Almost a WAW

[sandi2]

Hi, thanks for responding. I was wonderfing if something had happen....nobdy was talking to me. Anyway, I think I heard about something similar to that several years ago. I will check it out.

Talk later.

[Aud31]

Hi Sandi,

I just read your post on another thread and wanted to respond to you here. You mentioned that when you were in your A, you worked really hard for OM's approval...weight, appearance, lotions/potions, etc.

Hon, if that made you feel good, how about doing those things for yourself? It seems to me that regardless of what side of the tracks you're coming from (WAS/LBS), the GAL stuff is pretty important. Do it for YOU, no one else.

I've only had time to skim your thread right now, and I realize everything seems stuck in the same old rut it's been in for a long time. That's beyond overwhelming. It's pretty important to figure out what your "cheeseless tunnels" are and start reacting/doing things completely differently than before.

One last thing. I know it's really hard for you to give 110% to your M when you really don't feel passion for your H. I think that it is possible to spark those feelings again, but it goes back to doing things differently. Both Michele and Dr. Laura (Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands) advise us to 'act as if' and the feelings will follow the actions. Are there things you've been holding back that you can 'act' on now? Are you willing to give it time and experiment with it?

I'm sorry you feel like you're not getting much response here...I think the piecing threads tend to move a lot slower than the newcomers threads. Sorry I didn't check on you sooner. I admire you for making the choice to work on your M. I really do.

[whapu]

Sandi,
I would like to echo Aud in the sense that you are in the slow churning current of the boards in "Piecing". I had read your thread and didnt respond because I really had very little of worth to give. Sometimes I forget that something is better than nothing just so someone understands that there is someone out there who does care....I do care and "I" do relate with much of you wrote.

You are right! I stopped excersing, dieting, the lotions & potions stopped....and you know the rest. Why is that? imLin said that it was b/c I did not feel that I had to "win" anyone......I had my H. I think a lot of that is true. But, I wish I was not that way. I wish I could feel toward my H the same as I felt toward the OM when I was trying to look so hot for him. BTW...I loved to hear OM tell me how "hot" I looked and I worked my ....you know what off.....to hear him say that. My H is good to compliment me...but for some reason, it just doesn't seem the same. God, that makes me sound awful!!!

That doesnt make you sound awful at all...it makes you sound truthful...a lot of this rings true with me. My W most likely shares these same feeling that you do. When she was having her "EA/PA-she will never uncover the truth" she was losing weight, looking "hot" and cared deeply about her appearance. Now she is blaming "M" on her weight gain because we all know that marriage makes a person fat

Well, I'm in "piecing" and I need a lot of encouragement from you all. Please don't shut me out since I'm from the other side of the fence. I have sent several posts out that never got any response and I don't know if I was too harsh sounding or if it is b/c I was almost a WAW and people resent me or just don't talk to me b/c it reminds them of their pain.

I sure hope no one is shutting you out and honestly I have roamed these boards for a while and have never seen such a thing. Especially me, for I had a "EA" myself when I doubted that my W was serious of trying again so I understand a lot of what you are saying. and as far as reminding anyone of the pain, that is why these boards exist...is too swim frelly through the pain without the harshness of the outside world..I think in your sitch your dynamic must be especially difficult when you are seen by the outside world (being a christian school teacher) as not having these feelings or shouldn't. Odd that society places people in boxes and tags them for a later date without at least looking whats inside.

Oh well, like I said.....punch me out if you feel like it. I just needed to talk tonight. If you do have any advice for me...I would appreciate it.

I am not one to throw 2 x 4's or punch anyone out...I am at a point in my morning where my coffee is not nearly as strong as it should be so most likely none of this makes any sense and certainly no words of advice are flowing....except one...
"be patient in all reagrds of your life and on the boards" Responses will happen and I for one will certainly throw something down here from time to time until I become a nuisance.
Aud is right(and usually is) GAL is the way to clarity!!! I just wish I would soak that message up as well. This is a perfect time for experimentation....YOU have nothing to lose
I am going to rummage up a stronger cup of coffee and maybe jot something down that is of more worth but anyway....WELCOME!!!! YOU are needed and cared about in this swirlling thread...peace

[runningoutoftime]

Sandi,

I really appreciate you being here. I think it's enlightening to learn things from the WAS perspective. I have a lot of respect for the WAS who decides they truly want to work on themselves and their marriage... especially in your case where it's a long-term marriage to a decent guy.

