Here's some brutal advice from a guys perspective (returning the favor when you "said" things to me which I didn't necessarily want to hear....and for that I'm grateful).
Don't expect that he will know what you need him to say. He's hurting, he cares about you, he wants to hold things together, give him a break. If he didn't give 2 S#$Ts he wouldn't be hurting....he'd be rejoicing.
Quote: ...no where in there does it say he wants to be with me...no where in there does it say don't file for d...no where in there does it say..let's do something about us...nowhere in there does it say I don't want to lose you...
- Ask him if he wants to be with you!
- Ask him if he wants you to file!
- Ask him if he wants to do something about "us"!
- Ask him if he wants to lose you!
Quite simply, help him say what you need him to say. He's drowning and you're not throwing him a life line.
Sorry if this was harsh.....it is a riddle of words. Makes sense when you have two people like you and your H who obviously care deeply about each other, are confused, are struggling, but have the best intentions!
LL. I am so sad for your feelings right now..I am not going to get on a soap box..I have no right to, but please listen to what Jim just said...it sounds like your h is soooo confused and you said yourself he is sorry, he is hurting...if he really wanted you out of his life..then he should be happy that you are doing it for him. Maybe more time apart is what you both really need..I will say a prayer for you both.
Maybe you are listening for the words you want to hear and are missing what he is saying? He said he doesn't want to lose his family. That includes you. He doesn't want to lose you. Maybe he is so scared and hurt by your rejectiion that it is too risky for him to say that in a more straightforward manner.
Does he know what it will take, exactly, for you to put the breaks on things? read a book, go to C, stop all contact w/ other woman? What exactly would it take? Maybe he is at a loss...
I'm so sorry you are hurting so much. Maybe it is past the time of trying, only you know. But I thought his call expressed that he was distraught over losing you, even if he didn't use the words you want to hear.
Whatever happens, take care of yourself and give yourself time. You are right about all your positive qualities, except for maybe that you are too modest.
What I am afraid of finally came down to you. I am so sorry for your feelings. As anyone else, you can only hold on for so long without reciprocation from your loved one.
That aside, please think of Jim's advise again. Not out of vengence, but this is really what it takes before a guy (or a H, more precisely) would do things to your standard. Maybe it is the insensitivity of guys, no excuse for that, when he started to feel comfortable at home. That is just an unfurtunate traditional role that has made us. Without a better model and coaching, ordinary, hard-working guys like him and me would just take day in and day out as granted. That was one of the reasons my W left me.
So, if you truly wonder how your H felt and whether he loves you, ask yourself why he felt hurt so much. I don't think it was just because of a sense of loss, or at least potentially losing you. I think it does have tremendous amount of care underneath. It also takes a tremendous amount of effort, even more than what you have put in now, which has been extraordinary to any standard, to bring it out.
That said, your feelings and well beings are still in need of your own TLC. One can only love herself before she can love somebody else. Proceed with the appointment with the lawyer. Get your questions answered. Do something more to take care of your own emotions. I am sure the answers will come into places soon after...
well I don't know exactly how to say all that was said but I'll give it a shot..
h said a bit about how he feels we got to this point..does remember me being the most important thing in the world to him at one time..looking forward to seeing me etc..getting lost in his business and not having the desire anymore etc.. h is spinning (his word) h is hurting...knows he's hurt me and hates it...but has to live with it..knows he wasn't honest with me and hates it..is dissapointed in himself.. h is confused about what he wants to do...doesn't know if we can be happy together or not.. there was a lot more that I've lost... a lot of the things h said broght me back to a book I was reading last night (thank you dotto) and everything h was saying about how he felt was as if verbatum.. I had to keep myself from counceling h..(it is what I do..it's my nature to councel people whether they want it or not) when he finished though I was glad to hear him talk about how he was feeling it still didn't make me feel much better about the sit because again he doesn't know what he wants to do..
my turn to talk.. I validate his feelings..did mention the book I had read (and used all my power to not give it to him and say read this you'll see) and that he is not weird or abnormal or anything like that..that he is human an honestly not much different than me. then let h know that I deal with alot of the same thoughts and fears and what not...but to keep my head from spinning..I read..I talk..I search for understanding..
talked about love languages and how I know and am learning to accept h's but that I also have my own that needs meeting.
talked about r's in general and what can and does generally happen in them..
talked about how putting up protective walls and keeping little things from eachother leads to keeping more and more from eachother until you can be you anymore...and that we both but me especially have done alot over the years to cause the other to put up these walls.
so eventually...h is starting to fade....I of course feel bad about that and express it with understanding..but ask so then where are we. what do you want to do. h says well we could start by going to talk to your c... yes you read me correctly h is now willing to go to c. he will meet with him first alone (if that's ok with c) and go from there.
so that is today...h is falling asleep on the couch and now I am faced with do I wake him to come up to bed..or do I leave him there to do as he wants...think the latter is the best..if he wants to come up he'll ask.
I am a bit bummed that after all that talking we both just did...I didn't get a hug..but I understand h has yet learned to speak my language.
H willing to go to C? Wow! That is huge I'm sure you must be absolutely exhausted emotionally now at this point. But, how wonderful. No matter how things work out, at least you know H cares enough to share his feelings and try C.
Things do look better than they did this morning. I know you wanted more assurances, but he's been honest. And willing to go to C!!! This is a huge step, one you are way overdue for. Congratulations!
Jeez, LL, I'm gone for a few days and all hell breaks loose! I'm very sorry things have gotten to this point, but I'm glad that your "ultimatum" caused him to think twice about what he's doing...and that he's finally willing to go to C.
Frankly, I like what it says in "After the Affair" when couples are really trying to mend things...even when one or both might not really want to--it says to spend at least 15 hours a week alone with your S. Just spending time is what really helps. I've been trying to do this as best I can. It's kind of hard at first because you don't know what to say, but then it gets easier...especially when you're trying to meet each other's "love languages." But it takes effort, and each person has to be willing to make that effort.
IMHO, your H works too much, is away from home too much, and doesn't pay attention to the most important things in his life. If he chose to spend more time with you and the children, I think his feelings would change. I really do.
What a difference a day makes. I think the fact that H had the courage to admit he is spinning and confused is huge. No offense guys but that usually doesn't happen. You have waited for h to say what you need to hear. He hasn't so maybe Jim is right and you have to ask him. Don't lose your chance because you need to wait for him to do it on his own!
Go to C. That is wonderful. Teach h what you need. Teach him your love language. Ask him him get rid of OW as a customer if he wants to save R or you let it go if you want to save M. Tell him you'll wear your rings again when he asks you to. The choices right now are yours.
Quoting lostlove: yes you read me correctly h is now willing to go to c. he will meet with him first alone (if that's ok with c) and go from there.
Wow, I have to agree that was huge!
I would say don't change plan about the lawyer. Go see him and get your questions answered. Don't let yourself hang in there. But this is some good will from your H that he really cares; he just did not know how.
Quoting lostlove:I am a bit bummed that after all that talking we both just did...I didn't get a hug..but I understand h has yet learned to speak my language.
I would like to say that it takes a while. Mo boss and I exchanged some of his experience going to MC. It took him a while, but now he realizes that he needs to spend time to talk to his W each day, even though he has just turned on the TV watching the DVD he just rented. He said that was the best "gift" has to her. That was after going to C a year ago when he was "loves his W but not in love with her". People change; even your H could change. IT does take time and effort, from both of you...
LL, let me say I am very touched by what has been happening, and hope things work out in some way that both of you would be happy at the end...
