Where's the banana

[exquisitetobe]

This is my thoughts on S from living with someone like her for years.

The mentioned big house she lost?? She found a new one. ( for now )
The previous move to Ottawa.... ( money pilling in the bank kept secret from you )
The lack of integrity in the foundation of your relationship.
The irresponsability she shows to her children and pets.
The tactic ( manipulation ) she uses on you to forfill HER desire while discounting yours.
You get my point..

Andrew, you brought up the love language book to me and i love it.
We talk about it often.

What did you say S' s language was in the beginning of your relationship?

Is it still the same?

[bttrfly]

Andrew, pray for strength and just do it. You cause more harm by delay. You know this. You can do this.

[bttrfly]

And no, you were not honest.

[devvo]

Andrew,

I feel for you. I really do. You hate the idea of conflict and you hate the idea of hurting people. You are self-sacrificing and most of the time you don't mind the paying the price. But you do - and for good reason. I think you know that the price is too high - and you're not the only one paying.

What you might call patience might be seen by others as enabling S's self-destructive behaviours. It's clear you're not at all comfortable making her account for her shortcomings or their consequences. Those consequences make you unhappy. She suspects you're unhappy - she may even know why - but she is incapable of making a difference.

S can't be be what you want. She's just not compatible with you and no amount of "I can change" statements will fix that. Nor will papering over the cracks, pretending there are no disappointments or unmet expectations. You are going to let her try to be something she's not - and I don't think that is fair on either of you.

Quite frankly I think it's clear that S is not going to become a better person for being with you. I don't see she has impetus or motivation to increase the respect she has for herself. Worse, there is a fair chance she knows that no matter how much you dissemble, she's losing yours.

From where I'm standing it's clear that being together is not good for either of you. I agree with quite a few others here that it'd be the best thing for both of you to go your separate ways.

[AndrewP]

Thanks so much all. Difficult times indeed.

Andrew, you brought up the love language book to me and i love it.
We talk about it often.

What did you say S' s language was in the beginning of your relationship?

Is it still the same?

I imagine that it is still Quality Time as is mine. It's just that we have different ideas on how that time is spent.

And no, you were not honest.

(({{bttrfly}})) - As I mentioned in the prolog - words are an inadequate tool for communicating and the truth can be an ephemeral, changeable thing. Some truths may be self-evident, but only to the person hold that truth. But yes - absolutely - I was not honest with her that I did think it best that she and the boys move out. But I also don't want her to. Laying there the night before having that warm presence beside me wasn't something I wanted to lose. She does motivate me to not be a sailing stone carving a random path along the playa.

I continue to be torn about it all. The cognitive dissonance that despite all the rational evidence to the contrary that causes a person to believe in the possible.

S did seem very shocked and surprised that I would even consider that she would be moving out not to mention badly hurt. I undoubtedly was wrong in suspecting that she was looking for the door or perhaps if I was correct, then she was shocked that I was willing to open it.

For my own part, I felt a huge amount of relief as the load of carrying that frustration lifted off of me by getting it out. I do feel horrible that she is now burdened with it. Despite what it may seem like from the outside, she has made consistent progress in getting things organized and put away. Just not with any sort of speed. Considering that it didn't arrive organized at all this is a decent accomplishment in my mind.

Undoubtedly as most people suggest, the longer this would drag on, the harder to make the break it would be. And as S herself said "perhaps we got engaged too soon".

If S hadn't been thinking about an exit, I'm 105% sure now that she is. She'd be stupid not to. And she's not a stupid woman. She's seen this story play out more than once including a time when she was in her car in the driveway and was told that it was over.

I do know that she's held off sending her contribution to the monthly bills in and did finally late yesterday send in some cash which was after I pointed out that we were in over-draft and that I was worried. Is it that she's accumulating a nest egg or is just oblivious to the situation?

I know that I should be active and take action. As I said, I'm so very torn.

