Stuck, at first i begged for forgiveness, and yes i was sorry, but not enough for me to be 'cured' of my addiction to OP, and the whole "in looove" thing, and he kept contacting me so I kept replying, which meant I remained detached and unable to connect with H. most people are truly NOT nefarious to "love" two people at once. They may THINK they are and probably THINK they are fooling the spouse, but this is a dream.
I never resented him putting me in that position no, but I did continue to rebel and play up like an adolescent for along long time. this is what happens, when your 'forced' to return and make a 'choice'. the choice was never made it was made FOR you, so its natural to fall into a position of a rebeling teen.
It would be convenient for me to say in the next 2 years he did nothing but the truth is, he tried very very hard and was amazing. he changed all his ways and became exactly the h I always wanted. exactly. it took time but gradually i began to really fall in love again and thats when real regret and guilt TRULY set in. I felt i couldnt say enough or do enough to say sorry then. i thought about it every single day. IN THE BEGINNING, when i came "home" as such and quit the affair, I was still in full rebel mode, and god forgive me, i even remember thinking id do it again, and i also remember thinking i didnt regret it at ALL. you really believe this too, when your going thru it. you remember all you learnt from the OP... and I know this is painful but you DO learn stuff from the OP... and you think its not something you'd ever regret... but when you truly begin to reconnect to your H, you DO regret it a lot, and truth to tell, you would NEVER admit to your H just how much you felt for the OP. it becomes really shameful.
The problem in my sitch is while i was sitting around mooning for those 2 years and he was trying so hard, he was losing heart and gearing himself up for a lovely MLC of epic proportions, and im told its the worst on here. well, id be a rotten LIAR to say I dont know what caused it or made it worse. the truth sets us free, and may heal others
your wife probably isnt SORRY right now. she might not be SORRY for along time. I hope your still around, when she is. but the truth is, people like you, who have suffered a long time an felt so lonely... well... the truth is your open yourself, to an OP who might offer some compassion and love.
No one ever bothers to mention this to the person who had the A. they dont even CONSIDER IT
but life is life and god is god, karma is karma and what goes around.. comes around... what you think you dont want.. someone else always does...
too bad a lot of us learn way too late isnt it...
When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.
Hi Fighting Fit, you are legend! I am still in pain not knowing whether I'm insane or not. I really hope that you could give comments to what I am going through at the moment.
About 10 months ago I had this gut feeling that wouldn't want to go away easily. I dismiss it at the beginning and put it down to my being inconvenience and insecure about our new role in the family, but when my stomach felt like it was full with butterfly, I could not have helped myself to do some syping. Then some tell tale signs began to reveal:
text late at night, deleted text massages and call logs, mobile phone always on hand (or it seemed!) new sexy undergarments (never before!), changes in music taste, more independent and prefer to be alone and seems to be careless with things around the house (we have 3 girls, 16, 14 and 8).
She started to talk about one specific guy often, and at one time because of the office problem that this guy facing she asked me to help him, which I was happily did. After awhile I felt uncomfortable with her attention and focus on this guy. She started to read all companies rules and policies after she got home and pay less attention to the family. I explained my concern about this, especially after she frequently talked and text late at night (which I suspect to this guy) which she said she could not understand since they are 'just friends' but nevertheless she agreed to my term that no more late night texting or call and she will tell me if there was any red flag.
Then one night when she was having a shower I read her text sending to one of her male co-worker: "where are you?" I found this strange since she was not supposed to have any appointment with this guy that day. Then after she finished showering I realized she had deleted the text while other text to that guy that involved their office matters still there (my wife aksed me to help him with his office problems). That night I confronted her calmly about the text which surprised her because whe had agreement about it, and after awhile she said that she could not remember about it, I tried to be specific then she gave me a lame answer about her being worried that he might have got late to start that afternoon (they worked on shift). I asked her why she did not put his name on the phone list (it was only number and I had to do some spying jobs to know that it was him) and she said (lame answer again)that guy was having problem with their boss and she did not want to sent the wrong answer to the boss should she knew my wife was close to this guy. But she admitted that she had a symphaty to this guy because he had worked hard and was unfairly treated. I reminded her about her duty as a mother and wife and told her my concern with her being close to him. She promised (again)me to keep her distance and would inform me whenever she/the guy sent the text to each other. We slept peacefully that night.