I have to agree with the other posts about looking great (and sexy!) even if your husband isn't giving compliments and expressing passion. Sometimes just feeling like you look sexy may help you feel sexier... kind of like the think it, and it becomes it. Spend some time thoughout the day imaging great sex with your husband then plan to go out to dinner with him that evening, have a little wine or a martini, wear a dress, maybe even thigh-high hose and garters... and no underware! Then, when you are at the resturaunt whisper to him that you aren't wearing any underware.... then talk about sex, ask him to describe, in detail, what he likes. Then share with him details of what you like.

This is your husband, and you ARE a good person... it's okay to be a sexually "wild" with your husband. It will bring you closer.

[sandi2]

Thanks to all of you for you responses. I was beginning to think nobody was going to talk to me anymore. But, you all came to me just in time.

I don't mean to blame anything I am about to say on "age", but it is just to illustate my frustation about trying to put "life" back into the MR and to feel like working toward being sexy, etc. Years ago, I could get all worked up and excited and determined about doing all these things you all have suggested....and it did work! After I got chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia it is so hard to have the energy to "make" myself do something that my heart isn't 100% into. It also frustrates me to know that I had that desire to work hard at looking sexy for the OM, but can't muster up the desire for my H. I want it to come naturally...the desire, that is....but it doesn't, so it means I have to "work" at it. (If all that makes sense!) Maybe that is why people say we get set in our ways....what they really mean is it is just hard as "hell" to do this stuff...lol. It is much easier to be lazy and let it "roll" out.

I have been trying not to gain the weight back and I have tried to discipline myself to continue the youthful skin routine each night...lol. You know, everything claims to give you that "younger appearance" now. As I have said before, I know from experience that our attitudes makes a difference due to what people would tell me about how I looked. So, our inner feelings shine through to the outside.

All the time I was growing up, my mother talked about how women would "let themselves go" after they got married. She never did! She is 82 and still looks like a model! But, I knew what she meant by how women work so hard to "win" their man, and once they get him....then they stop trying any longer. I never wanted to be that way, and hope I wasn't, but I think my unhappiness has probably had its affect.

I am hoping that in time my desire toward my H will increase and things will start to look a lot brighter than they do at this moment. We have overcome a lot. We talked a little last night and he is understanding and patient with me trying to "work through" my ordeal of getting over the OM, etc. Maybe that is not a good way of expressing what I'm trying to say, but hope you know what I mean. He said that he realized I was spending a lot of hours reading the posts on the board here and I have ordered a lot of books and read, so he knows I'm trying to make our marriage work. However, he also realizes that the "feelings" have not returned for me and that I am frustrated about that. I told him that if he did not agree for us to see a C, I did not know how long it may take.....or even if we could get everything resolved. At that point, we were interrupted and never got back to the conversation.

So, I need you all to talk to me......you ARE my C! I need encouragement b/c I am still very tempted to contact the OM.....especially at night when I am feeling so lonely. At first, I would cry when I went to bed b/c I needed to be held and loved....but I'm not doing that so much now. I know that some of you wonder why I can't just go into my H and tell him how I feel and ask him to hold me and to make love to me.....but right now, it would be like trying to do that with my brother...and I cannot force myself to do it. We've not had sex in so many years and it feels more like we are just relatives sharing the same house. I am afraid that I may never have that desire to return. It was exciting to realize I could feel normal sexual desire toward another man....but I knew it was wrong and I had to end it. Until then, I even wondered if I was just not normal. Then, I questioned my love for my H. But, I remember how I felt when I married him and I know that I did love him once. But, I think that my emotional needs were denied so many years and resentments pushed down for so long that maybe it killed a lot of those feelings.

I'm sorry, b/c I know that makes some LBS upset to hear statements like that from WAS. I have heard some angry replies to some statements from LBS to WAS.....so that is why I appreciate you all being so nice to me.

I realized when I replied to a couple of young men regarding their stitch.....how upset or resentful I still was and that I needed to be more careful in how I tried to give "advice". Compasion is something we all need here....regardless of which side of the fense we have come.

[GoodGuy]

Sandi2,
hi, I think your advice is very sound. You are still in a problem marriage yourself, but are willing to fix it, something the rest of us with WAW wish would happen.
I'm not sure if you read the last two posts I sent to you, if not, please do so, I would love some direct advice from "counselor Sandi" lol.
I'm really looking forward to a few tid bits of knowledge from you, someone who is in the middle of a sitch not unlike a lot of ours.

