Standing vs standing still

[DejaVu6]

Hi FS. I am still here just not as often. I am glad to see you are too.

Re: your kids. They will take their cues from you. They are watching you. My advice...I wouldn’t wait for them to tell you about the new girlfriend. My sense is that if they haven’t yet, it’s because they are trying to protect you. I would just identify the elephant in the room and tell them Daddy told you he is introducing them to his new friend and that you are completely fine with it (even if you aren’t) and there is no need for them to ever hide anything from you. Tell them that you want them to be okay and that they never have to worry about your feelings as it is your job, as their mom, to worry about theirs. Then plaster a smile on your face and let them see you are okay. This will take a big burden off of their shoulders.

There is a lot of change happening for them and for you. Show them that the best way to deal with change is to embrace it and focus on the prospect of new adventures and new people being added to your lives. It is all about attitude and teaching them by example (something you are great at, I know). Having said that, if they see you looking sad and they comment on it, don’t deny it. Just tell them it is normal to feel sad sometimes and that it enables us to really appreciate the good times when they happen. Life is 5% what happens to you and 95% what you do about it. Lots of opportunity for life lessons here. The most important thing is that you keep the lines of communication open as their natural inclination will be to protect you. I don’t know your kids but the other thing that could happen is that they meet her and like her and then feel guilty for liking her. So...I would also tell them it is okay if they like her. This reduces any conflicted feelings they might have.

I can appreciate the challenge with having his mom as your main child care option seeing as how my XMIL is mine. It is difficult sometimes. XH and I have finally, I think, established that when he needs her to look after the kids, he lets me know since this means they will inevitably be wandering upstairs to my part of the house and I may or may not be there. So far so good but it could definitely become a bone of contention if we let it.

Anyway...just wanted to drop by and let you know I haven’t disappeared. Just trying to navigate the online dating world after divorce. It would be nice if I was about 10 years younger but what can you do? At least I look it...lol. Take care and don’t be a stranger!! (((HUGS)))

[may22]

The first was his declaration that I had to give him first option when it came to babysitting the children and he had to approve all babysitters (the babysitter in question was his mum, and I had asked her to watch the children over night because I needed to go to work early the next day). I responded fine, but it worked both ways, he would need to inform me when his mum watched the children for him also. He huffed ("She's MY mum!!!") and then stormed off.

OMG FS, this cracked me up big time. This was hilarious and I laughed out loud reading it. I hope you are able to get enough distance to see how ridiculous this kind of thing is too... he obviously knows it also (and so reverses course later on). Do you think he has the capacity to be embarrassed? or just thinks you set him up or some other way to cast blame?

On other fronts, I reached out to my childhood best friend. I haven't spoken to her in 13 years. Distance and children led to a natural drifting apart. We moved back into the same rhythm as we did when we were kids - some difficult topics (my separation, her affair, her discovering that someone close to us had been sexually abused all her childhood) to simple topics (childhood boyfriends and general gossip) . It was lovely.

I also reached out to my mother - there was some awkwardness, but otherwise it was pleasant. It was obvious she missed me an wants to stay in my life. I can't remember how much of my childhood I shared here, but it was tough and I left it more or less behind when I moved countries. I guess I need to forgive her for her part in making it tough. She was doing the best she could.

I think this is great-- difficult I'm sure, but good to focus on some of the other important relationships in your life.

I also agree with DejaVu that if you can open the conversation with your daughters, that would be a good thing. I was reading a book about children in divorce and it sounded like what DejaVu describes is not unusual-- the children wanting to protect their parent (especially the mom when the dad was the one to MO), feeling guilty for knowing, feeling guilty for liking her, not wanting to see their mom sad or hurt. I think if you can open that conversation and make sure they know they can share ANYTHING with you, that might really help them out. Otherwise, the burden remains on them.

