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Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Not sure if you've gotten to this part in the book yet, but he goes over how you need to focus on making deposits in her account and not worry about getting yours filled for now. Marriages get in trouble when both parties feel they have empty accounts and they're both sitting back waiting for the other to come fill their account. This is really the thrust of DBing as well- YOU need to do the work, not wait for her to. "It Takes One to Tango" as Michele says. And you are doing the work so that's great. Keep it up. Just don't have any expectations that she will come around immediately, it takes time. 5LL also makes the point that if you start making deposits in her emotional account then at some point she'll WANT to make deposits in yours. Not because she feels like she has to, but because she actually wants to. And that's when things will turn around for real.


I haven't gotten to that part yet, but it definitely makes sense, thanks for pointing it out. I definitely plan to take the lead on this and do all the work needed - hopefully it will motivate her to partake at some point as you suggested, but when she really wants to. At the moment her behavior towards me is pretty variable... Sometimes she behaves "normally" - making jokes, talking with me etc. Sometimes she seems to be avoiding me. Overall, I can feel that she is a bit distant. Which is normal at this point I guess...

Originally Posted by AnotherStander

I would not share it with her. If you do, and then if you try and implement some of the things you read, she might see it as you trying to use "tricks" to get her back. Just keep it to yourself, at least for a while.


Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Keep all your personal growth sources confidential for now. This is about your growth. Change you.


Roger that! Makes perfect sense, I appreciate your guidance here.

Originally Posted by AnotherStander
OK well first of all it sounds like you kept the date light and problem-free which is perfect. But don't forget to listen and validate! When you say "I agree, these are tough times.... etc." it sounds kind of like you're trying to put your own spin on what she said, right? Instead, try asking her how it makes her feel. Sad? Anxious? Worried? Whatever she says she feels, listen intently, and make validating statements about her feelings. THIS is what will make her feel like you're really listening to her and trying to understand where she is coming from.


You are right... I guess it will take me some time to master the validation skill. But I do get the point, just need to practice.

Originally Posted by AnotherStander
Let her worry about that. If she initiates then she either wants to have sex, or she wants to fill your needs, or both. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with either. Don't surround it with unneeded drama! Just partake and enjoy it!


You are absolutely right. She is a grown up, mature person as well - and if she decides to do that, she has some reason for it. So I won't be backing up. I won't be initiating anything though.

Originally Posted by Ready2Change

Enjoy it. I would start doing some research now in this area as well. After the encounter, you want her to be pleasantly surprised by your new improved behavior. Personally I have more fun getting my lady "in the mode" than reaching the "finish line".


That sounds great. smile Do you have any literature or material you could recommend for me to research? Something that helped you most? Thanks!


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https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2061094#Post2061094
The one labeled Counter-intuitive ways to attract as well as all the ones labeled MEN.

I purchase the top two on the list and frequently pass them out to people. Every time I read the second one, I get something new from it. I bet I have read it 20+ times.

I was visiting the bookstore every week. I would browse the self help section and a book or two would stand out as interesting. Youtube is a great resource as well.

I questions everything I believed. Some of my beliefs became stronger, some were reversed.


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Originally Posted by Ready2Change

I purchase the top two on the list and frequently pass them out to people. Every time I read the second one, I get something new from it. I bet I have read it 20+ times.


Awesome, thanks, starting with that one then!

