Tell me exactly what I did wrong.

[Lillieperl]

I'm sure it was something...

Yesterday morning at my bf's mom's apartment, he started getting very snappy and tense with me (right after I wrote that lovely post ), telling me to back off, not say anything, don't ask him for anything, etc.

So I got myself out to my house... which was a chore. Later he came out and brought the doggies, who had been alone at his house. (Now we have THREE residences to navigate!) He stayed about an hour, made a fire, and left saying he would be back today with T-Day leftovers. I don't have much to eat in the house, having gone through my supply of canned soup and blue & white macaroni and cheese. He said he'd be out "after lunch," which I translated into "around 4:00 pm."

Sure enough, about 3:00 pm he called and said his mom was feeling fragile today and he might not make it out here. I didn't say "I've been waiting all day for turkey leftovers and don't have much to eat in my house," because he then commenced to complain about all the stuff he has to do. Go by his mom's house (her real house) and pick up some stuff, go to the grocery store, get back, make her dinner-- and by the way, "Are you [Lil] okay? Do you need anything?"

Well, yeah, I could use some stuff, but how do you say to someone who has just finished complaining about all the errands he has to run and all the tasks he has to do that, yeah, you'd like him to go to the grocery store for you and bring you stuff out here. (The round trip from his house to my house and back again is about an hour and a half.)

He asked me to give him a grocery list, on the one hand, and ALSO asked me if I had enough supplies in case he didn't make it out here today. If I gave him a grocery list, it would have some refrigerated and frozen items on it, and I don't want those to sit around until he is able to come here.

So I said, "If you do get around to coming out here today, call me right before, and I'll tell you the stuff to get me." It would all be from Whole Foods, which is very near his house and right on the way. (The retirement home is also near his house.)

I didn't say, "Oh, I'm perfectly fine. I have everything I need." I DID say, "I can manage okay," which is true. I have peanut butter and crackers and canned sardines and eggs-- I'm not going to starve or anything-- I just don't have stuff that I would like to eat... mostly T-Day leftovers.

Anyway, so I said (this turned out to be the wrong thing to say), "You have so much to do, I really don't want to add to your to-do list."

He said, "Don't get defensive about it."

Huh?

I said, "I don't want to make your list of things to do any longer than it is."

He got very irritated and said huffily, "Fine! I'll talk to you later!" and hung up.

Was I supposed to say, "Yes, please come out and bring me some leftovers?" and then hear the irritated sigh in his voice when I become one more demanding woman in his life?

If he were gracious about it ("It's no trouble. I don't mind. I hate to think of you sitting out there all alone eating peanut butter crackers. If I can make it, I certainly will," etc.), but he's so businesslike, no-nonsense, martyr-ish, and frankly, what I call rude.

I refuse to be another nuisance item on his list of nuisance items!

Being around him and his mom the day after Thanksgiving, I can see that just about every time she opens her mouth it's to ask him for something or to tell him to do something. It's in a very conversational tone... but it gets old after a while. A lot of people would probably just let her rattle on and ignore her with her constant list of requests and just wait til a few of them accumulated and do them together, but he does hop every time she says anything.

God, I hate being slapped with the demanding female label... I'm so low-maintenance, it's pathetic.

If anyone's around today, I'd appreciate an outsider's opinion of the above. Thanks.

[OG_Lou]

Lil, sorry the good of yesterday turned sour.

Did you say anything wrong? I doubt it.

From all of the stories about you and him, what happened sounds on the low edge respectable but with in his MO. Think a non-multitasker who has trouble estimating the time it takes to do things when thinking of your bf.

About the food, it sounds like a good time to order pizza and I think you said the pizza place is a long way from your house. If so call them anyway and tell them you miss the left-over's from TG dinner and want something to make up for the loss.

Lou

[Kettricken]

Sometimes there is no right way to say it. I don't see that you said anything wrong, unless you said it in a really "poor pitiful me" tone of voice, which doesn't sound like you ...

The only guilt trip involved is the one he's treating himself to. Sounds like he knows damned well he's treating you shabbily but at the same time feels totally overloaded with trying to respond flawlessly to his mom's needs/demands and is frustrated because he feels caught in the middle and overstretched. Even though you're NOT being demanding, you get the sharp end because you are one of the things he's feeling pressured about, so you're involved in his guilt/martyr complex whether you want to be there or not ... and he'd rather get snappy with you than his mom.

