Hi oc and lwb, Yah.. I didn't expect the lovey dovey stuff to last very long.. The spell is broken. I've been at this long enough to know that it doesn't last and it doesn't mean anything. As expected, he freaked out and "ran away".
I am curious, though, if ow noticed how bummed out he was.. I'm sure she was overjoyed to have "her man" there.. Wonder if she knew he was longing for his wife.. That in itself gives me a bit of joy.. Aren't I horrible?!
Hopefully you'll read this. I didn't see you starting another thread yet, so I'll just post this here. I've been thinking a lot about you and do want to share my perspective in case I can say anything that might be helpful....
>>He really starts all of the D and R talks and I just participate. How do I put an end to it gracefully?<<
Well.... what I did was just smile, agreed with EVERYTHING no matter how stupid and ridiculous, or even wrong it was. For me the main thing was not to seem manipulative, and to acknowledge and validate his feelings and thoughts. My husband needed to figure things out on his own without my input. In other words I needed to support his decision for divorce, I needed to support his belief that he'd be happier without me (even if I didn't agree!). And even though I knew the whole thing was destroying my kids and that killed me, I even needed to make light of all that with him.... so HE'D have to deal with it all without me. Not that there wasn't other people telling them what to do, and encouraging his decision to divorce me. But the divorce being with "me" I felt it was better to remove myself from all that. Go along with the whole thing "because I did love and care about him and I wanted what would make him happiest." Always pointing that one out....
Now the way to I'd get out of divorce or relationship talk was change the subject, ask lots of questions about work, life, the kids, his family, etc....
One more thing.... when he talks about being in your life. Gag me!!!! Make sure you point out something like..... Yes, honey, you will be a huge part of our children's life and we will always have a connection. But quite honestly, we will be divorced and I will be moving on with my life. I'm sorry, but there will be other men in my life, and I'm sure they'll be more than happy to help me fix things and take care of things. I'm not saying that because I don't want you to help out. That's just the reality. Our lives will move on.... we'll all be really happy.... blah blah blah...
Be a great actress.
Ooooh gotta run.... will be back to share more thoughts!!!!
There is no arriving, ever. It is all a continual becoming.
Thanks ROOT.. I always appreciate your perspective. I have been doing very well for the past couple of weeks - agreeing with everything (with a few slips here and there). I am going along with it and agreeing that D is the only option for us at this point. I have said that it will be fine.. we will all survive and be happy in the future. He has been crying a lot more lately... can't get over these feelings for me which is making the D even harder.. DUH!
I have also recently told him that he can't be in my life; that it won't work with his new R. I believe after I said that was when he discussed it w/ow and she said she would be fine with him helping me out with stuff (NOT!). I didn't say anything about a new R for me but I'll do that next time it comes up.
Question of the day: If the WAS begins to feel guilt and self-loathing for what they are doing/have done, when do they start realizing that the op has done the same things and is, therefore, not the saint taht they are making them up to be???
Question of the day: If the WAS begins to feel guilt and self-loathing for what they are doing/have done, when do they start realizing that the op has done the same things and is, therefore, not the saint taht they are making them up to be???
My wife once told me the thing she admired the MOST about the OM's relationship with his wife was that they were completely honest and open with each other. I pointed out to her, after I discovered the affair, that the OM never told his wife, in fact, tried to hide from her, and tried to cover it up even from people who were throwing allegations at him. I said to my wife, "You really admired his 'honesty and openness', do you think he's still honest and open?
She said.....are you ready for this?....."It's not that he's not honest or open, or that he's lying, it's just that he fears change. He fears following his heart and being truly happy with me."
While it's still an affair, personal guilt or not, the OP will always be seen with rose-colored glasses.
People are complex. It's the day-to-day living with her that will make him realize: "Oh...my...goodness....OW has her faults, too. Wait a minute, this is a broken and blended family. I gave up Olive and offering my daughter an intact home for THIS? For THIS? I divorced my wife and broke up family FOR THIS? It's not much different than what I had before. Holy crap."
An affair is not reality.
Reality always bites you in the rear-end.
Living with you can be tough.
Living with OW can be tough.
Life is tough...the world doesn't owe us a living...life isn't fair...one day they realize this.
Perhaps, while he's living with her, before the divorce is final and before he says "I do" with her, he'll wake up.
I know there is nothing I can do at this point but be calm and distance myself. He will do what he will do...
From a sane person's perspective, wouldn't you be freaked out with how much you long for your wife when you are at ow's house?? Wouldn't you wonder why you are professing your love to your wife and still be certain that you must divorce her??? I know.. I'm trying to rantionalize insanity!
Wow!! Your thoughts hit so many of our situations right on the head. When you said living with OW will be tough is so right. My H told me the other day that the situation he was in (which meant OW)probably wasn't going to work that everyone has alot of problems. HE has been living with her. I have always said the real witch that OW is would come out eventually. So did he think I was the only one with problems. That nobody else has any. I think the OW are perfect in their eyes because they don't have all the history that we have with them. They also seem to remember more problems than the good things that happen.