A few updates from my side…

I finished 5LL - boy, what an awesome resource! I figured out a few very valuable things:
1. My primary LL seems to definitely be PT. At first I thought it was QT, but after reading on how to differentiate, I realized that even though I highly value our QT together, the lack of it does not make me feel miserable as much as having no PT. And by PT I don’t refer to sex primarily - I just realized that physical contact in general (hugs, touches, kisses, holding hands etc) really fills up my LT… Which is probably one of the reasons why I figured out something was wrong just now and not before - because PT reduced dramatically recently.
2. However, I do still have trouble in figuring out my W’s primary LL… (which is probably one of the reasons how we got here). I definitely ruled out PT and RG - I was always the one who was more into PT and we even have internal jokes on this… She likes to give gifts to others, but she’s never been a great receiver throughout our R, and I still get stuff for her often. I would rule out AoS as well, because I usually do a lot of stuff - I maintain our cars, vacuum, clean the house, cook etc. She does mind when I get “lazy” occasionally, but I haven’t noticed a big difference between my “lazy” and “hard working” periods when it comes to her behavior. So this leaves me with WoA and QT… I’ve usually been praising her a lot, and even in the past few months, so I would be surprised if that is the one. QT is the one that we’ve been lacking most in the past couple of years. And this weekend we spent a lot of time together, and I felt her “softening up” after all that time. We even had sex (at her initiative again), which was actually pretty good this time for both, or that is what it seemed to be. It was very hard for me not to think afterwards if it was a torture for her and she was only acting, but I kept my mouth shut and did not want to initiate any talks around that. So my plan is to work on QT, and spend a lot more of it with her in the upcoming period to verify if I got it right.
3. But I do have a question here - Dr. Chapman in most of his examples asks the couples to communicate to each other and “reveal” their primary LL. He asks them to “describe to each other what the ideal spouse would need to do to make them feel loved and have their emotional tank full”. Is this something I should consider asking my W, or you think it would drastically minimize the effect of anything I do to improve?

Other topic that started pressuring me very hard these days is the effect that “No More Mr. Nice Guy” has on me. I started reading the book, and - that is definitely me, a “Nice Guy”. The more progress I make, the more miserable I feel. It really sums up what I am, have been, and made me realize my personality better. Which also made me understand why she probably started feeling the way she feels towards me… Now I see that I’ve been struggling with my “Nice Guy” syndrome in the past (wasn’t aware of it back then), and that it probably took me to IC in the first place. And it could potentially be the core trigger that made her feel less and less sexually attracted to me. But going through all of this at this point, makes it emotionally very hard for me to even read the book, not to speak of actually starting the process of becoming the “SoB” instead of a “Nice Guy”. I feel like I need to take one step at a time, and focus on getting her emotional tank to a decent level, start the therapy together, and then work on breaking the “Nice Guy” apart… I don’t feel like I have the strength for that until we make some progress in improving how she feels for me. And it sounds to me that for that process I would need a “safe person” to help me, which is pretty hard now with Covid and us avoiding meeting other people as much as possible. Or you thinking this is actually the first thing I would need to tackle considering it might be the reason for getting me where I am?

And finally, there is one more thing I would appreciate to get your thoughts on. Even before we had THE talk and I realized what is happening - for the past few months I noticed that she was struggling with starting her day. She would stay in bed for longer than usual, she would have days when she is really distraught, and that is still happening. It looks to me like slight signs of depression. Normally, I would ask her what’s going on and see if I can somehow help (“Nice Guy” again…), but now I am not sure if I should do that… I don’t want to make her feel even more miserable, especially since our “situation” might be the sole reason for that. But the behavior did start significantly before we had our talk - so either I picked up the right timing to start asking questions, or she has some other issues that I am not aware of… I do have the urge to ask questions, but I also feel like that might be the completely wrong thing to do at this stage…

And that’s it, my days are pretty much roller-coasters and mood-swings, but trying to keep this to myself and not let it show on the outside. She really praised me for my behavior for the past week and the weekend, and said she had a very good time with me and our D.

Oh yes - I got back to reading SSM in parallel with Nice Guy, plan to switch my focus to that one now.


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A couple of things. First, most people tend to outwardly show their LL to others. For instance, if your LL is PT, then you will tend to show love to others through PT! Hugs, shoulder rubs, etc. So if she is someone that is a gift-giver likely that is one of her LL. Now, that doesn't mean running out and showering her with gifts. Right now you are in awareness mode. Since your sitch is so different than the others here, where a spouse has already said they want a D. You caught it and came here before that point! That's a good thing!

Now, since your situation is so different, QT is not a bad approach. You have to walk a fine line though here. Suddenly smothering her with QT efforts and requests may make her recoil. So just like with the touch charges I suggested, be subtle here. QT could be sitting on the couch having a conversation. It could be taking her on a very formal date to a very nice restaurant where you both get dressed up. It could be lots of things between those extremes! Things like he saying, I am running up to the store to pick up some things, do you need anything? "You know what, why don't I go with you so I can shop for what I need too?" Then you get some QT in the car on the way there and back! Subtle, but still there.

As far as discussing your LL with her, I would wait on that. Once you get into MC, most MC will start with LLs. And have you both take the assessment and then share that with each other. So just do what works for now (clearly QT seemed to), and keep that up! Just try to avoid being overtly needy and clingy. Again, it is a fine line!

