from the get-go. Let me let you in on a little secret. People who truly want to kill themselves, DO IT. They don't play the suicide card. What OW was doing was PLAYING YOU. I'm sorry if I am coming off harsh but it is what it is.

Give your wife time to heal from this betrayal.

You need to work on yourself and man up to what you've done wrong here and you need to do some serious work on your part before expecting your wife to come back.

[MESSIMADE]

Oh believe me I know/knew it was wrong. I don't know wtf I was thinking.
I was actually saying we thought we were friends, what we were was cheaters. I have had no contact w/OW since middle of March. I want no contact with her. I am glad that my double life is over, I wanted it to be over b4 I got cought the 1st time, but I didn't have the balls to come clean then and face the music. I only dug a deeper whole to keep her satisfied. That's when the phone sex started and agreeing to meet. (At the time she didn't actually say meet for sex, but I knew why she wanted to me).
I know we both should be so excited and sharing the birth of our second child and celebrating that new life. My actions have totally messed up our family and I will regret this until my dying day.
She new about the situation before we got engaged, so she wasn't totally blind sided, but blind sided for the last 3 years.
I do realize that she was playing me about suicide to some extent. I did some research and asked questions that you can find on suicide prevention sites and had answers that pointed to "don't leave this person alone." She had went far enought with the "play" that her husband found notes she left for her 3 girls. So stupid me chose to error on the safe side and instead I could loose so much. Enough about her though. What I did was wrong, point blank.

I have been digging deep in my past to see what in the world clicked in my brain that let me think that this was and "ok" behavior/actions. I have been in IC, I'm an open book.

I might add that my wife's father is my best friend. Look how bad I fd up such a good thing.

[timehealsall]

You don't need to do any research.. The time you used in doing research for this OW, should have been spent on your WIFE. if you were that concerned, then you should have either called OWH or dialed 9-1-1 and had the police go to her home and you should have told your wife about this from the getgo.

The reason why you didn't say anything is because deep down inside you knew this was wrong. Had you not, you would have had nothing to hide. does that make sense?

You need to be transparent to your wife and you need to be honest with her.

Sometimes people think that by lying or denying someone the truth, that it'll make it better. well I will tell you that that is just hogwash. It makes it worse.

So your wife wants time now, right?

Have you had ANY contact with her? how was your last interaction with her?

[MESSIMADE]

I know I totally handled things all wrong. I am in total agreement with you. I should have dialed 911. And the reason why I didn't is (you are right again) I new it was wrong and was I over my head.

I am totally transparent. She knows everything and I have been honest. The OW has painted a picture that makes me look worse that the truth does. There are a few details that she believes the OW over me and they are damning details. (It is the OW way of getting even with me, I understand that and I new that that is what she meant when she told me that "You know your wife believes everything I tell her don't you?") I came clean to my wife 2/25/10. I had to, I could no longer live w/what I was doing to her. She deserved better and I told on myself.

No she wanted time in the beginning, but now she wants a D after baby is born. (Our state won't allow D while pregnant).

Yes we are in contact daily. She is totally awesome about allowing me back in the house to spend the evenings with my son. We recently celebrated his 3rd BD our families together. We (her, her folks, and I) just repainted the entire exterrior of our house. On Memorial Day we had a weenie roast (that's what son wanted to do with the stick he's been collecting from the yard) with our families and some friends. Maybe I should post an email she sent me:

I COULD USE SOME HELP HERE. MY WIFE TOLD ME THAT IF I WANTED A CHANCE TO FIX THINGS SHE NEEDED SPACE TO THINK AND WANTED ME TO "MOVE SOME OF MY STUFF" OUT OF THE HOUSE 2/28/09. I TOOK ENOUGH THINGS WITH ME TO GET BY. ABOUT 2 WEEKS INTO THE SEPARATION I GOT THIS EMAIL:
(I think it’s only fair for you to know how I’m feeling. I can not find one ounce of trust or forgiveness in my body and I’m not sure that I really want to. If I wasn’t pregnant I would be pursuing a divorce now. So I just want you to be prepared for that outcome this fall. I want to remain totally civil to each other and I would like to try to work out the details of separating things so that we will both be happy. I know this is not what you wanted to hear but this is how is has to be. This doesn’t mean that you can’t come see Son in the evenings or mornings anymore, I just wanted you to know how I feel.)

