How to approach W about OM

[Allen A]

Oh, regarding thes points

"She's not looking for guidance, she just wants to vent"

Well, she needs BOTH to be honest and a good family therapist will be able to SPOT that and offer both

You can't just let someone VENT and offer them NO HELPFUL advice, tha'ts pointless

The forgiveness comes with her MOOD.. .she can't forgive you when she is miserable.. the FT will help (if its a good one guide her into a healthier state of mind and a better attitude twoards her marriage.

You have to wait for forgiveness, you cannot FORCE that on her.. that comes along at the END of hte process.. it is NOT the first thing that's dealt with

You are doing well... she needs a warm sensitive husband and time to accept him.. keep up the good work

[OfficerInNeed]

I understand what you mean. My concern is a therapist will tell her to "get out." We're talking years of verbal, mental and emotional abuse and from what I here she went as far as telling people it got physical. If she believes that so much she convinces herself it is real than what therapist is going to say there is hope.

I will take all the time necessary for her to heal but I am not sure how much time I have left until she decides to walk out and selecting the wrong therapist could cause her to walk out sooner.

I WILL be kind, gentle, positive and supporting. She needs that from me. She also needs someone other than me to open up to before she, once again, attaches to the wrong person. Like I said she has developed a friendship with a female co-worker who cheats on her husband with another co-worker of theirs. This is a terrible influence and that vulnerable state my W is in could lead her down the wrong bath further away from me and more importantly morality.

[Allen A]

I am more concerned for her physical safety...

Any man that is willing to sneak around with her behind YOUR back and have sex with her... and ruin YOUR MARRIAGE while he gets off like some sleazy stalker... is NOT going to lead your wife down any safe path in the long run

less than ONE PERCENT of affair couples survive long term.. most end up breaking up in an ugly fight or one of them again ends up cheating on the toher... the success rate for affair couples is VERY LOW

From THAT YOU can imagine that any guy your wife runs off with is NOT thinking in HER best interests and will NOT put her SAFETY as his first concern...

Any guy that mounts someone else's wife is NOT putting that woman's safety as his first concern...

THAT is my concern, that your wife will hook up with a creep and get physically and emotionally hurt

Never mind morality and forgive me for saying so but never mind you.. affairs are physically DANGEROUS

[Lotus]

I'd like to butt in here in speak as a woman. Maybe a female point of view would be helpful.

Officer,

You have mentioned a few times that she has some legitimate complaints. You have made some mistakes in being a husband that you do feel sorry for. I see Allen's point on not being too soft where there was an emotional affair. But I also see OIN's remorse at having handled some situations badly in the past.

I don't know if those things have been genuinely apologized for. It's not right to just look at his need for her to be respectful of his position as husband. We also have to look at her need for a husband who will be understanding, and nice to her. As marital partners everyone's needs should be taken care of. In my mind, that is the first thing, she has to feel that he has shown adequate remorse for his mistakes and is genuinely committed to being a better husband. To do this, he should go see an IC or the FT on his own. To let his wife know that he will make a real effort to better himself. Also, he should consider taking an anger management class.

At this time, she is probably dealing with the loss of a fantasy that helped get her through her days. She is likely to feel sad and resentful that something that meant something to her has been taken away.

I wonder how many of the men on this board frequently compliment their wives on the things they do. Not just Officer in Need, but Allen, Maynard, and all the guys. At dinner, how often do you say, "That was a good meal. You are a good cook."? Or when she has worked, and taken care of the house, and the shopping, and the meals, how often do you say, "Thanks for doing the laundry, or the dishes, or cleaning the pots, the whole kitchen, taking the kids to their activities, getting the projects and the homework done", or whatever. I can tell you that I have sat in a room full of unhappy couples, and when asked to say something nice about their wives, many of the men could not say one sentence. They could not come up with one thing she did that was a good thing about her. It's a pretty shocking experience. The wives live with it everyday.

I'm not trying to start a debate on "Who is more critical, husbands or wives?". I am saying that a man who is interested in saving his marriage, ought to be saying nice things to his wife.

[OfficerInNeed]

Lotus,
I thank you for your insight and perspective on this situation. I do understand there are things I can say or do that would be considered pressure and could ultimately push her away farther. One question I had asked and continue to ask myself is "WHat positive can come out of being 'cold' when being cold is what got us here to begin with."

I think my wife deserves a husband who cleans, cooks, makes her lunch, lays her cloths out for her among other things because that is the wife she had always been to me and I never met her half way. She always did for me and I showed no appreciation.

I have gone to counseling to combat my past anger issues. I have spoke to counselor via phone in regards to my insecurity/trust issues. Each can only help so much before I have to put these practices into real situations.

I WILL take a step further and see a therapist. I want the help and I also want to ensure my W I am making positive strides to becoming a better person and even greater husband without telling her so. She will need to see these changes in me her self but she is so blinded by the past she cannot see the progress.

I am taking it one day at a time as she is counting down one day at a time till she leaves.

[jasper67]

Sadly, I did all the cooking and most of the house work on the weekends, W was working every day...I most always told her how nice / beautiful she looked...

My M problems were that I was too frugal and did not show enough interest in my W's hobby/business...

It eats me alive that I failed to do so.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I do, every day. Always did. Not only are WOAs one of my wife's love languages, but it's simply The Right Thing to Do.

Puppy

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I think my wife deserves a husband who cleans, cooks, makes her lunch, lays her cloths out for her among other things because that is the wife she had always been to me and I never met her half way.

A couple of inconvenient truths, or at least observations:

1) Not while she is having an affair, no she doesn't. You do need to let her know that once she ends it, you are willing to address any and all issues, and you may in fact choose to DO some of these things (or similar things) in the meantime, if you feel they are The Right Thing to Do, but you shouldn't do them because you feel she "deserves" them, nor to get any sort of reaction out of her. LOVE may be unconditional, but BEHAVIOR is full of all kinds of written and unwritten civil contracts. Bad, foolish, destructive, or hurtful behavior doesn't "deserve" to be met by such kindnesses, in my opinion, and I would also argue that it even enables more of the same destructive behavior.

2) In my experience, women don't find these kinds of things to be very attractive in men, on average. We can debate that all day long, whether or not it "should" be that way (and for the record, I am a classic "Nice Guy," who loves to cook, buy my wife flowers, write her song lyrics, made her romantic CDs, etc.), but it just IS.

Puppy

[Lotus]

Is see, Puppy. So you think it is just a coincidence that your wife turned around and came back to a nice guy?

[OfficerInNeed]

Puppy,
Aside from this EA the underlying issue had been I did not love enough, care enough or to much of anything to show appreciation. I will still monitor her interactions with OM but to ensure there will not be another OM I have to exhibit behavior not of the past but rather someone who can love her unconditionally and show appreciation. I am in a tough situation...

As for an update... We did end up going to the movies, she was short with me and distant as usual. I did "test" her out by simply placing my arm on the same armrest as her, in the past she would move or adjust so I was not touching her and her me. We did share a few laughs. I don't like to read into too much but she used words like "we" and "us" but most of the time she tries to avoid those words. I held back by not saying or doing things that would had been considered pressuring.

I am doing a balancing act. Letting her know that I care through my tone and actions but not so much that I push her to discomfort.

Something I was curious about... Ever since the day my wife told me she wanted separation about 7 weeks ago she has been taking 3-4 baths in a 24 hr span. I know even before all this mess she like to relax in the bath often...maybe I just did not pay attention to her like I do now, not sure. Any ideas?