Does anyone here....ever..move past THIS part of the sadness? The pain that the kids go thru?
I wish I could tell you yes. But in my heart, I don't believe we ever do. Maybe it will wane in time. I know I will never get past this part of the sadness. My children deserved better and they were pretty much grown up when our world came crashing down. Your children are still small and may be better able to adapt. Bottom line. Children of divorce are always damaged by the disintegration of their nuclear family...whether they are 5 or 50.
I wish it were not so.
Hugs, Spitty
Always do right. This will gratify some people, and astonish the rest. Mark Twain
FIB, ((ouch)) Okay, so when is the damn time period up? I need a number of days I can count so we all know when we can celebrate...Geez. A few little thoughts. The Christmas tree you helped with, but you also seem bugged the kids are being raised Jewish, as promised, so why the confusing symbols? Well, for one thing, though Christmas trees were originally "Christian", they've become part of the Santa /secular/vague whatever goes part of the holiday. I have Jewish friends who like Christmas trees and put the Channukah presents under them. Wth? Not for me to judge. And I have Jewish friends who don't mind celebrating Jesus's birthday b/c they see him as a good guy and I suspect they'd do the same for Martin Luther King if that were the tradition. It's not necessarily so bad, is it? I mean, can the kids be exposed to both faiths generically, without feeling like traitors? Recall that so much of Judeo-Christian thougt is just that; both...and the main emphasis sounds like it's Jewish, with some Christian/secular traditions that are socially practiced, also coming into play. From a kids viewpoint, the more gift reasons the better. And the whole Santa with presents is way cool.
Your wife so bothers me, and yet, with all that anger from her you are overlooking the obvious. You think her hatred means something it does not. Indifference would be better in some ways, MAYBE...but she is far from indifferent. Her anger shows how much power you still have, AND OR how miserable she is inside. It matters NOT. I don't think you should worry about what she thinks/does/says as long as it doesn't hurt the kids. As I said somewhere else, you may as well worry and obsess about snowfall levels. You have no control over this woman. I'm not sure what she means by calling YOU a hypocrite? Whatever... snowfall??? Wear more layers!
Again, give us a time line so we know how long you/we have. I want to make the paper chain my d11 has for Christmas, wherein you tear one paper ring for each day closer to the big day. It will be like Christmas for us on this board, the day your wife and you don't have to be under the same roof...Good God...
I never was clear about your med practice, pre-marriage so I'm not sure how that works though I'm familiar with forensic accountants looking at practices. But things will come out in the custody arrangements that will likely have an effect on the judge. I mean, not officially since it's supposed to be irrelevant. But judges are human. When they hear of her going out and somehow, somehow getting the word out about her night time acitivities, and your lack thereof, (for now) it will occur to the judge that something is amiss. I'm female and admit to a subconscious bias in favor of women that I try to fight. I think I'm fundamentally fair or at least I try to be. But I also have women's intuition and I have cornered women like your wife in my office when I was stuck doing legal assistance and told them exactly what I thought of their choices. Dumping or mistreating a guy who is a good man, is foolish and selfish. Women aren't blind and male judges will pick up on this too. I pray your wife attacks you in front of people and that you keep some of the crazier messages. In fact, I urge you to do so.
Did you say your L has experience in the med practice analysis? God, I'd hold off on any increases in income until after W can't get her paws on any. How's HER career going? You know, she may marry soon and that'd be good news for you financially. Won't her alimony end upon cohabitation or remarriage? I don't see her alone for long. She needs to feel desired, by guys who aren't better than her. Since she's attractive and was once married to a doctor, some men see it as an accomplishment to win over a "good catch" like her. I know that may sound painful to you but my God, it'll be favor.