As was talked about on kml's thread, I do think that S does perhaps believe in the concept of a soul-mate and destiny.
The soulmate as a stalker is certainly a thing though. S has that pseudonym because she was originally referred to as "stalker lady". I think that she had me marked out and perhaps built a narrative around that actually years ago. She certainly suddenly kept a steady view on my social media. She said that she had also done some sort of "reading" on me and it identified me as an ideal partner.

As is the case with these type of personalities, they can be both insecure and controlling I feel.

First official day of vacation. I spent much of yesterday washing dishes to nobody's surprise. S offered to help dry which she often does and yes, I didn't take her up on it. It is a task that if I am doing it, I prefer to do it alone. Perhaps something I should get over.

I have to go into the hardware store and pick up some plywood for some paneling repairs and S and I are planning on going for a walk in the woods in the afternoon after S13 is done with his online school work.

Tomorrow S is up baby-sitting her GS and I hope to get a lot of the plaster repairs in S13's room done. I have lots to keep me puttering and occupied.

Thanks again everyone for the kicks, nudges and kind thoughts.

[job]

Andrew,

There is an absolute difference in "getting engaged too early" and "moving in too early". Getting engaged does not mean that people are going to live together at the drop of a hat. Now, the moving in part, I do think that she pushed a bit too much to move in entirely too soon as she's not divorced and may not be for a long time.

Look, I'm going to be very honest with you. You have talked to people IRL about your relationship w/S and what may be transpiring in your home and how you feel and you come here, where it is a safe place to post and get the thoughts of the others. However, the person that you need to sit down with and have a very open and to the point discussion with is S. She is the one that you need to be expressing your feelings to. If you are at a loss for words, write down a list of what you need in the way of making you feel better about the relationship and the state of your living arrangements. S needs to hear this from you.

BTW, I certainly hope that you are not taking on any "new" projects while you are off. If I recall, you have a few that you've been attempting to work on since before S and her clan moved in.

Again, do not wait too long to pull the plug on this relationship. The longer you hold off, the more difficult it will be to end it. Andrew, there are more women out there that are far better in keeping a house clean and making it a home who are either single and/or divorced. You do not need to rescue all of the women who are sitting on the fence and not divorced. You have a lot to offer someone and that someone is out there. You deserve someone who will love you for you and not your home or your pay check. Someone who has the same interests and will be excited to work w/you on your many projects and take those walks and will love to travel w/you. You need someone who will enrich your life, not create anxiety and dissatisfaction w/how things are turning out.

Try to carve out some time for just you. Take those walks, drink your beer and visit w/your son. He's a wise young man.

[kml]

[quote Is it that she's accumulating a nest egg or is just oblivious to the situation?][/quote]

By your calculations she's got around a $3,000 nest egg already. Either that's true, or she's been spending $3,000 elsewhere.

AS for the monthly contribution - you need to be asking for that in a timely manner. You keep waiting for her to do things on her own and it's very clear she's not good at that. So you sit there stressing about an overdraft yet wait until the 12th of the month to ask her where's the transfer? There should be a set day for it (if the money comes in on the 3rd, then the 4th should be the transfer day) and just TELL her "hey, it's the 4th, transfer day".

Now, if she was REALLY a partner, she'd be telling you - "hey, I'm keeping out a little for an emergency fund, but once it gets to X dollars, all the rest of the extra will go to paying down that consolidation loan. " Instead her finances are still opaque to you and that's not a good thing.

As for the dishes - WHY do you keep taking them on? If you enjoy them, then fine - but you're setting yourself up to be Dobbie the house elf. "Oh don't bother with the dishes tonight, Andrew likes to do them, so leave them in the sink for him tomorrow". You need to be CLEAR - "hey S, when I;m doing dishes I do like to do them alone, but my PREFERENCE would be that people do their dishes after dinner and I don't have to wake up to a kitchen full of dirty dishes and food that's not been put away". And really, shouldn't the boys be learning to do dishes? You might need to get over your preference for doing them alone and assign a helper each night so they can learn these skills. Then eventually every night one person is assigned to do the dishes - and you are only doing them yourself twice a week.