[dillydaf]

Hey FS, you sound very thoughtful. Do you think IC might be helpful for a little while? Just a suggestion You seem like you are addressing some of your historic issues anyway. I like the way you have reached out to your family and friend, your post about your H's family and your feelings of loss about them makes it obvious how much you feel that lack in your life. Which is healthy to address. I have a lot in common with you here I think. All my family live a very long way away. I don't contact them much. My mum drives me crazy if I have to see her too much! I probably have a few issues from childhood stuff with her, which is absolutely normal! But I just don't feel that close to my family, a big time difference makes that difficult even with technology. I have not yet told my family about H leaving, and I look forward to having that out in the open because it's a big secret to have kept for so long and probably has led to me not contacting them as often as I should have. My best childhood friend I have also hardly contacted, it's partly the time difference but also because I have had so much to tell her it's difficult knowing where to start. But that's on my to do list. I'm glad you contacted your friend again, that is so great to just pick up where you left off. True friendship is like that

Do you think you might try to initiate more new friendships? I know you're probably WAH since lockdown which makes seeing colleagues etc tricky. I've joined a bunch of meetups and met new people that way. Sometimes you just need extra social contact in your life. Like me I bet your main friends are mums who are busy weekends and evenings when you'd like to do stuff because your kids are with their dad. Anyway, just a suggestion, I know for me meeting new people has been a great way to feel less lonely. Take care of yourself xx

[Yail]

FS,

I think it's wonderful that you have reached out to your childhood friend and mum. I see that as a sign that things are unlocking within you, and you are making decisions for you and you alone again.

It's not that we intentionally make decisions for our spouse. But habits form, I get it. And then a great mental shift happens (or a slow mental shift happens) and there is a newfound need to connect to something old. I too have connected with my college roommate recently. It feels nice. I hope you continue these relationships.

Perhaps it's finding someone who knows us from our past - someone who knows us deep down without an introduction - and just being simple with them. A nice convo, a smile. It means a lot and honestly I think it does a lot with regards to loneliness. You don't have to be in constant contact but you start to feel there is someone there for you - even if they're in the wings.

Do you share where you country of origin is, or do you keep that private off the boards? For much of our time here I had imagined you had a London accent, but that must not be the case No problem if you choose to not share


If you could travel anywhere next: where would it be, and for what type of travel? Can we travel daydream for a bit? Tell me about the type of trip you'd like to take - SOLO - no kiddos :-D What would you experience?

[FlySolo]

May - Yes - he can be thoroughly ridiculous. It doesn't throw me like it use to. He hears something he doesn't like and then reacts with the most outrageous things. I think he believes what he says when he says it. To him, it makes ABSOLUTE sense that he can get his mum to babysit and not inform me and that when I try and do the same thing, it is somehow "wrong". He frames things in his head so they make sense to him. After wards, maybe he thinks about it. I don't know. I suspect his ego still wouldn't let him see how controlling and manipulative he is being. It's the same with the house. He won't tell me when he is coming over here 'because' it is his house. He back tracked this time because I called him out on it. He didn't apologies - just a simple "I will let you know when they are staying with MY mum" (capitals added by me). He says that he leaves them with his mum because "they want to stay with her" (true) and nothing to do with him wanting to go out (not true). Anyway, it doesn't throw me anymore.

Yes, it was good to speak to mum. There is a lot of work to be done there. She is scared to contact me so I will reach out this weekend. She did message me over the week to tell me my grandmother had did. I did not know her well and had only really met her a handful of times. I know that she was estranged from my mum for many many years and it is only recently that they got back in touch. I cried a little. Not for my grandmother, who I barely knew, but for my mum, and also because, and this one is weird, it is one less person out there that loves me (and I know how self centered that sounds).

I spoke to D10 about the GF. I just said "I know about her and I am OK with it. If there is anything you want to talk about then you can. I don't want you to feel you have to hide anything from me". She smiled and said "I know" and then skipped off to play with her toys. I have not had a conversation with D13 though. I just don't know how to broach it. I don't think we are there yet.

I did mention to both of them that my grandmother had did. I told D10 before she went to sleep and she replied "Oh, that's sad" and gave me a hug. I told D13 in the morning (soon after I heard), said "Oh" and then looked away. I think it was all too much for me and I said I needed to go and lie down for a bit. She just kept her head down.

She did tell her dad, and he said (2 days later) "D13 told me about your grandmother. I'm sorry". I just said "I'm fine" and then kept folding clothes. He said "well, if you're going to be like that, I won't say anything next time", to which I replied "Ok". I know the reaction was wrong. But all I could think was how he reacted when my father died (which was a shrug o the shoulders) and I didn't want to break down in front of him.