Remember that story I told you about my aunt, who was broken hearted by an unfaithful husband decades ago? (Well, though I tell it all the time I forgive you if it slipped your mind...of course, I'll now repeat it and if you Do recall it, I apologize for repeating myself) ANYHOW...her h left her and the 2 kids, dirt broke, for OW and married OW. (Part of her being dirt broke was that the h lived overseas and didn't have to obey US laws...nice touch for a diplomat). After 6 months of borrowing from in laws, She got a teaching job in elementary school so her kids had her hours, thankfully. It wasn't what she had wanted for a career, but she put motherhood first. 8 years passed and the OW called my aunt to ask if H was there, with my aunt...MEANING, h was still cheating! now it was with ow the 'new wife' and the man just isn't a man who can be faithful. My aunt said a wave of relief swept over her at that time, so many realizations hit her.
Her X H had done her a huge favor, though a painful one at the time, he had saved her years--a LIFE TIME of pain by leaving her. The OW had become his w and SHE had 8 years of the same crap my aunt had gone through before. And more, since she (ow-new wife) is still with the guy, and they're both bitter. My aunt? Oh, she remarried, for 25 years she had a good marriage to a close friend of her first H, and then her 2nd h died suddenly. She is now in a good solid fun R with her younger 60 year/old bf and says the "sex is great!" I love it when my 70 year old aunt says stuff like that. (She looks 50 and can almost out run me, seriously in good California work out shape). FIB, my earliest memories were of this aunt crying to my mother, about her h leaving her. She was smart and dressed well and was in the foreign service and she seemed destroyed. I know she landed at the DC airport with $28 in her pockets and two toddlers holding her hands, and got no money at all from her h overseas, for months at a time. After all, he had a new family to care for as the OW had kids and a h she had to dump too.
But the day the OW called trying to find her h, (ie my aunt's xh), my aunt knew that OW had entered my aunt's former hell, and that my aunt had been freed & was free to love someone who wouldn't give her an ulcer every time h claimed to be "working late".
FIB, your w would continue her behavior if you stayed. For God's sake, your filing has not improved her behavior at all. If anything, your filing seems obviously to be the right thing for YOU and your kids. How else will your children see what a normal R looks like down the road? My friend "E", the widower with 4 kids is not ready to date and says he barely has enough to give his kids what they need. He said "I'm too selfish right now, conserving my energy for me and the kids, I don't have anything to give another person and it'd be unfair..." Now THAT guy will be a catch, when he's ready. Granted, his grief was sudden and his M was one we'd all envy. 14 months later, he says he feels "less insane", but my hunch is that when he is ready to date, he'll be truly ready and healthy and will love again. His children will see that and that's a good thing. In your case, your kids will finally see a good M. They would never see that with your w's behavior.
I don't like what your w tells the kids for their sakes. She doesn't need to say you can't be friends. Doesn't she talk to child psychologists at all? I know I did and even my h did go with me as to what to say when we thought we'd have to address the obvious fact that we were struggling in our M. I told d11 that I didn't know if we were getting a D, (I know you can't say that, but a lot of what we were told COULD be said in your sitch too).
Things like "I've loved your dad/mom a long time and always will...even if we can't stay married..." "The main thing we both know is that we will ALWAYS love you and your happiness is the most important thing to me---and for my youngest, the most comforting I think she heard was, "I'll only do what I think will make you the happiest in the long run", knowing that fighting insanely isn't the answer, but moving around and around searching for whatever h thought he wanted...was not going to make her or me happy. WHEn we were in Alaska, d11 wanted to move back her from a month or two into the move. I promised her we'd give it a year, as she had promised. But her tears and missing home here, and her friends, and my own feelings there, and H's work contract being breached, ALL were good reasons to leave Alaska. But D11 remembered that promise I made and threw it in my face and said "You promised me my happiness mattered the most!" and so I kept my promise, and said, "if you don't change your mind, and if we can't make it work here, we'll move back." WE landed here, in California, on her 11th birthday... If you make the promise, keep it. WIthin the confines of your sitch. I couldn't promise that we'd stay M, and d11 knew that.