I'd guess you haven't told her you're unhappy with her sleeping half the day away. And you're unhappy with the dirty dishes. And you're unhappy with her blowing the grocery budget and not working with you on meal plans. And you're unhappy that she doesn't make sure the dog does his business at night before she goes to be so you don't wake up to find dog poop on the carpet. (Have you even TOLD her how many times you've found that?)

You're NOT asking for anything unreasonable. And although you say she's "making progress" on the decluttering, imagine how much progress would have been made if she let you help ? If the two of you worked on it one weekend day a week it would all be put away and tidy by now. It's really NOT reasonable that all these months later things are still such a mess, and it's happening because she's a hoarder who can't let go of things. Plus I give it 2 weeks before the spaces that were cleaned up for Thanksgiving are a mess again.

I still think, if it was me, I'd put off the projects that aren't "urgent" and treat the decluttering as an emergency. Your life will be MUCH better if the plastering or kitchen painting aren't done for a while but the clutter is removed and your living spaces are organized and clean.

I know it's hard to think of losing the companionship (and the sex). But honestly, you can easily find another companion - the numbers are on your side as a guy - and you're a "catch" as you're a gainfully employed financially stable homeowner without addictions.

But IF you're going to commit to working on this relationship, I would definitely see her therapist and address the hoarding and cleanliness issues.

[kml]

And Andrew - while I know you're trying to spare her feelings, if you're not EXPLICIT about what your expectations are and what's bothering you, she can't be expected to correct those things. Just setting a vague endpoint and expecting her to rise to the occasion is not really working in this case. So be much more concrete.

[Dawn70]

I, again, agree with kml. You are a nice guy and you avoid conflict like you are avoiding the 'rona, and I suspect you would rather poke out your own eye with a sharp stick before hurting anyone, but my dear, sweet, kind-hearted man, you are doing S no favors in giving her vague information about your unhappiness then just waiting and hoping it all gets better. You say she didn't understand your unhappiness, but as someone else pointed out, I think she understands WAY better than she is letting on. As several before me have said, she's been down this road before, so she knows. I think she is counting on your kind and passive nature and the fact that when she turns on the waterworks or tosses a few nice sentiments your way (like being happy in your home, other than seeing you unhappy and shutting her out....don't you see how even that was manipulating you into taking fault in the whole thing while she is the poor, sick, single mom with a laundry list of medical issues that prevent her from working, starting her own business, doing anything productive in any form or fashion....but, you are shutting her out?)

I promise I do not come here with the intentions of hitting you with a 2x4, but if there was ever a time when you needed it, it is now. I'm sorry you are in this place. Sorry you are not getting your needs met. Sorry that you have been put in a decision to make this decision. You have made the decision, however, and you MUST act on it. As others have already said, dragging it out does NO ONE any favors. It is going to make the whole ordeal much worse if you let it carry on. Do whatever you need to do to muster the courage to sit her down and TALK TO HER and BE HONEST. Do not back down. She will be fine. You really aren't helping anyone have better feelings for her when you tell us things like you call her "s" because she stalked you. Come on, now, Andrew....is that REALLY what you want from a relationship? Someone who stalked you, manipulates you, relies on you to support her and her brood and calls all the shots in your house while you sit back and act as the man servant for the chaos clan? I know we are not the same person, but I would be d@mned before I would allow myself to be used that way. I would rather be alone and have my house, my space to myself and the way I want it than to let chaos reign while I pay for it and let myself be manipulated by the person who creates it. You deserve so much more than that and it may take you a bit to find it, but like kml said, you are a catch. Start acting like one rather than acting like someone who deserves to be treated like a whipped dog.

[bttrfly]

ok Andrew is the warm presence worth the rest? why do you think her presence is the only warm presence available to you?

btw, a ,lovely feline companion is also a warm presence ....