TO MAKE A VERY LONG STORY SHORT THIS IS STILL WHERE WE ARE AT DESPITE MY EFFORTS TO BE TOTALLY TRANSPARENT, SHOW HER HOW SORRY & REMORSEFUL I AM AND HOW MUCH I REGRET THE PAIN AND HURT AND EMBARRASEMENT I HAVE CAUSED HER, OUR FAMILY, AND OUR FAMILIES (WE LIVE IN A VERY SMALL TOWN THAT KNOWS THE WHOLE STORY OR SOME VERSION OF IT. BOTH OUR PARENTS LIVE ON THE SAME STREET AS WE DO. HER FATHER IS MY BEST FRIEND NEXT TO MY WIFE), BE CONSISTENT, CONTINUE TO DO LOVING THINGS AND BE LOVING, TOTALLY HAVE NO CONTACT WITH OW AND HAVE FOLLOWED THE STEPS IN "HOW TO GAIN FORGIVENESS AND RESPECT AFTER YOUR AFFAIR" BY KATIE COSTON. I MISS MY WIFE SO MUCH. SHE IS VERY CIVIL AND MATTER OF FACT, NOT HATEFUL AT ALL, SHE JUST HAS THIS PLAN FOR THE END OF OUR MARRIAGE THAT I DON'T WANT. I KNOW OUR OLD MARRIAGE IS OVER, BUT I WANT A NEW ONE WITH HER AND AM TRYING TO SHOW HER THAT I CAN BE THE HUSBAND THAT SHE DESERVES AND I ALWAYS WANTED TO BE. HOW DO I HELP HER HEAL, BEGIN TO TRUST ME AGAIN, AND FIND SOME TINY BIT OF FORGIVENESS SO THAT WE CAN GET OFF THE PATH LEADING TO DIVORCE AND ON TO A PATH LEADING TOWARDS RECONCILING?

[sandi2]

So glad that you had the courage to come here. I hope you realize that the majority here are LBS and whenever they read a story such as yours they naturally want to lash out. Truth be known, even some WAS might let you have it, also. But I hope you will stay here until you get the advice you need in order for you to be able to clean up your life and do what's best for your W and children.

It's so tragic that we don't really see what a treasure we have until it leaves us. I think that might be the case with you. Would you say that you took your W for granted? She must have really trusted you for you to get by for so long before she found out about you & OW. Would you say that when your W actually left you that that is when you knew you wanted "her" above anyone or anything else?

You may get frustrated with questions that will come your way, but it helps us to understand your stitch better.

Tell us how you have been dealing with the separation. Have you been pursuing your W, trying to talk her into going back to you? Based on the information so far, my thinking is that you need to back away from your W. Don't put any pressure on her at all. Do the two of you have a visitation set up for your child? If you don't, then you need to come to an agreement about that. Then you need not to contact her unless it is concerning him. Everytime you contact her that puts pressure on her.

It will be hard, and scary, for you to leave her alone, but she will need "time" to prove that you are not involved with the OW. Also the OW needs to know that you do not want her (OW) when you are not in a R. She gets her jollies by knowing she is controling your life so she must find out the truth.....that you would not have her even if you were not married!

It may take a divorce for both women to decide that you do not want the OW and that you truly want your family together. Your W is very hurt and terrible vulnerable now, so she may go through with the D, but people have gotten together after a D. Has she filed yet?

Is the OW still going around your W? If she is, I'd be concerned about that. Makes me think of "Fatal Attraction".

Whatever you do....DO NOT contact the OW. Break all communication with her once and for all.

[gucci loafer]

Explain to us how your wife and the married OW are contacting each other.

I still think your story and explanations sound a bit suspect.
You are actually blaming the OW as if it was ALL her that was doing the pursuing. I don't buy that one bit. No sex? I don't buy that either. How can you expect your wife to buy that?

The reason this stopped is because you got CAUGHT and your wife did what people on THIS site should do when their spouse is in an affair... TELL them they need time to think and tell them to leave. Wakes you up FAST doesn't it?

I think you are concocting this story on here and leaving out YOUR big part in this phone sex, best friendship and a host of other things so that we will help you to get your wife back. I think you need to come totally clean here first. I don't know how your wife will buy this stuff if an unknown stranger like me doesn't buy it.

[MESSIMADE]

Sandi: I completely understand the need to lash out.I will not be run off, I have made a mess and i want to clean it up and try to right the wrongs i have done.

Yes I would say that I took her for granted. I will not say that she trusted me. She was constantly checking up on me. She didn't actually leave, she asked me to, but no I knew for a long time prior to dday that I wanted her. Just couldn't figure out how to get rid of OW.

I don't mind the questions b/c I truely want the help.

We have had 2 or 3 conversations that she started about being done. I do not bring it up. I am just trying to show her i love her by doing. Telling her I love her seems like empty words, I feel I need to show her I love her. I don't pressure her. Last night i spent the night in our house at her request. She was gone on a meeting and wanted me to baby sit the dog. Our visitation is pretty loose. She allows me to come to our house in the mornings to help get son ready. After work she usually goes to her parent house for supper and I wait for her to text that they are home. That is my invitation to come up and spend time with son until bedtime. Tonight we both gave him a bath. We are trying to keep it normal as can be for him. Weekends are a whatever works for the both b/c I farm also and son goes with me some and stays with mom some. (fyi I stay with my folks right now. Our house, my folks house, and in laws house is all on the same street in a town of 300 people.) There is some phone and email contact both ways. So you think this should cease?

