Sounds like you're giving her the benefit of the doubt. Always wise (when you can do it).
I'm always surprised and sad when things don't go well for you. You are indeed the ACE of DB-ers and you help us all out of a jam all the time.
What can we do in return?
Tell you how awesome you are: patient, affectionate, a devoted father, kind, forgiving.
Remind you that from an outsider's view there are little sweetnesses in with the sournesses -- after she freaked out, your W did say she may have read too much into things.
That's pretty good.
Of course, then she pouts.
Which is her pattern. Sigh. So sorry for that aspect of things. Know how it feels to be shunned. Hard to keep up PMA.
But you know, I think you are working TOO HARD. Something different might be to kick back and play.
I recommend a guitar.
Tee hee. But open a board game, a bottle of wine, a magazine -- plunk down in the middle of whatever mess there is -- and be undistractable as you puzzle through the game or whatever.
Show them you can have fun, that you will have fun. You deserve some fun.
Don't let the sun go down on you funless again!
Too much work, on top of a sour atmosphere, and you're a candidate for your own depression.
Keeping in contact with my relatives means long distance calls. Since W's cell plan includes free long distance, she allows me to use her phone. Lately, I've notice she has been clearing the call history, so I got on-line and checked. There is a cell number I didn't recognize that has been called three times in the last two months. The second one was long enough a call that it had to be a conversation. This occurred the week before W's first C session. The third was just last Friday.
I called the number and got a voice mail greeting, "Leave a message." It was a guy's voice and by the tone seem familiar. So I called OM's cell number from last year. The number is no longer in service. He evidently switched carriers. This would also mean she has had some prior contact to get the new number. I know I can't do anything with this, but it does explain alot of her recent behavior. As Matilda nd others have said, you can tell when something is not quite right. Come to think about it Matilda did confront her H about it, which in turn was the catalyst that eventually did finally turn her M around, so maybe there is something I can do?
The difference here is, my W actually had a strong attraction to OM and I believe it he who basically broke it off. She even journalled, that even tho he treats her like sh*t, she still has strong feelings for him.
A couple of times around this time last year, she asked me if I'm to stay in this M what do I do with the feeling I have for him? I replied, if we work on nuturing the bond between us, the ones you have for him will fade.
In fact the whole foundation I had built my trust on ... to regain myself from my insecurities so we can move on ... to believe as long as I remain true to myself and who I want to be, she would want to be with me as well is nothing more than crap!
Uh oh! I better stop. I don't like the direction this post is taking.
Don't worry tho. As they say, when the way is not clear, do nothing. I will not do anything until I sort thru these emotions and I can start thinking rationally again, all the while just watch and monitor as much as possible while continuing to be the best person I can be...
Thanks bb, jethro and Bridget for the moral support. That does help alot...altho any suggestions would be very welcomed.
KAW, sorry to hear about all of this stuff. But, I have to ask a question...how do you KNOW that it's the OM? Seems like, given what you've written, your investigating is somewhat speculative. Did I miss something or did you omit something??? Perhaps it's a different C she's calling and talking to?
Quote: In fact the whole foundation I had built my trust on ... to regain myself from my insecurities so we can move on ... to believe as long as I remain true to myself and who I want to be, she would want to be with me as well is nothing more than crap!
I know, KAW... But you know what, just continue to remain true to yourself. It's not crap because, in the end, you can live with yourself. Seems like your W continues to have troubles with that herself.
I did talk to him once shortly, pretending to be interested in an apartment he had for rent in order to get some background on him. The "leave a message" greeting sounds like the same tone and accent, but I know with just three words, I can't be sure, but is the same kind of greeting he had on his old cell phone.
Yea its all speculation at this point (altho I'm contemplating calling the number again, can I pull off being interested in an apartment again?), but a lot of things lately are adding up to this scenario fitting the best with how she is acting lately and her one line comments, rather than just being depressed. Hard to get into it without writing alot, but like clearing the call history on her cell phone, they are the kind of actions that only occurred when OM was on the scene.
Okay...I see... I do believe that we need to follow our instincts in these situations, because most of the time they are right due to inconsistencies with our S's behavior.
Frankly, KAW, if it were me, I would confront her...big time... That's me, though. You seem to be a bit more mild-mannered. After all the work you've put into your R, after all of the sacrifices you've made, after all of the letting go you've done, you are entitled to some respect, my friend. Good DBing? He!!, I don't know, but sometimes enough is enough, you know?
But before doing anything, I think you should really be sure...get your ducks in a row. I assume you know OM's name? Perhaps you could call the cell number and confirm the name before going into some kind of phony sales/marketing spiel for some bogus services. As soon as you start the phony spiel you could "accidentally" hang up. He should be none the wiser...if it's him. Of course, if it isn't him, then you'll still wonder who it is...
You are right -- sometimes the signals don't add up -- in my sitch I spied to find out what H was hiding.
My C says that's a really low thing to do. But I felt incredible relief when I knew what was going on -- even though it also made me ill.
When the O-chick was on the scene, my H got mean. I knew it. I just knew something wasn't right.