Although my gut feeling still stubbornly haunting me I started to loosen up my spying on her until accidently this guy called my wife in panic saying that their boss had his phone (which he carelessly left at the office) and had read all the texts including from/to my wife. My wife was also seemed to panic which I could not understand why, when I asked her she said that the guy had warned her that she might be called by the boss. I calmed her and told her that she shouldn't have worried if she did not say anything bad about the boss and if the boss asked her just tell the thruth. But I noticed that my wife was so restless at night and acting strange at day. Then the boss called her and told her (according to my wife)that this guy had sent the test to other person saying my wife was helping him in taking a letter illegally from the office. Offcourse my wife denied her involvement to the boss and to me and for me this was the right movement to 'discredit' the guy. However, to my astonishment my wife seemed undisturbed with this guy behaviour, rather than becoming more distance (you would be mad if someone told you a thief wouldn't you?)she was even closer (from my point of view)to him. I could not find a trace of anger on her to this guy. Then I noticed that the pattern of deleted text and call lists remain there.
When I confronted her slowly whether she had something more to say to me she told me that all this time she was being totally honest and clean to me and she was hurt that I accused her for having an affair (I never said that). Then one night before we slept I asked her the same question again and told her that I knew she had deleted text all this time. Then she broke off, admitted to me that she did deleted text when I asked when she referred to the time when she was in the bathroom pretending to have shower. I was furious about her dishonesty and she cried in tears telling me that she did not know what had gotten into her.
I felt betrayed but she assured me that there were nothing happening between them (sexually) and blamed the condition where she needed to work with him often.
I started to suspect on the physical things when her bedroom behaviour changes quite drastically. One time she was full of fire and initiated the moves, next time she turned cold turkey. Also the techniques and words she was using were changes. She started to talk about the size of 'male things', which really made me uneasy. There were also times when right after our bedroom session she talk about how the frequent of our intimacy needs to be cut down (its already low or almost none existence for god sake!) because it would make her tired and could not concentrate when in work. And also the time when we already planned a romantic dinner, abrupt cancellation came because she needed to go to work due to the short staff (happened mostly in this other guy shift off course!!!). This is not to mention about the sexy lingerie that she bought but rarely put on display for me (she did wear it to work though) and oh yeah.... brazilian wax.
Actually my main worry is the fact that it is never sunk into her mind that the other guy was taking advantage of her all this time. She said she had 'finished' with the guy but failed to see my concern. She took the blame on her but not to this guy. It seemed that she wanted to protect him. She always speaks highly of this guy (she did that often withoug her seemed knowing it) and never thought that he just a 'scum'. For me this is why the pattern of her lying about him keep on reapeating. The fact that she knows where he is working now is also very suspicious (how did she know when no one of her co-worker knows about it and she told me before that she did not know where he was going when he left).
Alhtough the guy had left the place where my wife works, I still have this feeling that they still maintain their contact. I knew this because my wife inadvertently told me about the place where this guy is working now, though when I tried to ask for more details she quickly said she got it from her friend at work.
Am I getting crazy? Is she cheating or was she cheating? My gut feeling still driving me mad but I do not have any solid proof at all except all the tell tale signs and the above incidents. After she knew I checked on her phone and her email, there are nothing left in there.
I pray that you and I realise that although it may appear life had treated us unfairly, life has things in store for us we cannot see. Though we may feel as though the best of our life has ended, this is not a truth. Every life has seasons, and though we might be in Winter right now, we must realise that our Spring is on the way.
