Jumping in (1st post)

[Gypsy]

Hey Gardener..

Feeling grateful and blessed for all you have is a beautiful thing.

*hugs*

[Faith2010]

Gardener -

It sounds like you are doing great. Any news regarding taking your wife to the fireworks?

[Gardener]

Gardener -

It sounds like you are doing great. Any news regarding taking your wife to the fireworks?

Thanks. I am doing well. Great is a-lot-of-work-on-me down the road.

Tuesday night was a big step. Because of that and since I've been waffling on it, I've decided No on the fireworks. I lovingly believe this weekend should be her first Fourth Of July in 18 years with either No Fireworks or Fireworks With No Gardener.

I'm sure gonna pick a town and go see 'em, though.

[sgctxok]

First and foremost--no matter how dark it gets, never never lay down and die.
Second, don't believe anything they say and only half of what they do.
Make it clear to her that you are not interested in divorce or anything that will make that happen. If you are not interested in going to a mediator, tell her simply. No. I will not go to a mediator. I will continue to live my life but I will not help you in ending soemthing I think is wonderful and has the potential to be even more wonderful....the envy of the neighborhood.
Forget the past. Concentrate on you today so that maybe she'll be a part of your future.
You can have your freak out days. But I do PROMISE YOU, there will be more but then you manage, you get a hold of the situation and you'll be amazed at how you'll be handling all of this not that far from now.
Don't think that because she seems to be talking divorce that you have to help and be nice about it. You do have to be nice, but you don't have to help her with this crazy idea of D. Make it clear, you're not interested in that.

I love this advice

[sgctxok]

Ok...I've just read then skimmed fairly fast...but I do not think you are in the LRT....AND I want to tell you Dottie is an amazing coach...so I'm glad you're with her. I've seen a lot of her advice (and Laurie's) and some of the others advice....and I don't think you can lose.


I think you really do 'get it' about DBing.

One thing I don't understand, is WHAT ARE YOUR WIFE's COMPLAINTS about you. I think your wife is ALMOST in a 'too little too late' position and really hopes you will turn it around for the both of you. This does not mean everything is your fault...but right now...to her...it is, so 'it's where you live' right now.


(I'm sure Dottie got that out of you and her advice is on target...but without us really knowing those complaints...most of our advice here is useless....so please take it as such...except the don't give up parts. ) I didn't see where youdid (probably because I was skimming some of the posts)...did you put your ring back on?

[Gardener]

I think you really do 'get it' about DBing.

Thanks. Am trying. But perhaps I'm concentrating a bit too much on LRT & not the rest of DR (?)

One thing I don't understand, is WHAT ARE YOUR WIFE's COMPLAINTS about you.

I'm too negative. I'm too helpful: Ineffective MC said I'm "helpful to death". Talk too much MC said I am guilty of "unbridled self expression"
I'm moody. Get angry too easily. Too clingy.
I believe problem started when my mother came to live with us in 2000 when my dad died. She moved out in 2004. Too late. That was a constant-stress disaster.
Problem compounded when I began to drink/self-medicate and buzz-out nightly for about 2 1/2 years. I stopped with the Rational Recovery program. Never missed it. No effort, no white knuckling, no nothing, Wife went to Al-Anon and then her IC started saying I was a Dry Drunk because I chose a path other than AA and IC did not support her staying with me. Maybe coincidence, maybe because I stopped self medicating in Feb '06 but around late '07 (hindsight/retrospect - not sure exactly) I became depressed. Most of '08 I was under what I called a slow, all-encompassing black glacier. Didn't know I was obviously suffering depression. neither did she. She dropped S ("a respite") Bomb in late November. I was diagnosed 1 week later by MC and family Doctor. She canceled S. Went to see her IC the next day and that night the S was back on. I think in the last few years, events, stresses, - and, most importantly I - wore her down.
Regarding her, the MC said she's affected by physically abusive mother and father (father died May last year). She's walled off, shut down. Said she's "in a tremendous amount of emotional pain. Like a person with Gout: touch them ever so slightly in the affected area and they experience excruciating pain. Only hers is emotional Gout."

i know I'm over-answering your question, but I'm almost done. We both have a style of keeping things in (disappointments), avoiding conflict like the plague and, therefore building up resentments.

I think your wife is ALMOST in a 'too little too late' position and really hopes you will turn it around for the both of you. This does not mean everything is your fault...but right now...to her...it is, so 'it's where you live' right now.

Yes. I've said it's like she finally gave me a wake up call and when I began to wake up, immediately shouted, "Too late!" I don't know what she wants or hopes. Everything was not my fault, but I've copped repeatedly to being the Major Offender and Major Source Of Stress

without us really knowing those complaints...most of our advice here is useless....so please take it as such...except the don't give up parts. I didn't see where you did (probably because I was skimming some of the posts)...did you put your ring back on?

I never gave up. Got pretty down a couple of times. I did not put my ring back on. About 3 weeks after I took it off, I noticed she took hers off.

Fo more reasons than I know, and possibly for reasons other than me, my wife just shut down late last year.

