chicki's 7th thread -latest drama

[RMG77739]

SPM,

I suggested my previous approach more as a "getting under" his skin approach... Not the most productive or effective approach... However, sometimes it just feels good to take a jab....

I think your approach is spot on here....

He does NEED to respect her boundaries....

RMG

[Livin4ME]

I agree whole heartedly with what everyone has said. It is not OK for him to treat you this way. He does not respect you as a person. I've gone thru the same mess. He even was living with OW and cheating on her with me. His W!!! And I thought I was winning. But I was just causing myself more harm than good and he didn't care. He was getting sex. That's all that mattered to him. I was a sex toy to him.
My sister told me something several years ago that only recently makes sense. (weird cuz my sis was still a teenager when she told me this! and I'm older than her! lol) She said that she used to do everything she could to get a reaction out of me. She would call me names, pick on me, irritate me, you name it, she did it. And it would piss her off so bad because I never reacted the way she wanted me to. She wanted me to blow up at her. Cuz then she felt she had succeeded in what she was doing. But all I did was kill her with kindness. I was nice to her. I still did what I wanted to do, but I told her no in a nice way. And that pissed her off. She never got what she wanted. She never got that reaction she wanted. I just went on about my business like she wasn't even there. Drove her nuts!!!! But let me tell you when she left, I would go off about it to someone else!!!
I'm not saying do it just like that. Definitely state that what he is doing is not appropriate. Definitely follow up with a letter like the others have said. Not only to reconfirm what you have already said, because he is just thinking you're playing hard to get. But also because it gives you a paper trail. You need the paper trail in case anything is done later legally. But don't let him know he's getting to you. Do it after he leaves. He doesn't respect you. He will think he's winning if he sees a reaction.

[SirPrizeMe]

She said that she used to do everything she could to get a reaction out of me. She would call me names, pick on me, irritate me, you name it, she did it. And it would piss her off so bad because I never reacted the way she wanted me to. She wanted me to blow up at her. Cuz then she felt she had succeeded in what she was doing. But all I did was kill her with kindness. I was nice to her. I still did what I wanted to do, but I told her no in a nice way. And that pissed her off. She never got what she wanted. She never got that reaction she wanted. I just went on about my business like she wasn't even there. Drove her nuts!!!! But let me tell you when she left, I would go off about it to someone else!!!

I can just imagine the dynamics. I can see this in my kids even now. But you know, when I read this story, I get the sense that the focal point was what the sister was feeling. For Chicki, that perspective is not relevant.

I'm not suggesting chicki maintain boundaries in order to affect her ex's feelings, or drive him crazy, or piss him off. I'm suggesting she take action to protect herself, to strengthen herself, to be right with herself. I don't really care about the guy who is harassing he;, whether he is po'd or not is not my concern, and I don't think, at this point, it should be chicki's concern.

This is about Chicki and her ability to say NO to things that are not healthy.

---
Having said that,
having sex with your ex - or "cheating" with your ex - is a different topic. I wouldn't rule it out in all cases. I can totally see that in some cases it would be unhealthy and wouldn't feel right for the left-behind-spouse. On the other hand there are scenarios where it would be not on very effective in DBing, but also healthy and nurturing for the spouses, if done in an atmosphere of respect.

And I know, all this mumbo jumbo about respect and boundaries - it all sounds like B.S. - we're talkin about sex here! Doin' the deed! Having some fun between the sheets! But respectful interactions don't mean "no fun". People can be sexual and playful and respectful, all at the same time.

ps: Confused, "Finding Nemo" is one of my FAVORITE movies.

[Livin4ME]

I know Sir....I might not have explained it right....what I meant was...don't worry about him. Just continue living like he's not there, even tho he's trying his hardest and everything. Just continue living her life. Because that's what I was doing while my sister was playing her games. To me, it wasn't a game. It's just what I did. I had no clue she considered it part of her game until she pointed it out to me.
So to bring into Chicki's sitch...to him, it's a game. To chicki, it's just living her life like he doesn't matter.
Regarding the sex, it's a game to him. It's a way to control her. He obviously doesn't wanna relationship with her or else he wouldn't be with OW. It's just free sex. Whenever he wants it. Not all sitchs are the same. But that's how it is in mine. He got it from OW when he wanted when living with me. He got it from me when he wanted it when he was living with OW. Yeah, sex is fun, it's great. But if he's with OW and still getting sex from me, it's not respectful in any way, shape or form. And I feel that as long as he's with OW, he's not trying to build on any type of relationship with me. Ya know?
I know it took me a long time to realize this and I may say it bluntly...but when sex is involved pertaining to exspouses, it's very tricky. You have a bond with each other. And it's especially hard for the LBS regarding emotions. Whereas, for the WAS, it's very easy. It's a control issue. They know they can control you regarding sex. But that's all it is. It took me forever to realize that. I thought we were building our R because sex brings us closer. But he wouldn't stick around after, he would get up after alittle bit, get dressed and go home to her. And then the next time he saw me, it would happen again. He was controlling me. He was a cake eater. And it sounds like her X is the same way. If he respected her at all, especially regarding sex, he wouldn't be making inappropriate gestures to her about BJ's. And the same if he respected any type of R with her.
Right now, he sees her as a sex toy. He can try and try and try and finally she'll give in and he can win that battle and go back home. He doesn't care about whatever emotions might go thru her head before, during or afterwards. It's just sex.
And that's fine and dandy if that's all you want. But if you're trying to move on and have a healthy life and future R's, the sex has to stop. Because as long as you keep doing it with that person, the longer that person has control of you and the longer it's going to take you to accomplish another healthy R and healthy life.
Again, I'm sorry for my bluntness. And maybe it's because mine went on like that for so long and I'm very passionate about protecting yourself and your emotions that I'm like that.