This sucks because it's reasonable to expect your SO to BE THERE for you when you're incapacitated, but you might want to remove yourself from this equation as much as possible for the time being .... do you have much of a support system where you live? Friends, neighbors, family, church community .... anyone who'd be more than happy to do a store run etc for you for awhile? Last resort, there's always the pizza delivery as per Lou; some places have grocery delivery too, although again I don't know your situation.

[Dom R]

Sure enough, about 3:00 pm he called and said his mom was feeling fragile today and he might not make it out here. I didn't say "I've been waiting all day for turkey leftovers and don't have much to eat in my house," because he then commenced to complain about all the stuff he has to do. Go by his mom's house (her real house) and pick up some stuff, go to the grocery store, get back, make her dinner-- and by the way, "Are you [Lil] okay? Do you need anything?"

Sometimes... people wreck their marriage by putting their spouse at the bottom of their priority list, below others.

Other times.. that spouse sabotages the marriage, by putting THEMSELVES at the bottom of thelist.

if you were married to this person, then I would think that the best response to "are you ok? do you need anything?" would be, "well, I was actually looking forward to, and kind of expecting, that you were coming over with leftovers today."

That would have been the nice, no blame, yet communicative way to handle it.

Instead, you chose the "no communication, yet still allocate blame to him" route.
But then again... you're not even married to this guy to start with, so, not sure why you're posting in "the sex-starved marriage" forum about this

....

God, I hate being slapped with the demanding female label... I'm so low-maintenance, it's pathetic.

If you dont "demand", yet harbor all the resentment and entitlement of a "demanding female" without even saying what you want... in some ways, it's WORSE. At least with a demanding female, the guy knows what he's expected to do.

[Lillieperl]

Thanks, Lou and Kett. I am trying to remove myself from the equation as much as possible-- I do think that's a good course for now. Of course, on Monday when I have my ankle surgery, I'm going to spend a couple of days at his mom's apartment so he can help me. And I have had other friends ask if they can go shopping for me. People have a mental block about coming to my house because it is so far from town. I do not want to add to the pressure he's under, partly for his sake and partly for my sake.

you're not even married to this guy to start with, so, not sure why you're posting in "the sex-starved marriage" forum about this

I have two responses to this:

1. Would you explain what my not being married has to do with anything?

and

2. Lil puts thumbs in her ears, wiggles fingers, blows raspberry

If you dont "demand", yet harbor all the resentment and entitlement of a "demanding female" without even saying what you want... in some ways, it's WORSE.

Dom, if you'll read my post carefully, you'll see that I'm not resentful about his not coming out here. I fully understand why he's not coming out here. He's worried to death about his 89-year old mom and her cancer. He's doing everything he can for her, to make her comfortable, to make sure she's eating. I absolutely understand that and I endorse it. It's a beautiful thing. He's in a difficult spot.

What I resent is that he is rude to me. As Kett said

Sounds like he knows damned well he's treating you shabbily but at the same time feels totally overloaded with trying to respond flawlessly to his mom's needs/demands and is frustrated because he feels caught in the middle and overstretched. Even though you're NOT being demanding, you get the sharp end because you are one of the things he's feeling pressured about, so you're involved in his guilt/martyr complex whether you want to be there or not ... and he'd rather get snappy with you than his mom.

I think this is absolutely correct. And I understand it.

I just don't like it when he's rude to me.

Did you read this part:

If he were gracious about it ("It's no trouble. I don't mind. I hate to think of you sitting out there all alone eating peanut butter crackers. If I can make it, I certainly will," etc.), but he's so businesslike, no-nonsense, martyr-ish, and frankly, what I call rude.

There's not much kindness in his approach. He feels like he's too stressed to be kind to me. He as much as said this the other day.

if you were married to this person, then I would think that the best response to "are you ok? do you need anything?" would be, "well, I was actually looking forward to, and kind of expecting, that you were coming over with leftovers today."

That would have been the nice, no blame, yet communicative way to handle it.

Instead, you chose the "no communication, yet still allocate blame to him" route.

