1. Never, ever, ever, ever write a letter. No apology letter, no love letter, no outpouring of earnestness. It can and probably will be used against you, either emotionally or possibly even legally.
Amen to that brother! That $hit only works in the movies.
Originally Posted by unchien
2. If you aren't willing to walk away from a relationship if your needs aren't met, you need to work on yourself. Doesn't matter if you have 10 kids together and have been married for 30 years. You can be in the happiest MR possible today, but you always need to be willing to stand up to have your needs (assuming they are reasonable) met.
Yes and in a true meaningful relationship both people will bee happy to meet each other's needs.
Originally Posted by unchien
3. If you can't get in touch with your own values and feelings, you will forever be susceptible to feelings of self-doubt. Others, intentionally or not, will undermine your self-confidence in your decision making. You are susceptible to gaslighting. You can easily get sucked into a vortex of negativity and will struggle to detach and self-differentiate. You will start to make mistakes -- thinking you are DB'ing when in fact you are continuing to perpetuate a lousy situation. Enlist support if needed to help you, but don't "poison the well" - seek 1 or 2 trusted friends (ideally not family), go to IC, seek legal counsel (discreetly).
U be careful blaming your perpetuating lousy sitch it on DB. If you never moved out you would be D'd by now and have a $hit ton more money in your pocket.
Originally Posted by unchien
4. Find out what works for you. It's different for everybody. If something doesn't work, ditch it and try something else. You will find things that work for you. It won't happen overnight. Don't give up on the process.
Exactly!
Originally Posted by unchien
5. Validation can be a dangerous technique if used unskillfully, depending on your situation (especially if you are not detached). Validation can be mistaken as acceptance. Personally, I wish I had used active listening (here is what I hear you saying) rather than validation (I can understand how you could feel that way), given the dynamics of my situation at the time.
Can you give some examples of how it became dangerous?
3. If you can't get in touch with your own values and feelings, you will forever be susceptible to feelings of self-doubt. Others, intentionally or not, will undermine your self-confidence in your decision making. You are susceptible to gaslighting. You can easily get sucked into a vortex of negativity and will struggle to detach and self-differentiate. You will start to make mistakes -- thinking you are DB'ing when in fact you are continuing to perpetuate a lousy situation. Enlist support if needed to help you, but don't "poison the well" - seek 1 or 2 trusted friends (ideally not family), go to IC, seek legal counsel (discreetly).
U be careful blaming your perpetuating lousy sitch it on DB. If you never moved out you would be D'd by now and have a $hit ton more money in your pocket.
I made a ton of mistakes, I agree with you. I also, by being beaten on the head repeatedly with hard lessons, am finally coming around to realizing this is my life and nobody else's. I am going to live according to my values, and I'm going to feel good about that, regardless of the blowback I get from others, because I know I'm coming from a place of good intentions and a constant eye towards self-improvement.
Originally Posted by LH19
Originally Posted by unchien
5. Validation can be a dangerous technique if used unskillfully, depending on your situation (especially if you are not detached). Validation can be mistaken as acceptance. Personally, I wish I had used active listening (here is what I hear you saying) rather than validation (I can understand how you could feel that way), given the dynamics of my situation at the time.
Can you give some examples of how it became dangerous?
Validating the feelings stemming from false accusations.
When we went to MC2 last summer, I had to have a separate 1:1 call with the counselor because I felt teamed up on. He told me that I had agreed that I had done all these horrible things. I said, "I was validating her feelings, I was not *agreeing* with her!" "Oh" he said.
Keep in mind counselors are mandatory reporters. This person's license is on the line if they believe something worth reporting happened and they fail to do so. He never bothered to check the facts with me, in a potentially legally fraught situation.
So yeah, I probably shouldn't have tried to use validation... I was not skillful enough, nor was it appropriate for that situation.
My situation has really devolved at the moment. I don't want to go into the details, but it's possible if not likely this is going to get expensive and legal. I probably won't post much other than possibly feelings journals for awhile.
