When do the tears go away ?

[whitneypinch]

So, in the last few days my W and I have emailed about the kids. All of a sudden she is all syrupy sweet to me. She sends happy faces at the end of emails, tells me to have a nice night and to have a great time with the kids skiing this weekend.
Man, I would love to give her a 2x4 and say smarten up here we have a family, let's start to deal with this.
It just feels like W thinks this arrangement is great. It feels like she thinks that kids are all fine and having fun and her and I get along great...
I don't know, maybe these are baby steps or maybe she thinks I have finally accepted this.

I was thinking last night that this just seems like a bad dream that does not go away. My W and I had sooo many happy times together as we did almost everything together.

Just don't get it. But of course we never get what is going on in our WAW's head.

Just frustrated this morning ! We just seem to stop at being nice to each other and never seem to be able to move any further. It's been 13 months now.
Does the WAW ever think about her kids and how important that they have a family that stays together is? I guess not as they felt there was no option but to leave.
You know I was to blame in a lot of this BUT why is D the only answer? What happened to trying everything to make it work?

I think our throw away culture is so much to blame here. The media just portraits all of these happy images and tells us to go get happy if we are not. What happened to integrity and commitment? I think those attributes are gone in society in general.

[cz946]

Hi Whitney,
Your W sounds so much like my XW. I struggle everyday questioning my friendship with her. I think to myself, I want it all or nothing, but I struggle with the nothing.
And like yours, everytime she contacts me, its about daughter.

This sucks, I hate being divorced. My life used to be great, now it sucks.....

[whitneypinch]

Tell me about it. I don't dare even post what my life used to be. I married into a very weathy family. BUT all I want now is just to have a simple life with my kids and family back together.
My W and I have been texting back and forth all morning, but as usual just about the kids. Anytime I throw anything in there about what she is up to or what I am working on she just ignores it. It's like she has been reading books on how to be divorced.
It's such a waste of a beautiful life and family. I am from a divorced family so I KNOW what it's like. She is not from a divorced family.
I am also just so damn fed up.
I just want to say "what are you doing"?. You have the greatest life available to you so let's start to put it back together.
She just seems more interested in dating other people.
I don't get it !!!!!

[still hopeful]

whitney,

I am confused, like so many here. I see one behavior through my own life filters and interpret its meaning as I do. I could be seeing reality in my sitch or I could be seeing only what I want to see. Everyone in my life has told me that I need to disengage. Everyone has told me that XW needs to 'feel' the reality of being divorced. I am petrified to the point of doing what I've done all along, and THAT behavior pattern was simply a precursor to my being divorced.

I have posted on my thread that XW told me ages ago that addicts are the most manipulative people in the world. Not sure if she IS an addict or if I simply don't want her to be one soooo bad that I fail to recognize that DENIAL is not just a river in Egypt. I know that it is best for all in my life for this situation to end sooner rather than later, regardless of the outcome. Phoenixdeux said it to me best:

Letting go doesn't mean it's over...it just means you quit pining away and start to look at her as your EX wife. I've been where you are. I'm remarried to her, so I know there is hope...but it was just being open to possibility of reconciliation, without actually expecting it, that was more helpful.

Continuing along the same path I have been on has certainly prolonged my situation, but I am unsure if that is good. Perhaps it was supposed to end long ago. I don't really think so, but perhaps.... I simply want closure to my sitch. I want to be done and move forward or explore the opportunity to reconcile and move forward. Either way, I want to move forward. For me. For my children. And yes, for her.

I posted a bunch of stuff on my thread. If you get a chance, pop over there and read it. More stuff about me and my sitch.

I'm not tired of hoping to reconcile. I am just frustrated at the lack of movement in my sitch; the lack of movement in my head; the lack of movement in her. Perhaps moving on MY part will spur movement in my sitch, my head and in her?! I hope to find out soon.

Thank for listening.

Tom

[whitneypinch]

Ahhh Tom,
Good timing. I have been thinking and wondering the same thoughts.
My W and I just had a flurry of emails over the last few days. We even got into a fight and actually for the first time worked through it in a mature, sensitive way. It left me wanting more from her and to be closer. She made it clear if I ever wanted to talk about the kids and any issues with us that she would be fine with that and that we could even do that in person. I could see that she has had no realization on her part at all and has moved on, never looking back for a second. I think if I asked her out she would probably go, but that goes against DBing.
So, I too am confused. Am I supposed to continue to keep the dialogue open and try to get to friendship or am I to disengage.

I too am frustrated with the lack of movement....

Not sure what to do. I think I may pull back again and just leave her. Most people seem to think that she needs to come to me and that I must move forward in life. I do know that it hurts more to be closer to her.

[still hopeful]

Thanks for hanging with me, Brother,

Yes, I am seriously frustrated with the lack of movement in situation and my lack of willingness to force movement by disengaging from her when she calls. Her 'XW-itational' pull on me is irresistible at present. Her pull keeps me in my orbit, and that is not good. I can't be her play toy forever. She will either learn to show me respect as a person, as a man, as the father of our children and as her husband or I will force the movement in my situation from my end.

I do know that my situation will move my situation forward this year. 2010 will NOT start the same as 2009 has started.

I simply want closure to my sitch. I want to be done and move forward or explore the opportunity to reconcile and move forward. Either way, I want to move forward. For me. For my children. And yes, for her.

I just don't want to make hasty changes that have kept me in the reconciliation game this far despite being told for 3 years by my XW that she is all done.