As far as NGS. You are the first I've heard come back and say that you are actually are having emotional issues thinking about changing it. You mention you think this led you to IC in the past, I think this would be a good next step now. But I do encourage you to finish reading the book. If you are having the attitude of the opposite of NGS being a "SoB" then you are not really understanding the issue. NGS is actually being a "SoB" deep down. Since everything you do has a hidden agenda, expects something in return, and really there is nothing "nice" about NGS! Finish the book and you will see, I think a lot of your emotional reaction you are having will be alleviated when you really start to grasp the concept. NGS is an awful way to live for yourself, but also the others around you!

As far as her "depression", I would let that lie for now. I quoted depression because neither of us is certified to diagnose her. Maybe she has sleep apnea so she wakes up in the morning as tired, if not more, than when she went to bed. And the lack of good sleep could be causing her to be distraught. Or it could hormonal (I don't recall your ages, you might want to do a signature like many of us have, it is very helpful when responding). Bottom line, she has to want to get help for it, and likely right now you mentioning it will just be another source of irritation, that you are trying to "fix" her. There may come a time when you need to have a conversation with her about it, but personally I think you let it lie for now.

"And that’s it, my days are pretty much roller-coasters and mood-swings, but trying to keep this to myself and not let it show on the outside. She really praised me for my behavior for the past week and the weekend, and said she had a very good time with me and our D."

Great. keep up the good work! If you are already in IC, great! Start talking to your IC about NGS. If you aren't in IC, get back in it! Focus on you, overcoming your NGS, but continue to subtly try to fill her LT and reestablish a connection. Look, just your efforts so far resulted in her initiating sex! That shows that being attentive (but not overbearing) can pay dividends.


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Hi all, posting again after a while - did not have any big things to share in the last month or so, and was mainly reading the forums and the recommended books. I apologize for a bit lengthier message.

First of all, thanks for the comments Steve85 - exactly as you said, subtle doses of QT have brought us some very good days. I read through the whole book of NMMNG, and got to a point where I want to read it again, start making notes and taking action. I also realized throughout the book that I have previously tackled some of the traits of the NGS by myself not even knowing about it. But there is still a lot of work to be done. I am taking baby steps now. One of the things I realized was making me miserable was masturbation as a compensation for sex. So I now stopped watching porn and took a break from self-pleasure for some time. Already feel a lot better. And the sex I had with my W in the meantime also felt better. When I feel ready, I want to try out the “healthy” masturbation that Dr.Glover writes about in the book.

I’ve used the time to focus on DB’n, and on that front I really feel a lot better. I’ve shaped up, working out regularly, reached a great physical form and plan to continue strong. When I’m working out I feel stronger and wiser, and have a feeling that whatever happens will be acceptable and that I’ll be able to cope with it. I know that this is not a completely realistic scenario, but since it has a positive effect on me, I plan to keep this routine and make 2021 the year of my best health and shape. I also started excelling at work, wrapped up a few big projects and landed a nice bonus for the end of the year.

I’ve read 5LL, No more Mr. Nice Guy, SSM, She Comes First, Love and Respect: The Love She Most Desires, Love Must Be Tough, pulled out the strategies that sounded like they can be applicable to my sitch, and am continuously working on self-improvement. I’ve completely eliminated the small things my W complained about, and am working on 180’n the situations that sounded upsetting for her. And it seemed like we are making progress on one hand, as we started spending more time together, she initiated sex several times and it wasn’t bad, but we completely stopped any R talk, as that was the agreement, before we start with the therapy. So in general - things mostly looked ‘normal’, however they looked like that for years before our ‘talk’ and she was still suffering without me knowing. So, I’m not raising my hopes up, but I feel we have a lot more good days and moments than we did initially in the first few weeks after she opened up to me. But it is pretty clear that every R talk will reignite the “bad” mood and will bring a few days of depressive atmosphere to our home.