Like your kids, She was afraid of who would take care of her and how many OTHER parts of her life would change or be lost with the vague, frightening concept known as "divorce". That seems to be their biggest fear. I have a book called "What about the kids?" Skip past the part about how bad it is for kids since sometimes, WE DON'T HAVE A CHOICE...and move to the part about "OKAY IT'S HAPPENING ANYHOW, SO NOW WHAT?" And that's what can help. Your sitch was impossible to continue and I mean it with all my heart when I say your kids are some of the few who would NOT benefit by your M continuing as your wife now is, and has been for about 2+ years. It must end. It is NOT good for your kids for you to be m to this woman. SO, in your case, D is the painful, but crucial step in the direction of finding THEIR happiness, and yours.
FIB, pardon me for asking you something, but you're the most likely to know what I'm asking. It's a partial hijack and I apologize. H is coming for 2 weeks, before returning to be near his mom. I don't know how much she needs him just now as she is stable, and he has another brother there. This is the 2nd time in 20 years he really lived near his mom, though when we lived there 10 years ago very little effort was made to visit her often and she never once came to our home. She only visited us long distance once, until we flew her out here to Stanford for a 2nd opinion on the small cell lung ca, (with mets to the brain--surgery helped--and some PET Scan results showing pancreatic/splenic involvment, though minimal at the time.)
Thanks for the kind words about sticking by h right now, with his mom's illness. I once told a woman not to leave her h while he was deployed to Afghanistan as I said, " you're a real loser to leave a guy in combat. What bad thing can't wait til he gets back? He can't beat you from there..." and I said similar things to men with pregnant wives, you know ,"Stick it out and suck it up until the baby is a year old, and don't judge your M by sleep deprived hormonal swings and stressors like a newborn gives you. Now I've added the category of those losing parents. Don't kick a dog when he's down, etc. But I don't know if I'm the one thinking of leaving so much as he is. He says he loves me, misses us, etc. But there is no real movement on the job search HERE. Just back east near his mom where he used to work as a resident long ago.
He has always hated job hunts though his hunts are easier than anyone's I know. I mean, he'll call a job that is listed online, (or I will) and get a return call 90% of the time and obvious interest. For every interview he has gone on, he has gotten an offer. So He has this expectation of a job landing in his lap and now that HE has added criteria to what he wants, he makes it harder to get one here. I don't know how to read into all this. But you are right about his being down, and I don't want to bail on him now. But something in me feels HE is bailing, by default...living over there and not having a real plan for getting back here anytime soon. Floating along....Maybe he wants me to move back there but won't come out and say it? or maybe he doesn't want that...maybe he likes this semi-married/semi-single life style. I don't even know how to ask. I did offer him this chance to leave us again, to be with her as she was given 6-8 months (in Feb of '08) and that passed 3-4 months ago. He is missing yet another year of our daughter's lives..and my life is on hold waiting for him...(Yes, I read that as I wrote it and will somehow stop letting his absence stop me from moving forward but hey, it IS harder for a single mom to take the credential classes and tests and interview when no one is home to help...oops, I'm back sliding Frank).
YES He is depressed re: his lost dream job that he gambled so much on, and MUST feel embarrassed by, since it ended for all the reasons I predicted (but didn't say "I told you so!") like they broke their promises, they didn't pay him more money but LESS, LESS than he was earning before he did the fellowship that cost us our savings, since his income dropped 88% (but hey who's counting?).
