Its kind of in a different vein--I was trying NOT to talk about my H or the marriage in the thread, but to focus on me. I had to delete several sections for digressing...But, I think the LBS's spend a lot of time focused on the WAS's (at least I do...spend way too much time thinking about what H is feeling, thinking, doing, instead of what am I thinking, feeling, doing...), so we need to practice focusing on ourselves...
McQueen, maybe the final stage is not acceptance but growth??? I don't know. I still cycle back to "stuck" a lot.
Last wednesday I sent an e-mail to my W plainly stating that I decided to take care of my summer child care needs with the teenage girl I made arrangements with. I didn't ask her anything, just said I'm satisfied the kids will be safe and happy in the girl's care.
Afterwards, no response and no contact from my W in five days. I had a little anxiety over it, but I'm getting used to her reactions. Her problems, not mine.
During our child transition yesterday I didn't look at or speak to her. No "Happy Easter!", no nothing. Kids came running up and gave me hugs. She told me "If the kids miss me and want to talk to me, call me no matter how late." I responded with a simple "ok", without looking at her, and continued doding on the girls. She got in her car and drove away.
Last night she called to talk to the kids, and she tried twice to get me on the phone. My son held the phone out and said "Mommy wants to ask you if D5 is asleep." I replied to my son without taking the phone, "She is asleep, I just left her." My son pulled the phone back and said "Daddy says she's asleep." Then after a little more conversation my son held out the phone again and said "Mommy wants to talk to you." I took the phone this time and said hello. She had a request for me to put a note in D6's backpack regarding her doctor's appt tomorrow. Something that could have easily been handled via text or e-mail. I just said "ok" in response, then silence. She sounded defeated, and said "Well... ok... have a nice night..." I replied "You too" and hung up. I am so determined to give her nothing I was kicking myself for even saying "You too".
This has been very interesting. In the entire time of our M, whenever I tried to hold my ground, she would have a temper tantrum, and I'd feel like I did some horrible thing and give in. Seeing her respond to me with submission and respect now is almost surreal. The fact that she's doing so tells me that all those temper tantrums in the past were manipulation, pure and simple.
It makes one wonder when the marriage was real, not so?
Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed. D35,S/D twins28,D22 EA4/04 End? Who knows? "Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
I hate to say, but she never was a much of a real partner. She was a bully most of the time in our M, using her emotional manipulation to get her way.
When we got married, we agreed to wait one year before we talked about having kids. One year. About nine months into our M, my W approached me and said she wanted us to start trying. I said "I thought we were going to wait a year." She said "Yes, but might take a while, and I want to be pregnant by the time we've been married a year." So far she was being nice about it.
She came into our M burdened with massive student loans, and I had been trying to get them paid down. That, along with her liberal spending habits, made it financially difficult for me to see how we could afford to have a baby. I told her so, but wasn't getting through, so I went through our monthly budget with her and said I didn't see how we could afford to have her quit work or pay for full time daycare right now. Then she snapped, pushed away my paper, and shouted "You're just a coward!" and stormed out of the room.
Hard for me to admit now, but I sheepishly sought her out, and acted as though I had done some terrible thing and needed her forgiveness. I mean, I must have, why else would she lash out like that, right? She withheld herself, making sure I "suffered" a little, before softening.
That same story was replayed over and over throughout our M.
I can see me playing the same role throughout our M, also. We train people how to treat us. Where I (and you) are at now we simply won't tolerate it.
Me 45, H 46, S 23, M 26, Together 30, Bomb 6-2-08, S 6-19-08; H left 12-29-08. H home 12-09, Still MLC in 2012! Me- I have my big girl panties on. Bring it.
That's what Dr. Phil says, we teach people how to treat us. I hate accepting that truth, but it is true, and I taught my W to treat me like crap. She was a good student and learned well. I can understand how stressful it is for her to be retrained after all these years!
Hi Future, Its true. We try hard to be "nice" but in the end it is so important to hold your ground. I kept feeling like I had been erased in my marriage, and it was from constantly giving in. I see that to a certain extent, I brought it upon myself by being too nice and by letting my H get his way almost all the time. With a different spouse, that might have been OK, but it encourages someone who has selfish/manipulative tendencies to become even MORE selfish and manipulative, and the other to become a victim. I first clicked on your thread because of the title about the W not regretting the A. It struck a chord--I kept feeling like I had allowed my H to be so selfish that he thought he could have an A and still stay married. He says he NEVER wanted a D, so it seems he got to the point where he felt like there were no consequences for his actions. Anyway, it's a cycle, and I see that it takes two to tango. Its hard to see it when its going on, but the more distance you get, the clearer it becomes. Enabling, taking on too much responsibility, erasing your wants/needs by giving in to those of your spouse, etc...in the end, if we allow it to happen, we help bring the situation upon ourselves...
I switched my phone so that H's calls go directly to voicemail. It lets me hear the message and decide how I want to reply. It also lets me reply ONLY to the part of the message about the kids or business, and not reply to whatever else he has in there (and he usually includes something else about his emotional state to try and draw me back in...) I can then reply with a text or an e-mail. I'm even getting rid of our land line (which is only used by telemarketers anyway, it seems), and I got the boys their own cell phones for Easter. When I call them, now, I can speak directly to them and can limit my contact with H. The less contact I have, the better I feel, so its important to listen to those feelings and act accordingly. And the boys are free to call their dad or text him whenever they want, and that increased contact is really good for them, I think. The cell phones were free, and end up costing about the same as the landline--as long as they don't lose them!