And the therapy finally started. We had just one session so far - the therapist seems good, I had the positive “vibe” about it throughout the session, even in the tough moments. And there were a few, which I’ll mention below. It was just a first get-to-know-each-other session, she did her “screening” and suggested that we’ll probably need to meet a few more times until we actually start with the practical work and make a plan. Which sounded fair and reasonable to me. She suggested that we don’t talk too much about things that we find hard to talk about at the moment while we are at home (our R, and the attraction issue), until we get to a bit more stable emotional situation. Here are a few notes from the session that I mentioned before, that were a bit tough, and that I would appreciate some thoughts on from you guys:
First of all - I now realized that I had a misunderstanding of the duration of this issue. It turns out that this feeling of less and less attraction for my W started after the first 2-3 years of our R, meaning that it has lasted for more than 6-7 years now. As she says - in the beginning it was nothing too alarming, and it had ups and downs, but in the past few years it started getting harder and harder for her. It climaxed recently, and that is probably why I noticed. For me personally, it is not a great sign - because that means she’s been suffering for a lot longer than I thought, and also some of our core R values might not be completely true any more. On the other hand - despite all those feelings, she still decided to pursue R with me, and even marry me and have a child with me. And there was never really any reluctance for any of these two events from her - she even pushed for marriage harder than I did. As she says - she loved me all the time and still does, and still thinks I am the right H for her. Do you think that the duration of the issue makes the sitch significantly harder to overcome? I am also doing my best not to question all of the great (or maybe it was great just for me?) moments that we went through - but sometimes I really feel betrayed, and manipulated. I know this is wrong, but at some moments of weakness, I just can’t help it. What do you suggest as a coping mechanism for this? And should I bring this up in the therapy and ask for assistance as well? Or I should completely avoid that in the mutual sessions and keep this just for IC?
Second - she mentioned something that was not really surprising, especially now considering the length of the “issue”, but I can tell you that it did strike me in the heart. She said that before that moment (which she never clarified when exactly it was, or was it in any way tied to a specific event), she was so madly in love with me that she never even looked at anyone else. And when those issues started for her - she then occasionally caught herself looking at other men and thinking that maybe “the grass could be greener on the other side”. But that then, whenever she would compare any of the men she would find interesting with me - they would fall short and that she never met a man she would even remotely consider being as good for her as I was. I kept my calm, stated that I’m not surprised, and that I would suspect that there was someone else, which she immediately denied, saying that I did not get it right. There was nobody else, but that just the idea of thinking about other men made her feel bad and realize not everything is great between us. And honestly - I would leave it at that until the next session or so, but after the session, she lured me to the discussion by insisting that my head is now probably full of new information and that I’ll be creating crazy scenarios. Unfortunately I fell for it, succumbed and asked here if there is another person in the mix, or anyone that I should be aware of, considering the effort and dedication this will require. I believe that I should at least know what I am standing against. And not just me - the therapist as well. She wasn’t able to give me a simple yes/no answer… We were going back and forth about it, she was refusing to talk about it and just repeated “there was nothing concrete and there is no concrete person, there are some things that might not even be relevant, but I cannot talk about that with you now”. She suggested that she might need to talk with the therapist in an individual session. Somewhere in the discussion she raised the topic of monogamy, and whether that is completely normal - and why I would for example be against a partner getting sexually satisfied on the side to keep the peace at home. I almost lost it at that point, but decided to back up and set my boundary - I told her that this is not something I would consider, because I don’t believe in such a marriage, and that is nothing I signed up for. She did not say she wanted that or anything like it, and also decided not to further discuss as she started losing it a bit, but it left one more mark on me. The scenario I believe is likely - She doesn’t have any active affair at this time, I am almost sure about that as we’ve been isolated for months, all of our devices are accessible to both of us and she literally has no way of hiding anything that significant. The worst thing is - it was highly unlikely for anything serious to happen in the past 4-5 years as our daily routines were so stacked up, that there would be literally no space for the OM to fit in. For the period before that - I really cannot say now. She was always very judgemental about infidelity, and always treated that as one of the biggest sins you can do in your life. After all these discussions and new information, it seems to me that something happened with someone at some point. No idea how far that went, who that was and when it happened, but I don’t think it was recent. But it obviously left a significant scar, as she cannot speak about it but feels it could be relevant. On the other hand - maybe I’m completely wrong, and there is still someone in some way. What I would appreciate your thought on is - should I try to push and get more information on this in the therapy sessions where she might feel a bit more confident to share? I find it a bit challenging to completely dedicate my heart and soul to the therapy if I cannot trust my W, and when I can clearly see she is hiding something. I have already experienced a lot of pain from her side in the past months, I think now is the time to endure even more if needed - better than us waiting to make some progress and then having more things pop out as a surprise. Is it too much to ask to have all cards on the table now when we both agreed we want to fight to save our marriage?