Dilly - I had a regression hypnosis session today (via skype) and we addressed some of my abandonment issues. Not him leaving me (i don't think I felt abondoned), but the feeling I had the first time he took the kids away on holidays without me. I had forgotten how much that hurt. I sat on the steps in our hall whilst he put their suitcases in the car. He looked at me and said something about how miserable I looked "you don't get excited about anything". So I put on a on a smile, hugged the girls, said have a "great time" and waved them goodbye as they drove off. And then, I went upstairs, curled myself into the fetal position, and cried. Each time has been easier. But the pain is still there. I need to deal with that.

Strangely, I did not tell my mum I am separated. I spoke to her about the girls, about how they are doing at school, about the sports they play etc. But I did not mention the separation or D13 not speaking to me. Definitely still have some walls up. Maybe time and forcing myself to speak to her will bring them down.

Yes, my main friends (locally) are mums. Up until the break up these friendships were at best school gate friendships. Superficial conversations about holidays we or they were going to/had been on and how the children were getting on. Some have become proper friends since - a lot of women are in similar boats to me. Long nights with wine laughing or crying on each others shoulders. But you are right, even with these women, it is hard to find time for each other. Children, lives, exes (and for some, new boyfriends) make it difficult. I don't want to burden them and they don't want to burden me. Luckily I seem to be quite a 'catch' on the dating app I am on. So I am engaged in a lot of random conversations. It's nice but tbh, a little tedious and, for some reason, after a few messages exchanged, they always want to start talking about sex (which, not being a prude, I think should be discussed after you've actually had sex), or they want to meet straightaway, and when you meet them, they just seem 'desperate' for a partner. I don't know, maybe I'm doing it wrong.

Yail - I have a week in Croatia (the Dalmation coast) booked on my own and a week in Ibiza with the girls. I booked the Croatian one the other day because I realised that 2 weeks without my kids (they are going away for a week with him and then a week with my inlaws) was too long to spend locked down on my own.

[may22]

She did tell her dad, and he said (2 days later) "D13 told me about your grandmother. I'm sorry". I just said "I'm fine" and then kept folding clothes. He said "well, if you're going to be like that, I won't say anything next time", to which I replied "Ok". I know the reaction was wrong. But all I could think was how he reacted when my father died (which was a shrug o the shoulders) and I didn't want to break down in front of him.

Wow. It really is all about him, isn't it?

My IC (also my H's IC) said H is "ego-driven" and I'm wondering if that can describe your H as well?

I'm glad you booked the week in Croatia. When do you leave? (Or for Ibiza???)

[FlySolo]

Hi May

I googled ego driven the other day and yes, that fits him fairly well. I have at times thought he might be a narcissist (mainly in the months around BD when he was mean) but I feel now that that was too harsh. He is not a bad person. He did not enter into our relationship with poor intentions. In fact, he adored me. He was just (and has always) been selfish. It's just that for 80% of our marriage, what he wanted was to build the best life possible for our family - the fancy job, the big house, the picket white fence, the beautiful and accomplished wife and the perfect children. For the last 20% he wanted to be on his own. Not single, just not a family man. No responsibilities, no obligations. He bought things for him. He went on holidays with his friends. He spent money on him. He wanted to go out and drink with his friends. That just didn't gel with the family life. Unfortunately, I think that he found out too late that that was a fantasy. That his friends were also family men and didn't want to spend their nights hanging out in bars and that spending all day on his own (while we were here) was just plain lonely. I don't think it took him that long tbh. I think he was probably on dating sites within 4-6 months of moving out.

On the 'it's all about him' quote. The other day I sent him a message saying that D10 would be staying over a friends house. This was my night to have them, but as he had said he wanted to know if/when the girls were staying with anyone else, I thought I'd let him know. His response "Thanks. I'm flying tomorrow anyway". It made me laugh. Not, "Thanks for letting me know" or "Great. I'm sure she'll have a great time", but "I'm flying anyway". All about him and the impact on him.

Croatia mid August, and then Ibizia late August. I cannot wait.