Maybe because we're so bonded with them, or maybe we're intuitive -- or maybe because humans look for motives and there are only so many cards in the motive deck -- but we want to know why.
The mind wants to know why, and will speculate.
Why the flip-flops? Why the mean behavior? Why can't we work things out like we used to? Why why why?
(Not that knowing takes away the pain. Everyone says snooping hurts mostly YOU.)
Before I knew about the O-chick, when H got hostile and distant, I tried and tried to make things better. "Oh, honey, I'm sorry I was so (fill in the blank) -- I didn't know it bothered you so much, I'll work on it."
(You want lingerie? You want amusement? Here goes...)
Oh, I see, that's not it -- it's my driving?
I can navigate better in the car. Wait, no, that's not it either? I see, it's the way I answer the phone that's so galling you have to leave home.
See, you can't really trust their words when they're in their altered state.
Which is crazy-making.
Which is why at first DB-ing seems infuriating. It's so NOT FAIR to turn the other cheek in order to get to the heart of matters. It's so NOT FAIR to be patient and suffer slings and arrows.
But on the up-side (and I hate to admit there is one) we have built so much character that we can now star in any production, on any continent, with any leading lady or man -- we're big box office.
We've worked on our flaws. We've become deliberately kind -- in the face of grotesque horn-headed monsters. We have developed and learned and reached out to others to help them learn, too.
We're awesome. We've done good work. (I know I am not only a better driver & more polite on the phone but I'm less angry and demanding, to boot.)
What is a shame is that even though we are the rock stars we are, we feel so insecure.
Self-esteem is eroded in an atmosphere of criticism, rejection and stress. Everyone needs boosting and applause upon occasion. That's one reason we marry -- to give and take support.
I feel so sad that you are not getting your cheerleading, KAW. You're a good guy, and when you hurt, you should have kindness and reassurance. We all need this. And we're all feeling the loss of this from our (in my case former) partners.
I know it's going to take me some time to heal from the dissing my H pitched my way.
It alarms me when I feel puny, worthless, bedraggled, dried-out and over-with. But I bounce back better. I don't go to him for love anymore. He's not a source of it for me.
Sigh.
We can't let the grimness get out of hand, so good work stopping the downward spiral, KAW.
What you wrote me on my thread -- RIGHT BACK AT YA!
You will be self-doubting but that's because you are nice. She is mean not because of how you trim your fingernails but because she's a mess and doens't have the skills you have and is confused right now.
I think we need to let the pool still, the water clear, for these confused spouses of ours.
Sigh again.
You have many skills, and much character, and you get to choose how long you'll put up with this situation. You will hurt, but you will heal. You're a winner.
Vent here. Sharing the fear shines a light on it and shrinks it. We just can't let it get out of hand, or start believing "what they say" or how they act toward us.
But don't let her -- her MLC -- her immaturity -- kill your spirit.
Turn to something more positive. And dance.
I'm thinking 180 for ya here -- can you leave town on a four-day weekend road trip with your CD collection and no particular destination except maybe the beach?
Did wonders for me.
(Hey, KAW, I got beach. Up for a couple-thousand-mile drive?)
Make that lady wonder where you are!
These are just my speculations, take with a "train" of salt, my friend.
I do understand where you are at, and I commend you and support you.
(And I'm grateful for your always thoughtful words to me, thanks so much.)
KAW -- Sorry that you're going through this. You may know from reading my thread that I've been plagued by recurring thoughts that h and ow have still been in contact. At first it was just the newness of finding out about the a but 2 months ago it was like a wall went up with h. he stopped doing so many of the wonderful things that he had been doing -- there was so much else going on at the time that it's hard for me to sort out whether it was a recurrence of getting in touch with ow, or the big old R talk that we had had or my own paranoia and insecurity driving him back towards being distant or whatever.
Anyway, it's been a terrific struggle but I'm finally emerging a bit -- h seems to be emerging as well.
Anyway, I know you've been struggling with w's behavior as well of late...not sure I'm offering much in the way of help...more like "I can relate" and "here's hoping it settles out" and "try not to drive yourself crazy and regress to old behaviors because that in and of itself can drive them away, I think."
Quoting KAW: In fact the whole foundation I had built my trust on ... to regain myself from my insecurities so we can move on ... to believe as long as I remain true to myself and who I want to be, she would want to be with me as well is nothing more than crap!
well, I wouldn't call it "crap" -- I might suggest tweaking it to say that if you're true to yourself then you'll be OK no matter what happens. None of us can ensure that our mates stay with us...right? All we can do is do our very best, keep growing and learning in ourselves, treat both them and us with kindness, etc.
Sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
KAW - can't really add much more to the support than what you have read already. I would lean towards not tipping your hand at this point with regards to the cell phone calls. It seems that you've gotten a good handle on backsliding this one. Hopefully this will die of its own accord.
Think about Bridget's idea of a couple of days away just for you. Don't know about a 2000 mile roadie but I'm sure that there are places closer that you can get some down time. Maybe a friend or family member that you haven't seen for a long time?