Nope, I haven't come this far in hopes of reconciling, playing by rules that I don't really understand, to push when the right time hasn't arrived for the best possible outcome for all. I have held of on making a phone call to XW's GF who was instrumental in getting me to break through my fears of being COMPLETELY honest to my XW about my past un-confessed self-inflicted disaster mistakes. XW's GF was also very persuasive in getting XW to open up about her true feelings for me that they had previously discussed privately. Regardless, although I had suspected XW's true (and unconfessed to me) feelings about me and us, this was really the first time that I had confirmation of my suspicions. Nice, but possibly dangerous to touch.

I could make contact with XW's girlfriend and simply ask her questions about XW privately between us, but that opens up the risk of GF simply telling XW that I called her to talk, which would come across wrong when told by XW's GF to XW than it would if I either cleared the discussion with GF with XW first or simply let it go and continue to fly blind. Any thoughts? Probably just let it go and fly blind more, I would guess.

I really want to KNOW more about what loops in my XW's head, but I don't want to find it out by forcing movement in my sitch to soon or by simply making the mistake of choosing to contact her GF to find out more and having her GF tell her before telling me anything. Heck, it doesn't matter when GF tells XW that I contacted her w/o XW's knowledge or OK. Perhaps it's all just a bad idea and I shouldn't spend any more mental on brain juggling this hand grenade?

Who the heck knows? I sure don't. And, as XW (seems) to move closer to me, I get sucked in (willingly and stupidly) and end up acting like the useless wuss that I know killed her attraction for me originally. Sadly, I don't act this way with anyone except my XW. Even more sadly, she is the one who matters most to me to act like the alpha male that I am with everyone else in my life. As, I said, movement in my situation is paramount to me, but I don't want to remove an infected splinter with a shotgun. Too much damage. Potentially lethal to my reconciliation efforts.

Anyway, I've ramble on way longer than I intended. It's going on 1am and I gotta get D8 to school in the morning. Take care, Brother.

Tom

[whitneypinch]

Hi Tom,
yep, same exact situation with me.
I would not talk to friend even though she may hold information you want to hear. The friend will tell your W and that will makes things worse.
You and I are in the same boat....the ONLY thing we can do is move on with our lives. We are kind to our W when they contact us but we need to move on.
If they want us then they will come back. PERIOD.
Is is so sad and messed up but we can only work on us and our children.

[still hopeful]

whitney,

Thank you for being siding with the rational, well-grounded part of my mind to stay out of the detective business. I know that the upside of knowing more is minimal and the downside is ruinous.

I'll keep working on me, taking care of my children, and striving to detach in a loving and supportive but still assertive way.

Again, I know that phoenixdeux's advice to me is the way to go, as MY way has simply kept me stuck and prolonged my sitch, perhaps unnecessarily. I don't know the answer for which I search, but I do know that MY way is not THE answer to achieving my reconciliation goal.

I don't wish to keep XW emotionally afloat while she searches for another BandAid (in the from of yet another DH) to get her through missing me, her marriage and her united family unit, while she she continues to REFUSE to think, process, feel and heal. An emotional tampon, I will be no longer. She can always talk her emotions out of HER personal situations with her GFs, and I am NOT one of those. I strive to be her husband again, NOT another one of her male 'good friends.'

So, yes, I will inch away from my XW emotionally and gently direct her to other people in her life who, in her mind, are more important to her than I am, so she can squeeze all of the emotional drama out of her crises. I need to create some emotional distance between the two of us so that I can clearly determine how best to proceed.

Thanks.
Tom

[whitneypinch]

Hi Tom,
Happy I can help in anyway.

What I have learned is to only talk about my W with one friend that does not know my W.
I had been talking to mutual friends and learned stuff about my W that I didn't want to hear. It ended up effecting how I viewed my W, in a negative way.

This morning I dropped my D off at school and out of the blue she started crying and would not let me leave. One of the teachers snatched her from my arms and she was crying for daddy.
It breaks my heart as I know my D has the extra burden of our D to also live with. I texted my W to tell her what happened and to my shock she actually phoned me back to see if I was alright.
She has never phoned me like this in over a year !!
I sent a text to say thank you for calling and she sent me back a text with a hug. Woooooow.

I am just going to continue to keep my distance and not initiate.

It's all we can do.

[still hopeful]

whitney,

Thanks again for helping me to side with my own voice of reason. My experience in talking with mutual 'friends' that know XW has been mostly that the women want XW to 'pull her head out' and the men want me to disengage, move on and forget about her. The consensus on this board is clearly to let go and move on. If she wants to come back then she knows where I am and then I will have THE decision to make, won't I. The hard part is letting go of my 'perceived' control of my sitch. But who am I kidding besides myself? I don't have any control in my sitch, only control over me and I have done all that I can DO to initiate reconciling with my XW. She knows what I want w/o any R talk.
I am sad to hear about the effects of your D on you D. I am sooo saddened by the effects of my D on our children. I remember in the beginning, XW told me that some of her friends had told her that divorces don't really affect small children. I told her immediately that whichever 'friend' told her that had no clue. Everything I have read tells me that a divorce is a 'DEFINING' time in a child's life. They FEEL everything. Not understanding makes it even more confusing for them, as they often incorrectly blame themselves. Let's hold us together together, my friend. Yes, it's all we can do.

Today, is the day that I initiate disengaging and holding on to the outcome. Of course, I will remain open to reconciling, but I will stop chasing and stop being an emotional tampon Spending time hear reading and posting helps me to move forward, even if it's just a little bit at a time.

I need to be the man that both she and I need for me to be. She can't reconcile her M with me acting like a GF of hers.

Tom

p.s.