This is a very good observation, and with a normal person who's not on a hair trigger, it would probably work... but he's hyper sensitive to anything with the slightest aroma of a demand.

So while saying, "I was looking forward to seeing you and to having leftovers," is exactly true, my past experience is that this would lead to explosive defensiveness on his part, a la, "I'm SORRY! I've got too much to do! I can't please everyone! yaddayaddayadda."

So I just held back. Like I said, it's not his not coming that bothered me, it was the rude way that when I did him the favor of NOT making a demand, he reacted by hanging up on me.

When I said I didn't want to add to his to-do list, I would have liked something like, "Oh, I appreciate that... I DO have a lot to do today. I'll be sure and come tomorrow with leftovers." Instead he hung up on me.

THIS is the situation: When I try to make things easy on him, he seems to resent it. When I express my demands, he resents it, too. He likes it best when I'm around, don't say anything, and appreciate whatever he does without expecting anything and without wanting any adjustment to what he chose to do. THAT keeps the peace.

[MJontheMend]

Maybe you should have said cheerfully something like "I WANT you to go to Whole Foods and get me the Triple Chocolate Mousse and the Mac n Cheese with the rabbit on the box, spiral not straight, and some organic Honey Crisp apples, be sure to check for bruises...but I don't EXPECT you to do anything so just relax and take care of your other priorities. I'll still be here whenever you show up unless some sex-craved broken ankle fetishist breaks into my house and steals me away to make use of in a manner I will leave to your imagination."

[Lillieperl]

Pretty good answer, Mojo.



ETA: Okay, I just phoned him. He was at the grocery store (the regular one, not Whole Foods) buying stuff for his mom. I said, "Okay, I've figured this out." He said, "What?" I said, "I want you to come out and bring me turkey and stuffing, but I don't expect you to, because I know you have a lot to do right now." There was a pause. He said, "Okay?" with a puzzled tone in his voice. I didn't say anything. Finally, he said, "I'm working on getting out there tomorrow." Then I asked him to buy me four cans of Campbell's Chunky Sirloin Burger soup. He looked for it, but there was only one can. It's very tasty-- the best of the Campbell's Chunky group.

I a normal relationship, my calling to "patch" things up and offer the olive branch would build good will. It would be like the silt that accumulates on the earth and the reason that the present city of Rome is 50 feet higher than the floor of the Roman Forum.

With him, good will does not seem to build up. It's sort of a zero-balance financing system. You continually start at zero and don't seem to accumulate any credit, good feelings, good will, benefit of the doubt, etc.

[Dom R]

So I just held back. Like I said, it's not his not coming that bothered me, it was the rude way that when I did him the favor of NOT making a demand, he reacted by hanging up on me.

he wasnt nice, by hanging up on you.
you werent nice, by not communicating with him.
he could obviously tell that you were extremely huffy with him somehow. but you refused to communicate.
In some ways, his hanging up, was a defensive move.(HE probably saw it that way, anyways)

PS: You "dont make a demand" on him all the time.
Right now.. you're "not making a demand" on him.
and now
and now
and...
get the point?

I think you should only expect gratitude from him, when you actually DO something, that he is actually AWARE of.

He had no idea what you wanted. he knew that you wanted "something", but you didnt ask for it.

That doesnt give you brownie points, for "not asking for anything".
It actually detracts from your "nice, easy to get along with girlfriend" bank, for not sharing what you'd like from him.

There's "demanding" and there's "asking for a favour".
I'm sure he doesnt like "demands".
I'm guessing he doesnt have much problem with favours.
Not sure why you would even want to be around someone, who had a problem with you even asking for a favor.

[Lillieperl]

BUT-- remember, his LL is Acts of Service. He WANTS to do things for me. He'd rather think of it himself instead of having me ask, but he will do favors...

I just don't like the rudeness.

He had no idea what you wanted.

His parting words last night were "I'll be back tomorrow with turkey."

[Dom R]

BUT-- remember, his LL is Acts of Service. He WANTS to do things for me. He'd rather think of it himself instead of having me ask, but he will do favors...

errr.. seems like you have the whole "love languages" thing backwards.

"his love language" is supposed to indicate what he would like YOU, to do for HIM. Not "what He would like to do for You".

sometimes, people "speak" to others, what they would like to receive.

but sometimes, they dont.