[sandi2]

Hi Goodguy,

I looked for the other post, but I must have missed it and then couldn't track it down. Sorry, I try to respond to everyone. I always appreciate anyone who is willing to talk with me.

Try again, and I'll be ont he lookout for ya.

[GoodGuy]

Sandi2, (here it is)
I have just finished reading your last 2 posts, and I am very thankful for your insight.
My W is also a WAW, the 2nd time in 5 years, the 1st time we were apart for 4 months. This time she moved out 2 months ago, but we lived in separate rooms for 5 months before that while we split all assets including the house.
I believe my W tried to tell me many times about what she didn't like in our M, I guess I swept things under the rug, and if she didn't mention it again I thought everything was alright again.
She seemed happy though, we entertained friends, went out for dinner once or twice a week, on vacations, not enough dates though (hard to find a sitter, no family here).
I needed to follow the "Velvet & Steel" plan you mentioned, but like most of us idiot husbands, I pleaded, cried, begged, tried to change her mind, and felt like a sad sack little boy.
Since she's moved out, I've been very good at just being her friend, giving her space and time (told her I loved her once when she asked me why I was looking at her that way) and she got mad at me, said it was not going to change how she feels.
I see her for a few moments a few times every week, I am cordial, smile, but I find it's hard to be a friend, friends hang out and talk, we don't!
I find mutual friends of ours have taken sides too, even my neighbors that we are good friends with have started hanging out only with her, yet at first, they couldn't understand what she was doing and giving up. I have heard that this is typical of friends, one side or the other.
You seem like a woman who has given a lot of yourself to salvage an unhappy R. May I ask if you tried counseling? Or a "couples weekend" that they have around the country? Your M must be a very important vow to you, for all that you have done to try to salvage it. I believe that the people here have a little bit of that passion in them, that's why they read and write and try to find answers. I don't know you, but I am impressed by you.
I went to counseling with my W 4 times before she moved out, it didn't help because she wasn't interested.
When we broke up 5 years ago, she brought home brochures on "Couples weekends", I looked at them and threw them away thinking our problems were solved, I am a jerk!
But I'm a nice jerk, I love my wife and family very much, I am a an affectionate, (not just for sex) hard working, caring idiot who didn't notice my wife trying to smarten me up, and now I am paying the price.
I keep busy with the gym and sports and friends, but I live in a quiet house during the one week my S is with my W, then he comes here for a week and fills the void.
I'm not sure if my W will ever come home, it's a question we all ask ourselves. But I really appreciate your insight and honesty.
If you have any other advice, I will listen with both eyes open.
PS: I was on the phone with my W for about 20 minutes last night, mainly talking about our son. He is fighting my W every step of the way, he doesn't like that we are not together, and he told her he will never be happy again, it broke my heart. My W asked me if I had a girlfriend yet, I told her no (she said why not, you have needs, your only human). I asked her if she had a boyfriend yet, she said no, I asked her why not, your only human, she said I don't need that, you lnow me. Thats us up to date, thanks.

[thegoodfight]

Sandi2,

In regards, to contacting OM, this is the temptation that the devil and his followers are sending your way. He is wanting you to believe the lack of intimacy is because you don't "love" your husband. Sandi2, God teaches us that we are to love ourselves and love others regardless of their actions.

A wall has been put between you and your husband, that wall has been carefully crafted over years so it seems you can not break through it. Again this is the evil ones plan, and he is executing it perfectly. I do not profess anything except you are somewhat familar with my sitch. I am very affectionate by nature and my W. can still offer little to me because of her feelings and how badly I have hurt her. Almost every night a little voice goes off in my head. I don't hear anything but I think it, it just pops in there. My thoughts are this "you deserve better, you will never be happy here again, she will never forgive you, you know what kind of person she is, everything is black and white, give up go out and find someone who appreciates you."

This is a load of crap and a direct result of not focusing on what is truely important. Had I gone to my wife 4 years ago and said, honey we are having issues can we do some things together, I want to listen. I would not been in the position I am in today. Continue to ask for forgiveness, repent when you falter, you may again, we all do at times. But most of all find a way to talk to your husband and try it. Maybe you don't feel it because you have forgotten how it feels.

Just like sometimes we forget about what is right and what is wrong. Ask for help, it will be given and watch for the traps that are always there. His greatest gift to us besides the opportunity to live in paradise (his love eternal) is our free will, but that is what the other preys on.