I pray that you and I fully understand that anger is like swallowing poison ourselves and waiting for our enemy to die. We only hurt ourselves, and we have hurt enough right now. lets agree together right now not to let anger taint our thoughts and lives and future, because we deserve more than that. We deserve to be happy, and expressing anger is never over: we must decide for it to end. It wont end by itself. Anger is a pointless emotion that corrodes our ability to feel joy, forgive, or move on. hanging onto anger is something we do out of fear because it means hanging onto HOPE. in our fears, we desperately fear that by giving up anger, we GIVE UP HOPE. Let us realise this is absolutely not true.
I pray for you and I, that we fully understand that people are all precious beings and souls and we all make mistakes, sometimes terrible ones. We have within us the capacity to forgive ANYTHING we chose to, and to get over ANYTHING we choose to; we are that powerful. We must always remember: OUR BRAIN IS NOT IN CHARGE OF US, WE ARE IN CHARGE OF IT. we must always remember: A FEELING CANNOT EXIST WITHOUT A THOUGHT. BANISH THE THOUGHT, AND THE FEELING MUST GO. let us now agree to refuse to entertain thoughts that bring us pain. To get rid of the feeling we must refuse to let the thought make a home in our mind. We ARE that strong. Our feelings are in our control.
I pray that you and I, both understand fully that our life is worth living, even if we lost. We still have our children, our parents, and our family, to live with and for. We must not consider our indentity to be entirely tied up in our marriage. it isnt. Its only one aspect of who we ARE, and theres a lot yet to discover about us, when we feel better. and we WILL feel better.
I pray that you and I fully grasp that "failure" is not a failed relationship. We did the best that we could, at the time, with the knowledge that we had. if we had known better, we may have done differently. But we didnt, therefore it is pointless to not forgive ourselves for things we didnt know. We now know new things, and thats something to be proud of. We learnt new things. It might feel pointless right now, but we can be proud we learnt, no matter how the lesson came.
I pray for you and I we find the humility to accept everything that happens to us knowing we still live, and still have our health, and still our children and our lives; therefore we have many chances at happiness in many areas. Let us release the idea of winning, the idea of drama, and accept what others do to us knowing that what they do can never change who WE ARE.
I pray that whenever we get a bit weak or tired and forgetful, and fall back into old mistakes, ways and anger, we once again re-read these prayers (or similar) and forgive ourselves and start again afresh, without self blame but only with gratefulness that we are truly smart enough to know whats good for us.. and whats good for us is to LOVE OURSELVES.
peace and blessings xoxoxoxo
When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.
I think your wife is infatuated by this guy at work, but theres no way to tell (for me at least) at this stage if she would be having an affair with him, or not.
I know nothing about your sitch, but I think from WHAT YOU have told me, you might want to try the hardline right now on her - because it seems early days to me (its possible your w is infatuated with him, but that nothing has actually HAPPENED, and for YOU that would be a GREAT TIME to lay down the hard line.)
if you suspect this also... and think she's not involved with hima as yet but only infatuated... then GO HARD. tell her EVERYTHING.
SHOCK your wife to death by telling her you know all about the texting and you check on her and go hard: SHOCK her more by saying you are going to CONFRONT this guy if she doesnt agree to cease ALL CONTACT RIGHT NOW with him, or you will GO to him and you WIL DEMAND answers. STAND UP for yourself and go HARD, take a risk and tell her outright: I WILL FIND OUT, I WILL ASK HIM, I WILL ASK YOUR CO WORKERS and heres the kicker I WILL ASK YOUR BOSS, I WILL ASK HIM whats going on and where this man IS.
this is not the usual thing id suggest - its pretty hard. but I would for YOU, if I am reading your sitch right and your w is infatuated but hasnt DONE anything yet. if you can go hard on her NOW before anything HAPPENS, then you might scare her (and him bc she'll tell him beleive me) how hard your going and how far your prepared to go.
WHILE going hardline, also tell her: if this ends RIGHT NOW, we'll never speak of this again, we will forget this, i will never raise this with you, but this ENDS or I will MAKE it end. be a bit SCARY. can you do that?
SOMETIMES (geez I know some people are gonna hate this... ) sometimes people need a GOOD SCARE. try the bluff scare and it might work for you if things havent gone too far.