Didn't mean to hijack but Theo once again you hit things right on the head.
Olive, I don't think they are sane. ITs like 2 people in one body. They have so rationality. Its like they don't want to turn loose of you and then they want this other seperate life too. You are right in staying calm and distancing yourself and harding up to all the roller coaster rides they out us on.
HUGS to you I keep saying our H must be twins.... This year is a new year for us to move ahead in our lives. We can control us not them. Let them take the fall....The church will see it one of these days.
From a sane person's perspective, wouldn't you be freaked out with how much you long for your wife when you are at ow's house?? Wouldn't you wonder why you are professing your love to your wife and still be certain that you must divorce her??? I know.. I'm trying to rantionalize insanity!
Well...it's honest confusion. He still loves you Olive. But somehow he wants to be with OW more. They grieve when they give up OW, why shouldn't he grieve when he's giving you up? He's feeling a loss. The time for cake-eating has stopped and it's going to hurt him more.
The fact that he's telling you how much he loves you, while he's at the OW's house and crying to you, is frnakly, in my opinion, pathetic and wussy. Real men don't do that. It's the sign of a weak, indecisive, man. He wants you to be the OW now.
You see he's still that little boy who can't decide if he wants to go to his friend's birthday party or the movies with his siblings. He cries and pouts, but little boys, mericfully, have parents who require decisions of them. You husband is still a little boy who hasn't quite learned that he can't have his cake and eat it, too. And his family and church -- the community who is supposed to hold him accountable -- is letting him have his crying fit and not requiring him to act responsibly. Your husband has passion and strong feelings, but they are so undisciplined, they've become ugly and deformed. And most of all -- hurtful.
The fact that he's telling you how much he loves you, while he's at the OW's house and crying to you, is frnakly, in my opinion, pathetic and wussy. Real men don't do that. It's the sign of a weak, indecisive, man. He wants you to be the OW now.
He actually didn't call me until he was backing out of her driveway. He was lonely for me while he was there and wishing he was at home. (????) I will say that he HAS been an emotional mess the past couple of weeks. And, I have been soooo much stronger...
Irregardless, I'm 100% certain that he is not as honest with ow as she thinks he is...
Expect your husband to go through a wide range of feelings. Expect him to want to "come back" to you one moment and then "go to her" the next. But, as you probably know by now, once the clock is ticking and you are in divorce all expectations you have about him must end. You need to emotionally detach and expect this divorce... and live that way. And live happy and healthy with that.
Now, that doesn't mean you can't lovingly detach and be a friend. (Of course, this doesn't include legal and financial matters with divorce.... I believe in going for the jugular with kids are involved, but you just don't have to tell your husband that. He shouldn't know all these details. And once he finds out and gets crazed just say you are going with your attorney's council, and you must do what's best for the children... then be cheerful and change the subject. Act stupid... LOL).
One thing you need to realize. If you think your husband is acting insane now, wait till he starts suspecting that you may have other men in your life!!!! I have a strong suspicion that he may hit rock bottom then. From everything you've described this is a guy really struggling with letting you go in spite of being completely addicted to OW.
What helped my husband hit rock bottom was my detachment and his suspicion that there might be another man in my life. I was very firm about not "seriously" dating until the divorce was final and I had plenty of time to get healthy and work through any baggage. I told him I wanted to make sure I was healthy and baggage-less and any potential boyfriends have worked through any past baggage as well. Also, I pointed out that I had no interest in going through the crazyness of a "rebound" relationship.... but... on the other hand. I'd also tell him about how surprised I was by how many men seem to "know" when a woman is in divorce. It's like they have radar and swarm. I would speak about this with a big smile and would offhandedly say things like, "I never realized there were so many great guys out there!" But I'd be careful not to make it sound like I was trying to make him jealous. I'd just say it like I was surprised. I also said things to him, really surprised, "Wow, I never realized how attractive I am?" (Hee hee!!!). But I truly was going out with girlfriends and talking with guys. I flirted, had fun with groups of women and men, even had a couple of "crushes" (nothing beyond friendly hugs and talk).
But these male friendships were great, because they helped me realize there would be life beyond my marriage. And they also helped me feel better about myself after having been displaced by a woman 10 years younger and much more professionally successful than me. And I felt great about myself, because I didn't get seriously involved with anyone. I was so proud of myself for wanting to be emotionally healthy, fully unattached and eventually, someday have a great relationship with the intention of marriage and "growing old together." I know that probably sounds idealistic and even old-fashioned. But thinking and living this way... while still having a lot of fun helped me enormously.
Anyhow.... one thing recommended by the DBing coach I spoke with was to be mysterious. I think this was wise advice.
I do have more to say... but gotta run!
There is no arriving, ever. It is all a continual becoming.