Choose to love, do things for yourself with the purpose of ultimately doing them for each other. You can learn to love again, it is not that your passion for him is dead, it is you have forgotten and H. probably has as well what it was you had when you guys were more intimate. Find your trigger, conversation or whatever stimulates you, explore things together, you can do it but it is so much easier when you have your husband there to help. Do not fear minor setbacks, just like in the spiritual batttle, the devil wins many battles but he will not win the war. Same goes for our lives, do the right thing, you can find happiness, you wouldn't be together for 20 years if you did not know how.

[sandi2]

Hi baybybliss, goodguy,thegoodfight and others,

Thanks for your kind words of encouragement. I ordered more books (lol) and I also got those tapes "Light His Fire", so I hope it will encourage me a lot. I used to love that kind of stuff and would do everything the books said to do! Hopefully, some of that determination will return and I can do the act "as if" thing.

When I am able to get through a day at work and come home....I am ready to collaspe. It is really hard to even fix anything to eat. In fact, I haven't been cooking.....we have either ordered out or just snacked around. He is so great about understanding and not being ugly about it like some men would and demand their cooked supper. I don't mean to blame everything on my physical condition b/c I believe our mental attitude plays a tremendous part of the physical feelings, but it is so very hard to overcome when you just don't have the energy to do anything..However, there again, when I was involved with the OM, it was like this energy came from somewhere I couldn't understand......I just wish it would do that with my H and it really bugs me that it doesn't do that. I am like those commercials on the TV where it is talking about depression and the person just sits or lays around not wanting to talk or work, etc. I have to push, push, push......for every single thing I do, and I just get so tired of it....it is hard to enjoy life when it is that way every day. I sound so whinney and I don't mean to do that....I don't know how to try to get you to understand my "feelings". I want you to know that it is more than just refusing to do it.....I have got to have a little "want to" to have the energy to do it. You know....the mind over matter thing.

At this point.....when it is me reading some whinney female's story after I have tried to give her advice and she is coming back with her "excuses"....I am ready to move on and forget about her. I suppose some will be that way toward me b/c that is how I sound! God help me! But, it is a double whammy when you are in a lot of physical pain on top of the R problem to deal with every day. I am blessed that my H does not demand things from me as I have heard a lot of men do their wives. He has been good to help around the house b/c I just can't do much. Today, I had to stay home from work due to the pain I was in. I know he must get so tired of having to live with somebody like me that is never any fun to be with anymore.

I used to be fun. I would be the one to think of things to do while we sent the kids to spend the night with the grandparents. We didn't have the money to spend on entertainment, so I had to think up our own....lol. But, it was fun and I know my H would love for me to be that way again. I get down b/c I am afaid from what I have read that i won't ever feel that good again. Today was one of those days that I had to fight the depression hard. Guess you all can tell that....huh?
I need to feel my H's strength and support, but I'm not ready for the sexual touching, etc. I guess I do need C about that. Some days I could cry my eyes out....if it would do any good. I want to love him and desire his touch.....but it just doesn't seem to come. I want to act "as if"....but you see, if I do that then I know him and I know he will think it is a signal for him that everything is fine and I'm ready to have sex again....and I know what will happen. It has happen before. When he starts to touch me....I will freeze up. I won't be able to respond. He will feel the rejection and turn from me and I will feel the guilt and the wall will go up higher.

So, I don't know what to do......I sincerely don't know. I can't afford steady C at this point due to all the other medical bills. I have thought if I could just "force" myself to have sex one time that maybe that would help me to tear the wall down and I would be okay. But, I tried for years and years to tell him not to go so long between times (not having sex)b/c I knew if affected me that way, but he wouldn't listen to me. When I finally got to the place I was ready to be the wife I thought he had always dreamed of, and we were having sex and I thought was doing pretty good......he stopped cold turkey without one word of explantion....and still won't give any. So, we went eleven years without sex and I don't know why. He always blamed me for the lack of sex, but he was the one that quit.....not me. Now, I know him well enough to know he is (as usual) waiting on me....and I can't do it. It breaks my heart. But for you, my sweet friends, that advise me to just "do it"......could you just "do it" with your brother or your sister? That is what I feel like.

I'm sorry for sounding so.......yucky tonight. Lord, I hate the way I sound. It is just the same old....same old... with me all the time. Maybe I shouldn't have tried to write anything tonight since it hasn't been a good day, but I wanted you to know that I was so glad to get your responses......and Lord knows, I need them.