And to add one more thing I noticed - she flinches about even the mention of the Big D word. I mentioned it once or twice and she immediately reacted, saying that is not an option, and that keeping our marriage needs to be the number one priority for us now. And I agree - but I am a bit confused about the contradictions in her approach. She wants to prioritize our marriage, while at the same time keeping secrets openly.

When things eased up a bit at home, we had a pretty useful discussion on what we both expect from the therapy and somewhat talked about what sex means for both of us. We realized that there is so much more to it than what we were doing, that we know so much about each other in every other aspect of life but so little about our sexual preferences, that it almost felt funny how we managed to not notice that during all these years. We agreed not to push anything in that field further until we get to a point where we are both ready to experiment, but also agreed that we both believe our sex can be not just as good as it used to be - it can also be better.

So that is pretty much it for now - I am still riding an emotional roller-coaster. I have awesome days, I have bad days. I try to focus on DB’n, work, exercise and time with the family. I still have high hopes that this can improve, but I also feel that every day I am a bit more ready for the worst case scenario as well.


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Benji, WB. Sounds like things are going fairly well. As I said before, your sitch is a bit different than most here since your W isn't wanting a D, and is willing to work on things, even if showing a bit of a wayward side.

As far as how you are feeling, best to explore that in IC first before bringing it up in MC. MC should be about reconnecting, and working on the MR. The insecurities you feel inside are better to be dealt with in your IC because likely that is what they are, and there is nothing actionable your W can do to help.

Yes, most LBSs are shocked to find out how long their WAS has been struggling with the issues. Most think their sitches start on BD, when in fact they actually started years before. This is why there are no quick fixes. You cannot use words to fix what you acted your way into. You cannot fix overnight what took years to get into. What I will also tell you is that an OM is not your issue, it is hers. A lot of LBSs want full disclosure as part of their recovery. I see no value in full disclosure. None. It doesn't sound like she has had a lot of opportunity to cheat, however a friend that was cheating on her husband once told me that where there is a will there is a way. That a spouse that wants to cheat will move mountains to make it possible. Even taking off of work to be with their AP. But the thing is that you cannot obsess about it. The truth has a way of coming out. I would focus on you and on working on the MR, and forget about mights and maybes at this point.

As far as her being opposed to affairs, my W was like that too. I can remember our early years of marriage her begging me to never cheat on her. Of course I am morally opposed to it and she knew that, but then her attitude changed during her WW. "I can understand why you would cheat if you ever did." she once said to me. HuH? This is what sandi likes to say "this is not the girl you married!" It is hard truth for LBSs to understand. Especially LBHs! We have this image of our Ws never changing. The truth is that we all do.

So for now focus on the positives. Your W may be struggling a bit with waywardness (ie the discussion about wanting a spouse to be sexually fulfilled even if that means with someone else!). But she isn't wanting a D, she is willing to work on the MR, and that is all something a lot of other LBSs on this forum would die to have!

Keep up the good work, work through your insecurities in IC, keep working on the MR, and do what works!


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Thanks for the honest feedback Steve, I appreciate it.

You are right about moving my personal insecurities out of the MC. It is just that my IC is now “on a break” due to Covid, so I was thinking of using the opportunity. But it probably does not make sense to waste our valuable time in MC on this.

When it comes to your statement that OM is not my issue and that it is hers - I do agree. And if this is something that she doesn’t want to share with me, that’s fine, I can live with that as long as this does not become an ongoing thing while we’re in MC, which is really highly unlikely to happen anyway. But do you think I should not even raise this as a topic in our MC, to at least let the therapist be aware of a potential third-person who could be undermining our work? Or some skeletons in the closet that could be leading my W to a constant doubt? When my W told me that she does not want to talk about that with me, she did express the feeling of the importance, and that she might want to share it with our therapist at least, in an individual session. So I was just thinking of supporting and raising that in the MC. Does that sound reasonable?

And do you think that the part regarding the idea of “sexual fulfillment with someone else” also comes under my own insecurities - or you think it is ok for me to bring this up in our MC and just make both my W and therapist aware that I would not want to consider this as a “solution” at any point and set my boundary there? If that is something my W is hoping for, I really want to be clear what my stance is.