I am 98% sure that wife knows I have not contacted OW. I think the OW may just be waiting until I D and then she thinks I will come seek her out. I am sure this was the motivation for her to talk to my wife.

No she hasn't filed yet. In our state you can file, but it cant be finalized while she is pregnant.

No I don't think she is talking to my wife anymore.

NC has been maintained and will be maintained.

[MESSIMADE]

GL
We no longer are in contact with her that i know of (i know i am not!). Ow and wife would talk on phone and email. Wife used my email to do some fishing also and wife had me get OW on phone so she could listen to our conversation.

I will be glad to explain what you feel is suspect.
No I am just at guilty as she is. The thing is she was serious and I was leading her on. I was leading her on out of fear. Fear that I couldn't get out of the situation w/out wife finding out. So the longer I controlled the situation the hope was still there that eventually OW would give up due to broken promises by me. Not real clear thinking, but that's what i was thinking.
Yes there was NO Sex. I was am a creep and i betrayed my wife but i drew my line that I would not do that to her. No way no how. You may not believe me about this and you aren't the only one that doesn't. But my wife believes that (sorta b/c she believes that OW gave me oral).

No it stopped b/c I stopped it. This is not something I'm proud of but I'll tell you it anyway. In the mornings while i was showering wife would be getting ready in the same bathroom. I would be looking at her getting ready and be thinking wtf are you doing to her, wtf are you doing to your son, wtf are you doing to #2 that's on the way. Then the gagging would start. This was making me almost vomit. Wife wanted to know why I was gagging b/c she was the one supposed to be having morning sickness. I'm not telling you this for pity, I'm telling you this b/c i am sincere. I knew i was fn up and I didn't know how to stop it.

This is not a concoction. This is my life. This is the mess i have made of my life. I'm not denying I had phone sex, I'm not denying I led her on. I'm not denying I had an affair. The best friendship is a term i used above very loosely.

I'm clean. What do I have to gain by lying to you guys? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I respect yours. I don't intend to offend anyone on this site. The truth sets us free. Coming clean to my wife lifted the weight off my shoulders that had been this doulble life brought me.

[gucci loafer]

No I am just at guilty as she is. The thing is she was serious and I was leading her on. I was leading her on out of fear.

This is the kind of thing I am talking about.. Drop the "just as guilty as she is" and take responsibility all on your own. "I AM GUILTY AND I AM WRONG"

I don't believe you were leading her on out of fear. Yes, I do believe you had fear. Fear of getting caught. However, I believe the lust and phone sex and having a woman that thinks you are "all that" was driving this more than you will admit. I have been around the block. I am a man. Sex is a powerful draw to a man. It is easier for you to say now that it was out of fear. Of course you were in fear. Fear of getting caught. Now you can use that to say it was fear that kept you in it... Justification.

What do I have to gain by lying to you guys?

People lie to get others to tell them what they want to hear.
It happens all the time on this site. You SHOULD be questioned.
You admit you have a pattern of lying to your wife and not being honest with the OW. Why would I just up and believe you now?

I have seen it many many times that a WS justs keeps sticking to the lie. "I know you caught us in bed naked together honey, but HONESTLY, it was a coincidence. You are just being paranoid honey, we are only friends. I can't believe you don't trust me"


AND I see it over and over and over that the BS WANTS to believe the wayward. They actually argue with those of us on here trying to help them. Go read SOTR's thread and you can see exactly what I am talking about. His wife is LIVING with her ex husband and SOTR is doing everything in his power to convince himself that it is INNOCENT. All the while tellng us that he isn't rationalizing.


So, THAT is what you have to gain. If you stick to the lie and keep on sticking to it, then you WILL get others to believe you at some point. Those other people will then take your side and try to help you. I think the fact is that you wife may never believe you in the deepest recesses of her heart. I think she would always secretly wonder. That makes it difficult to trust. NOT ONLY THAT, but you did have phone sex. I don't see much difference in phone sex than in having actual physical sex. It is still unfaithful. Unfaithful is unfaithful. You seem to want to say..'Yea I did have phone sex, but at LEAST I didn't have physical sex. As if that makes it a tad more righteous. I don't think it does.

I think your best chance to get your wife to reconcile is to say to her..."Honey I was wrong and I don't blame you one bit for not believing me and I don't blame you one bit for wanting a divorce. I would feel the same way if this happened to me. I just want you to know that I am wrong and am deeply sorry for what I put you through and I WILL give you the space that you asked for."


And THEN do exactly that. And then let her slowly come to you. Keep to the story of "I was wrong and I don't blame you" Then leave it at that as you stay steady and in the background but leaving her alone as she goes through her emotions.