LOOK honestly? Id also call this bloke up and id tell him to leave my wife alone. you have A RIGHT. dont be crazy man dont be insane just call him and very calmly tell him "leave my wife alone. thats all i am going to say; you leave her alone, right now. shes married to me".
believe it or not, SOME OP MEN (not so much ows. but men) actually listen and will back right off, it turns them off (SOMETIMES) and at the very least you will have made it awkward for your Wife.
TIME TO MAKE IT AWKWARD I THINK.
When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.
No I dont think the attraction is the 'cheating'. Not by that stage anyhow, after admitting it. I think the attraction is the DRAMA and I cannot say that ENOUGH. life is boring! life is humdrum! this person adores you and waits on your every word. WHO doesnt want to be ADORED????
Augustus, one thing that you can use to your advantage when you gather intel, and/or even even you have the CREDIBLE THREAT of having good intel on a wayward spouse:
They don't know what you know.
And they don't know what you DON'T know.
Think about that for a minute, and consider how it can be used to your advantage. A simple statement like "Look, I know all about you and ________ , and it needs to stop right now," and then when they ask you how you know, and WHAT you know (and they will press and press and PRESS for both of these!), you simply say:
"I'm not going to tell you that, but you have a decision to make. I will not live in an open marriage."
OK, so assume you've only seen 20% of the communication that's gone on between them -- and only text messages. There are also, no doubt, cellphone calls, meetings/hook-ups, e-mails, maybe gifts exchanged, etc. How does she know that you don't know some of THESE, too???
A: She doesn't.
Once you confront them, and use just SOME of what you know, without revealing ALL that you know or even HOW you know it, then they have to assume the whole 100% (or at least some other, horrible parts) are now known.
It is true Pup; and Ive read a BIT if your sitch, tho I dont know it all, and i think a few things about you. just from what ive saw and admittedly its not a lot.
I think you are a hardcore man with hardcore views and this has shaken you, to your roots; and I think you need to take a step back a little a realise its probably more about your wife and her depression/resentment than it is actually YOU...
you actually seem a lot like me in male form, and if thats true then theres a lot of problems there bc if your like me, you are one of those people who hardline too fast and assume others should be smart enough to do the same and be on the same chapter. The problem is, hardlining too much on your partner who MAY HAVE BEEN hardlined a hell of a lot from you, in the PAST, will run from that because its the same old behavior as always. ie you havent changed.
They will throw up their hands an say "your still the same" and say "you still always think your right" and they will say (maybe not to YOU "even if you ARE right cant I be wrong for once and see how that feels".
Keep in your mind this at all times (and god knows I need to). your W probably knows your right and probably knows your views are valid and probably knows shes done wrong by you... but after all these years might not care much bc shes sick to death of you always being 'right'.
your a smart man, your clever and you have a lot of logic going on. If someone is rebelling and doing everything wrong that is obviously wrong, is telling them that working out for you, or just making it even worse - its called "defiance".
Women cannot defy as outwardly as men for the most part so can choose to do so passively agressively by doing everything wrong deliberately to show you that your not in control.
SOMETIMES, we have to let go and say "do what want then" but actually follow thru with that and actually have the strength of mind and will to bite our tongues and cheeks and hurt our heads by smiling thru the defiance. think of it as you would a teenager who done everyting you hated. do you still love them???? of course. you hate the tattoo you hate the new bf you hate the peircings; but what is harping on that going to do or get you, its gonna make it WORSE. its ATTENTION. how much ATTENTION are YOU giving bad behavior????
i dont know it all im only saying bc I know how i was, and i know how you are and I are, in similarities. if you have no idea what 'passive agressive' is then you will find out. its about teaching that person a lesson in doing absolutely what they hate most bc you CAN. I think your W might be acting out lot against you but its just a hunch so IGNORE me if im wrong.. god knows I am enough.
keep in your mind that acting out is a form of love... we dont bother acting out to anyone we dont care less about. REACTION is probably something you shouldnt even bother showing. try laughing. laughing at someone is probably one of the biggest wakeups you can give.