I only wish she would talk to me.

You're the fourth person to tell me that mine doesn't sound like a Last Resort Sitch. Even Dottie says it's probably not but has advised I use Last Resort Tecniques along with others.

There you go: open book.
Thanks.

[sgctxok]

This is WONDERFUL information. And it's all just information right now...I don't think it's over.


So you're half and half. Stop clingy, don't worry about talking. Just listen when she does.

Women want action, even though they also want to talk. We're complicated. That's ok...because YOU're SMART. And Motivated. And capable.

If you can stop drinking...you can stop the depression.


Alcoholism and depression have some nutritional things in common.... B12, Folate, Magnesium deficiencies.

Without medicines...(and you may need meds)....there are some things you can try immediately:


The vitamins listed above, probably also some D (or sunshine) and exercise. I think you said you were doing that or that you had lost weight. It's major to beating depression.

Initiate a little. I hope the fireworks thing works out.

You probably said...but I missed...what you did for her B.



We women WANT heroes, we want strong men...your W pointed that out....and you ARE that.....you just have had some glitches.


Put your ring on with the first positives you get from her. And don't take it off unless you divorce. Start doing MORE of the things you two love.


Now...about YOU again. When life was exciting to you...what were you doing, what were you saying?



*****

Chitchat:

I understand something some things about depression and alcoholism and grief...personally. I've lost both my parents, had 2 miscarriages, a divorce....have lost close friends to death. I'm only slightly younger than you.

As we get older, and you probably know....these things weigh heavier on us. We start thinking about what the rest of our life is going to look like....we want it to be as good as possible. I'm sure your wife is thinking about that too.

This can be such positive exciting thing that you two have a chance to turn this around. And I really believe you are going to.....And this NEXT HALF of your lives will be so amazing.

peace out,
sg

[givingitmyall]

Hey Gardener:

Problem compounded when I began to drink/self-medicate and buzz-out nightly for about 2 1/2 years.

Our similarities continue. A big "me too" on this one. Was a contributor in my sitch.

FYI, I had to start a new thread b/c my other one locked. New one is called "Gotta Keep Trying."

[Gardener]

So you're half and half. Stop clingy, don't worry about talking. Just listen when she does.

Clingy long over, My wife doesn't want to talk about our sitch. At all.

If you can stop drinking...you can stop the depression.

Depression stopped. You're preaching to the (nutritionally fanatical) choir, here. My solution was B Complex, B5 (stress), Magnesium, specific amino acids for specific, test-proven depleted neurotransmitters. I initially went on meds immediately for urgent relief. Am now weaning off as per Dr. because of the positive effect of the supplements. With the depression lifted, at least now when I am sad...I know why. During depression only two things bothered me: !) Absolutely nothing, and 2) absolutely everything

The vitamins listed above, probably also some D (or sunshine), exercise.

I get plenty of both (hey, you know your stuff, here, don't you?)

For my wife's birthday I called and lm: "Happy Birthday. Whatever you need for this to be a great birthday, is what I wish for you."

We women WANT heroes, we want strong men...your W pointed that out....and you ARE that.....you just have had some glitches.

I am and I sure have.

Put your ring on with the first positives you get from her. And don't take it off unless you divorce.

This may be a good idea: to put it back on in response to... I'll give that some thought.

Start doing MORE of the things you two love.

We don't do anything together. Her choice.
But I will think about Fireworks tomorrow or perhaps a hike soon. We both love that and a while back my wife did say she hasn't hiked since separation. She's afraid of going in alone.

Now...about YOU again. When life was exciting to you...what were you doing, what were you saying?

Okay, short answer. We lived in a condo and did things and went places. Simple stuff. We've owned an old farmhouse for the last eleven years. Realized/admitted a while before bomb that the house takes every spare minute and every spare dollar hence we weren't doing much anymore and had decided to sell it this year.

This can be such positive exciting thing that you two have a chance to turn this around. And I really believe you are going to.....And this NEXT HALF of your lives will be so amazing.

Thank you for that.

And thank you for your concern and effort.

[gucci loafer]

Hi Gardener.
I read through your situation and what has transpired since you started posting.


Let's start here....

I believe there is someone else she is interested in.
If I am correct (and I believe that I am) then you need to change your game plan up. She is showing many of the signs that a woman shows when they are interested in someone else or having an affair. The biggest hint is that she seems to be "pushing the divorce."

The reason women push a divorce is that they want to pursue someone else and they think that the divorce relieves them of guilt. OR. The person she is interested in is giving her the impression that if she gets divorced that the relationship will move forward.


That is my take. It is the thing that makes sense. If there was not someone else, then she would be more open about giving this time. She would be saying that she wanted to separate for now and see if her feelings changed and yada yada yada......

The only other reason I have seen when they rush the divorce is when there has been physical or verbal abuse. And even then, they don't rush it as fast as the woman who is interested in someone else. She is lying to you that she "just wants to get it over with" That is a smokescreen for something else.

I think you need to do some investigation to find out the truth here. AND that does not mean asking her. She will deny. They almost always do. The signs are there.