Compared to even a week or two ago, I'm feeling much stronger. As a child, I learned to cater to my M's sometimes extremely negative moods. I suppressed my emotional needs, and I developed a sense of humor as a way to compensate. I learned by being agreeable, things would be tolerable and the people around me would be happier. And as a result, I've been walked on several times in my life. I accepted lousy treatment in past relationships. I've walked on eggshells around my W (which is a NGS signature move and can be very destructive to MRs). Eventually I wanted to fix things so badly that I wrote these over-the-top apology letters a year ago that completely eviscerated myself, hoping to keep the peace. I look back and cannot believe how willing I was to just lay down and admit to being a fundamentally awful person, because I thought it would save my MR.
Now I'm faced with this situation with tons of blowback. From my WAW. From my parents who cut me off 3 years ago (but now are making clumsy attempts to reconnect now that they've heard about my D). From the mediator. A lot of people suggesting I am unreasonable or flawed.
And... I feel centered. I feel calm. I just want equal time with my kids. I deserve it. I feel centered in my values and I don't care if people object.
And... I feel centered. I feel calm. I just want equal time with my kids. I deserve it. I feel centered in my values and I don't care if people object.
This may be the best paragraphed you have ever posted. Every good parent deserves an opportunity to have equal parenting time with their children if they so choose. Stick to your guns U!
I probably won't post much other than possibly feelings journals for awhile.
I get you may not want your ex-wife to know full details of your legal strategy, but consider whether her reading roughly how it's going would present problems. e.g., "I need to get to 50/50 within a short period of time, her attorney says only 67/33." We're here whatever you choose to share. My experience with a divorce where one side went expensive (>$100,000) and the other didn't spend as much (<$15,000) on a court battle was that the extra money didn't buy so much. Courts like to work towards guidelines, norms. If you have a good attorney they should be able to help guide you from here to 50/50.
Originally Posted by unchien
And... I feel centered. I feel calm. I just want equal time with my kids. I deserve it. I feel centered in my values and I don't care if people object.
Absolutely getting to 50/50 is a great goal! Keep it up, Unchien. You've got this.
I get you may not want your ex-wife to know full details of your legal strategy, but consider whether her reading roughly how it's going would present problems. e.g., "I need to get to 50/50 within a short period of time, her attorney says only 67/33."
I'm not sure I follow.
She wants to revisit the possibility of 50/50 a year from now, "see how it goes", etc. Why would I agree to that with somebody who has shown no willingness to budge, and continues to imply I am unsafe with my children? I have zero trust that she will change her mind. What I've proposed is we ramp-up to 50/50 in the future, but it must be an agreement to be at 50/50 at some future time. I'm happy to negotiate the timeframe, but I won't kick the can down the road on the fundamental point that we need an agreement to get to 50/50... that's just crossing my fingers that she will change her mindset in the future, and so far, over a year into our situation, after 6 months of counseling to try to get to some base level of trust, she has not budged.
Hi Unchien, I was referring to, "I probably won't post much other than possibly feelings." Post whatever makes you comfortable, I was proposing sharing the status of the case wasn't likely put you at any disadvantage. Your attorney is of course the key person to trust for legal details and strategy.
Originally Posted by unchien
She wants to revisit the possibility of 50/50 a year from now, "see how it goes", etc. Why would I agree to that with somebody
Why would you agree to that.. with anyone? You almost certainly should get 50/50 custody sometime soon! It sounds like you care a lot about your children and being a good father.
The opposite of agreeing isn't an expensive battle. The "expensive" bit triggered my curiosity as it sounded like what many worry about when they start working the system, but my experience of divorce cases--admittedly, limited to self and family and friends--is that the person seeking guidelines amount pays little compared to the person seeking something different. Courts like 50/50 and paths to 50/50. I've seen that even when there's been past criminal or abusive behavior--given time without incidents and counseling. I wonder if your attorney set that expectation that defending your basic rights as a father would be expensive? You don't have to answer me, just my two cents to consider.
I am glad that you are going for 50/50. It might be expensive from a financial standpoint, but it would be more costly to not have as much time with your children as possible.
All the best!!
Me:45 ExW:48 M:04/97 3 Bombs & 2 ReCons 1st BD 11/10 D Finalized 4/20 D-16 S-14 Going in one more round when you don't think you can. That's what makes all the difference in life.~Rocky Balboa
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