even when you really dont feel like laughing at all....
also keep in your mind that YOUR peace should be coming first, your peace in your mind and yourself and your very life. Start becoming very protective of it and making a forcefield around it. NO ONE should be able to shake you up, if you dont choose to be shaken anymore. you dont need to make statements about it, actions speak louder than words....
you are a strong man good luck to your W finding a man as strong as you... thats a compliment. take some comfort in the fact that a WEAKER man is ALWAYS gonna be weaker. And shes going to have to live with that then. Once with a strong partner its a real letdown to realise you cant stand toe to toe with them and theres no challenge...
may you find a new challenge ahead if it doesnt work out, who will adore you for your strength and not need to rebel. May I FIND a man so strong.
let it be xoxoxo blessings
When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.
its both a fortunate thing and an unfortuate thing i can touchtype as fast as i can talk. im also on australian time, and its 11pm so seeya all tomorro
and remember... blessings in this life to all, life is worth living, even if right now its only for kids and family, it ownt always be like that so HEAD DOWN and one foot in front of the other...
tomorrow i'll trudge along like always. one day, i'll put my head up, and i think i'll have moved from where I am even if it doesnt feel like it right now
thats life it keeps moving ... we must move along with it an thru the bad times, until we can put our heads up again thru the hard winds and rain, the sunshine will once again come no season remains forever.
the only garantee we have in this life is that nothing will stay the same. in the bad times what a blessing that is
xoxox.
Last edited by FightingFit; 05/26/0901:10 PM.
When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.
AFWAW, I have looked for the beginning of your sitch to read your story but couldnt find it.
FF, In a nutshell, I was deployed to Iraq for 6 months and my wife had 4 PAs and 1 EA, the latest who she claims she is in love with. She left me the day after I returned and my daughter. She let me believe I was the reason she left for 2 months. She then called one day and admitted the PAs and EA and said she wanted to come home. She did so for 3 hours and then left again.
She has threatened to file many times but so far has not.
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The only thing I can comment on right now just from what I have read is that you are VERY ANGRY. this is normal... but you have to ask yourself right now: even if she came back TOMORROW, where do you think all that anger over all this time is gonna go?
I am angry but it's not all because of her. I'm angry at myself for not seeing this coming, for not giving my wife the attention and affection that she needed, for not communicating better throughout our marriage, and for not setting my priorities as I should. I'm angry because I want the opportunity to do so and don't see that I'm going to get the chance with her.
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WOULD SHE DO THAT, the answer is PROBABLY NOT.
I agree, she would probably not. So, what is the answer then? I don't know.
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I just will nothing is gonn change that LOVE. but I dont RESPECT him and he could NEVER do all the things needed to regain that respect. Could your wife, at this stage?
This one perplexes me. She doesn't respect me enough to be with me but she respects me enough to raise our daughter. I don't get it.
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i know it seems way too exhausting to bother with someone else (boy do I know) but exhaustion at the idea of letting someone new in and starting again isnt good enough to keep fighting for someone who does NOT WANT you to fight for them and could NEVER regain your respect, ANYWAY.
I feel this way--I don't want to bother w/ someone else.
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there are many of us out there you know, and there are women out there like you just waiting and hoping, we miss each other thru the fogs of our drama in fighting... think about that some... you might think no thats not true... but it is. I thnk you need to DATE.
Where are these women? I really don't feel like I'm ready to date a this point and probably won't until I am divorced.
I feel like if she chooses to divorce me then I will be forced to have no contact w/ her, EVER! This will be difficult b/c of our daughter but it will be the only way I can maintain my sanity. Thanks very much for you time and feedback. Anything else you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
M-41 ex-W-40 Together--17 years SS-20 D-14 Bomb--2 Feb 09 WAW--6 Feb 09 Officially divorced on 2 Jun 2010!!! ex-W has a boyfriend 8 Jun 2010!!! Off we go into the wild blue yonder!!!!