Yail - I didn't answer your question. I am half Filipino and I grew up in Australia. I was watching an african american comedian the other day whose wife is Filipino and he said "and our kids look Puertorican" which pretty much describes me. Accent wise I'd say it's pretty Londonish with an slight aussie twang.

[dillydaf]

So FS: have you still not told your mum that you are separated? In that case we have even more in common than I thought, lol. Still not told anyone in my family. Though I will when we finally have the D conversation. Not sure what else I can tell my family, it will be a difficult conversation.
Your H sounds very much like mine in a lot of ways. Not wanting to be part of a family towards the end. Wanting independence. Then realising what he lost but not being able to go back on things maybe. Not willing to put the hard work in for reconciliation. And also the always being about him bit. That's what one of my best friends said 'it's always been all about him, hasn't it?' and that was true.
I really identify with the feelings of loss when H takes the kids away. Important to acknowledge it, move on, book something to keep yourself busy, maybe even enjoy the space and time to yourself. H is taking the kids away next week for about 10 days, I was looking forward to spending time with my new man but that is a bit rocky right now so who knows. I feel ok either way, and have the wherewithal to organise plenty of stuff to keep myself busy if I need to.

I don't think you're doing online dating wrong, it's just a matter of luck and a numbers game. Keep on going, have some fun and keep an open mind

[DejaVu6]

FS...I am so envious of your Croatian vacay!! I had a three-week trip to Croatia planned for September with my sister & BIL and another couple. Unfortunately, we’ve had to postpone it due to the CV19 requirement that we self-isolate for 14 days upon our return but, even more relevant, our friend who is coming with us is immunocompromised so can’t risk travelling while the virus is still out there circulating. I’m making the best of it though. I’m finally getting the damage repaired that happens when one carries large twins to term...hoping to be able to wear a bikini by the time we go...lol. Also...one silver lining that I’ve been telling myself is that maybe by the time we go, I will have a plus one and it will be six of us instead of five.

Glad you reached out to your mom. I get not wanting to tell her about the separation right away...especially if you haven’t been in close contact until now. Sorry to hear about your grandma. I didn’t know mine that well either but it was a blow when she passed. I know she loved me lots. I don’t think you were selfish when you wrote about the origin of your grief...just honest...and human.

RE: Dating apps. I don’t think you are doing it wrong. I just think you have to kiss a lot of frogs (or at least have coffee with them) before you find your prince. I have had a lot of first dates but am holding out for some kind of spark with someone that makes me want to have a second date. So far, that’s been pretty elusive but I spent last night talking with the latest candidate who I thought wasn’t that interested but confessed last night that he is really interested and figures I won’t like him because he likes me already. Hmmm...turns out that even the guys who seem the most self-assured, are hiding some insecurities we didn’t think they could have. I was pretty surprised when he told me that. Even if his pics are five years old, I am pretty darn sure I will be physically attracted to him and if our phone conversations are any indication, I am the most hopeful I have been so far about the prospects of a second date. Anyway...don’t get discouraged...I’m sure you will meet someone cool when you are supposed to. (((HUGS)))

[FlySolo]

DV - how lovely it is to hear from you. And I can see you're doing great. You give me hope

Yes, I'm glad I reached out to mum too. I could feel the love in her voice. Her tentative I love you and I miss you. I will check in on her after I write you this note. She is not the woman she was. I suspect there are a lot of regrets there.

I went to Croatia last year remember. That was the adventure holiday with a travel group (about 15 of us) - we didn't stay in the same place more than once, hiking or exploring during the day followed by long drunken dinners at night. This time it is a sit in one place and maybe a glass of wine/beer with dinner. Did you see the 'travel buddy' posts between Yail and I. You can join our virtual travel buddy group. We can post each time we visit a new place and pretend that we three (and anyone else who wants to join) is there with us.

You and your 'candidates' . You make me laugh. I still find the whole thing a bit tedious but am giving it a (half hearted) try. I have something set up for next Saturday. Fingers crossed. I have drinks booked with the 'boy' (you remember the work flirtation - well that ended up becoming a genuine friendship) which I'm looking more forward to than the first date on Saturday. I think I am destined for a life where every male I know ends up in the 'friend' column.

On the H front. He came around today and I have to say, he is looking rather tubby these days . Though still tanned and gorgeous. Still an @rse though.