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Originally Posted by Benji
Thanks for the honest feedback Steve, I appreciate it.

You are right about moving my personal insecurities out of the MC. It is just that my IC is now “on a break” due to Covid, so I was thinking of using the opportunity. But it probably does not make sense to waste our valuable time in MC on this.

When it comes to your statement that OM is not my issue and that it is hers - I do agree. And if this is something that she doesn’t want to share with me, that’s fine, I can live with that as long as this does not become an ongoing thing while we’re in MC, which is really highly unlikely to happen anyway. But do you think I should not even raise this as a topic in our MC, to at least let the therapist be aware of a potential third-person who could be undermining our work? Or some skeletons in the closet that could be leading my W to a constant doubt? When my W told me that she does not want to talk about that with me, she did express the feeling of the importance, and that she might want to share it with our therapist at least, in an individual session. So I was just thinking of supporting and raising that in the MC. Does that sound reasonable?

And do you think that the part regarding the idea of “sexual fulfillment with someone else” also comes under my own insecurities - or you think it is ok for me to bring this up in our MC and just make both my W and therapist aware that I would not want to consider this as a “solution” at any point and set my boundary there? If that is something my W is hoping for, I really want to be clear what my stance is.


First Benji, I am going to ask you to step away from your sitch a bit. Your mind seems to be racing with what she has said, and trying to decide how to handle MC. The worst thing you can do is dwell on your situation 24/7, obsess about it, and not make sure you are doing healthy activities: GAL, 180s for yourself and being the best you can be, and detachment (self-differentiation). One of my mantras on this board is that a healthy marriage is composed of two healthy self-differentiated individuals. Anything else is a BD waiting to happen.

I would push to get IC restarted, ASAP, even if remotely.

As far as whether to bring a potential OM up in MC, or to bring up her comment on sexual fulfillment in MC, my advice is to let your MC be your guide. You shouldn't be thinking about what to bring up or not bring up between sessions (see obsessing comment above). Concentrate on any homework the MC has given you. But let each session organically develop. The MC will likely have their goal for each session. If the topic naturally comes up then yes mentioning that your W's comment inferring an open marriage bothered you. IN fact, don't word it the way I did, say "When she said that I felt like it referred to an open marriage." But again, let the session just happen, don't go in with a prepared "I am going to mention".

Your insecurities, while justified, will certainly hold you back. Women like a strong, confident, thick-skinned man. I have yet to find a woman that feels like she has to be on eggshells around her H as to not "hurt his feelings". So convey confidence. Convey an air of "I am better than any OM that you could find!" Know your own worth. Don't look for your worth in how other people view you.

Today, get out and do something that gets your mind off of all of this! Sitting and stewing is your worst enemy.


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All fair points Steve, I appreciate the straightforward approach and communication.

You are completely right - I should not stray away from my self-improvement path now when I started making progress. This first MC session was obviously the trigger for me to start obsessing again, even though I wasn't doing it at all for the past few weeks.

I'll try to get back to IC, but also to really focus on DB'n... And not really do any MC planning any more. We are paying the therapist a lot of money, I should probably let them do their work. smile

This Covid situation just makes all of this a lot harder, since we are both bound to being at home most of the time, and not being able to meet other people like friends and family freely. I am usually a very active person and it was never hard for me to find activities that will make me feel better, but now when a lot of that is restricted, it is taking it's toll on me.

Going out for a run now, that will help. Thanks for all the support!


Me: 33
W: 35
D: 2
Together: June 2010
Married: June 2016
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 538
Likes: 1
M
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Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 538
Likes: 1
Read
Go to the woods and trek
Work on house / DIY
Find a project you have been putting off
Go “cold swimming”. Mention here recently. Tried 6 degrees Celsius for one minute last week.
Skiing / skating if snow
A friend of mine went golfing since some of the courses are still open this year

I am 100% sure you can find something every day!

Last edited by Mumin; 12/22/20 08:27 PM.

Me: 34
Stbxw: 30
D:5 D:3
Mini bd: May/June 2019
Married: Aug 2019
BD: 6th Dec 2019
OM Confirmed: Feb 2020
March 2020: I filed for D
Waiting for D to be finalized and W to move out end of January 2021
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