SO career wise, he has taken a big hit from which we have not recovered and which must wound him and maybe shame him. My job in Alaska as their in house counsel paid well but was semi-terrifying in that their business tactics made me worry about losing MY law license, if you catch my drift... and I lost that job with the move... so I'm getting my teaching credential b/c I LIKE teaching and it has benefits and great hours for the kids and h is still not here. But as to his depression, of course his mom's illness plays a big part in that But FIB, I'm worried that his temp work is tempting him to stay out there longer than is necessary. I offered him the chance to spend the summer with his mom and to get a job that would allow him to visit her when she was crashing. But she is stable now, surprisingly to all of us, (and I do know that's a blessing, but that she is not 'cured") and now it has been 7 months of being apart mostly, AGAIN, and while he'll be home for the holidays, he's going back to DC for another 90 days. WTH? I am worried that he's doing something really stupid (nope, I'm not snooping, but can't even deal with that concept now) or going back into the tunnel and I can't take that again. I feel taken advantage of, again. Some friends said I was great for "letting him leave again to take care of his mom" and I had thought, "geez, who wouldnt' support their spouse being with their mom as long as they could afford it?" But now I worry (we can't really afford it much longer either,) and my mind races about all the things doctor's wives worry about, fears I'd long ago conquered. After all, I was an Army lawyer and then a civilian one, with 85% men around me and never cheated and most law firms have numbers just a little lower. Wow, I can't let my mind do this to me. Some days I wonder if I'm naiive. How many doctors can't stay faithful?
How hard is it for him to find a job here? Not a perfect job, but a bread and butter anesthesia job. Forget the damn fellowship for now, just earn something near home...Am I off base? His first civilian job is one I found on the internet in 2 hours. (He wanted the Alaskan job even then but I didn't know that "plan" back then). I found a well paying normal sounding job in sunny California for him to check, per his request. But He didn't believe their ad, but they called for us to go and interview and poof, we moved out there and the pay WAS great and the cost of lving was low (Central California) and we found a good school district in a spot and lo and behold, no problem...he CHOSE to take extra call, and work himself insanely. He didn't need to do that. But he did. I had limited career options but hey, his income made up for that mostly. What's your market like in New York and don't you feel as a doctor more or less recession proof? What effects are these economic problems having on the field? I'm running out of ways to be supportive but can't take eternal celibacy and solo parenting as a way of life, AND say I'm married. Make sense?
thanks for listening. and again. tell me the number count for when your wife will no longer be under the same roof. Good God.
((( ))) j-
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
25...I am going to get at this in pieces. HUGS. You're back.
I agree with much of what you say above with regards to Judeo-Christian similarities. I am doing the best I can to not let my own insecurities interfere. I am not a bigot. I grew up with all my Christian friends....my favorite movie is Miracle on 34th St (I believe in Santa myself)...colored Easter eggs and sat on Santa's lap as a kid...went to midnight masses...and embraced my W's return to her religion and even purchased her a Christmas tree. It is her 'pushing the boundary' on her promise that I am trying not to let get to me: she promised to raise the kids this way. The kids were born under one religion, not two....My D5 told me the other day that my MIL told her she was 1/2 each which is NOT true.
BUT....this was something that helped to divide us...my request that she convert prior to marriage: -"it was a precondition to marrying you" -"you should never try and change anybody"
Obviously, this is only a small thing in the big picture. Christmas trees and Menorahs don't push you into the backseat of cars in bar parking lots.
I guess, like posts on frank_d's threads....I should still be grateful that I have 2 healthy children for now.
More to come on your post. Hugs. FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
As many know from my sitch, my W is not kind to our dog who is a rescued greyhound now 12 years old.
Tonite, there was a commotion downstairs. My W was on the couch watching TV. For the second time in about a year, the dog walked right up to her and, as she watched TV and ignored him (as she usually does), he lifted his leg and pee'd on the corner of the coffee table (never happened to me).
I think the message was clear.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
Wow, dogs are uncanny, to the point, and surreal. I recently was asked to review an acquaintance's outdoor play. It was supposed to be Shakespeare, but this "director" thought she should "make it more accessible" so she changed it into 1920's Chicago gansters, (WTH?) as if somehow that would do the trick and as if SHE is qualfiied to "tweak" Shakespeare. It was horrible as a plot line with her nonsensical twists, as was the directings and staging and so much...Still, I wanted to support ALL live theater so I attended, and as luck would have it, someone brought a dog. During one particular scene, the dog went up near the stage and in front of a big crowd, literally defecated. I now feel my own review would be redundant... j=
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