[Livin4ME]

btw, Sir...Nemo is awesome! Isn't funny how these 'KID' movies have so many things adults can pull from them to use in their own lives! lol I love disney movies!

[chicki]

Confused,

Now I'm very intersted in yr stich. So,I may have quite a few questions for you.

Your H sounds very much as controlling as my X.
So I understand your not D yet?

X has been 'doing nice things' lately like fixing things w/ out my asking (unlike him) & not complaining afterwards (very unlike him). Then a few weeks ago D11 tells me daddy showed them the apartments he wants to move into (byhimself) w/out OW. He didnt want the girls to tell me or OW.

Can you tell me how long did u continue having sex w/ him though he still lived w/ OW? I stoped once the D was final. Now I only pity him, but sometimes its hard to turn him down, temptation & all. I have been turning him down good so far.

[Livin4ME]

Hey Chicki...didn't mean to highjack your thread.
He filed back in Feb and dismissed it in Aug. Refiling today. He initially left last Aug. We started a 'friends with benefits' R middle of Oct. 2 weeks later, I found out about OW he was living with. He came back home. Left 2 weeks later. I went to another state to visit my family for 2 months in Dec. He came and got us end of Jan. Left 2 weeks later. Sex started again in April, he came back home in May, left 2 weeks later. Same day he left, he came back begging to take him back, I made him leave. Sex again in July, he came home end of July, told me OW was PG, dismissed D beginning of Aug. OW miscarried 2 weeks and 1 day after he came home. He left today. I know there were times in between then we were also having sex and he would try coming back, but I can't remember anymore.
In July tho, that's all I wanted was sex. He came back on his own. And I made it clear that's all I wanted. But he continued the A with OW the whole time.
When they were having problems, he would call me up and talk me into having sex. It was very hard because each time we started having sex, he would come home. So I thought we were rebuilding our R. He's very persuasive!!! And I won't lie, I thought the sex was great! Better in fact than when we were actually together!! And I'm a sexual person, so I felt that it was better to have it with him, than someone I didn't know, or barely knew. And because we were still legally M, I felt I couldn't start another R with someone else, even tho he was. We both even experimented with things sexually to 'spice' things up. Inviting others in and all. It's not something that I would normally do. But again, he's very persuasive and I felt it's what I needed to do to help my R. Looking back, I was just hurting myself and he was controlling my emotions to fulfill his own fantasies.
STBX did the 'nice things' also. Showing up unexpectantly to cut the grass. Fixing the holes in the walls that he had made when I was visiting my family. Giving me extra money during the month for things around the house. It's great and all, but it was just his way to keep controlling me.
I don't know if that's your X's intentions, but honestly, I wouldn't hold your breath until he has moved into that apartment and it's very clear that it's completely over with OW. And if he doesn't want you OR the OW knowing about the apartment, it sounds like he's still not sure if he's going to take it.
Forgive what he has done to you. Not for him, but for you. You really truly can't move on until you've forgiven him and yourself. But don't forget. Forgetting means forgetting the lessons you've learned and that makes everything you've done for yourself pointless.

[chicki]

Thanks Confused.

On forgiveness, thats exactly what I did and I told him so right from the start. It was easy for me to do? Dont know why exactly but I knew that if I didnt The one up above would never forgive me. It really is freeing you once you do that.

X is very secretive when it comes to his plans, always has been that way. If he asked D11 what she thoguht of him getting his own place, its b/c he's been seriuosly thinking about it but doesnt know when he will do it. I didnt think he could afford it really.

OW is and has been 'buying his love'. She has the $. X told me a long time ago the only reason he stays there was b/c he lives there for free. I beleive it in a way for before he use to complaing about our $ issues and how he didnt want the D but to get out of debt including the mortgage.

[SirPrizeMe]

I totally get what you are saying, Confused. Except you don't sound confused at all. (If you are accepting votes, I vote that you change your sign-in name. )

You have some good experience in this area to share with chicki. It's too bad you had to go through it but maybe chicki can benefit from what you learned.

[Livin4ME]

Chicki,
It is very freeing once we have forgiven. I definitely have some things to work on because they're still 'fresh', but I've forgiven him for the earlier stuff in our M. My problem before tho, was that I forgot as well.
My STBX was the same. OW is his sugar momma. She works at a dentist office and was getting his teeth worked on for free. Giving him the Invisaline stuff and all this other stuff. She's bought him hundreds of dollars worth of clothes that he's only allowed to wear when he's with her. Paying his bills that he can't afford. Paying for their night outs. It will get old tho. As of right now, with our amount of debt, plus the child support he will be paying, he'll be over $500 in the hole every month. And she'll pay for it for a while. But it's gonna get old. Then what are they going to have!? Definitely not love. And love doesn't pay the bills.
We definitely had money issues, but I also haven't worked since having our daughter, at his urging. I'm about to finish my schooling and be able to get a job with the certificate I'm getting. But that's still not going to affect the child support because I haven't worked in 1.5 years. We both were spontaneous spenders. Didn't think about what we were buying at the time. I've since worked on it and am getting it under control.
Thanks Sir, I've been contemplating changing it...just gotta come up with a good one!
People have asked me before...if you could go back, would you do it again or no? I'm torn. On one hand, I wouldn't wish it on anyone. But on the other, the lessons I've learned have changed my life so much. And I wouldn't have my 2 beautiful children with me now.