Still here. Still not detached... (Part 2)

[Kylo]

Chris, that is awesome that you guys could come to an agreement on so much.

You've read the stories here. The crying is almost meaningless. BUT the discussion hit you like a brick wall, and probably did something similar to her. It moved your process further along whatever the outcome will be.

[25yearsmlc]

Chris, that is awesome that you guys could come to an agreement on so much.

You've read the stories here. The crying is almost meaningless. BUT the discussion hit you like a brick wall, and probably did something similar to her. It moved your process further along whatever the outcome will be.

Amen Kylo. Even being unable to find something in my storage unit triggered tears in my d20 and then in me.

Chris, my h spoke to my brother last night about settling this. It has been a year and there are vastly different thoughts.

H "forgot" that he blocked my access to joint marital funds when we separated. What a surprise that was then, and I certainly found his present amnesia startling. There are other facts that he either ignores or forgot to tell his L or I don't know what. Like, "h, where are the funds you took?"

When my financial fears are allayed as best they can be, I think I will zoom ahead in my process.

The mourning is complicated when there are so many fears of financial doom. You are to be congratulated on avoiding this.

And yes, take in Blu's words. You do seem to be sort of unapproachable and no, not b/c your w doesn't know you oppose the divorce.

But the attitude that comes from the way you are presenting here, at least, seems a bit confrontational.

The way I read it, I feel like she'd have to crawl back.
Are you giving her reasons to return & restore the m, other than guilt?

Just asking.

[Lovelyp]

It's great that you are managing to sit and talk. Its not easy so stay strong. Try to not offer any more hints that you still want the marriage because you told her that many times before

Stay strong.
Btw I like reading your posts, good writing style snd cery 3interesting to read. You should consider writing books.

[Chris73]

It seems that Paul McCartney went through a similar situation...

----------------------------------------------
Your day breaks. Your mind aches.
You find that all her words of kindness linger on
When she no longer needs you.

She wakes up. She makes up.
She takes her time and doesn't feel she has to hurry
She no longer needs you.

And in her eyes you see nothing.
No sign of love behind the tears.
Cry for no one
A love that should have lasted years.

You want her. You need her.
And yet you don't believe her
When she says her love is dead
You think she needs you.

And in her eyes you see nothing.
No sign of love behind the tears.
Cry for no one
A love that should have lasted years.

You stay home. She goes out.
She says that long ago she knew someone
But now he's gone. She doesn't need him.

Your day breaks. Your mind aches.
There will be times when all the things she said
Will fill your head.
You won't forget her.

And in her eyes you see nothing.
No sign of love behind the tears.
Cry for no one
A love that should have lasted years.

--"For No One" 1966
------------------------------------------------

[Chris73]

Are you giving her reasons to return & restore the m, other than guilt?

I'd like to think so. We don't speak about the marriage or the relationship that much anymore. The "let's try to work through our issues" discussions never got us anywhere.

We had a few sessions of MC and oddly enough after the second session I got a random phone call from her a day later stating, "I just want you to know how much I appreciate everything that you have been doing for our family and for us. It hasn't gone unnoticed. So thank you." And then not two weeks later she was pushing for divorce and calling me a selfish gaslighting a-hole.

Since then I haven't brought it up much. Yesterday was the first time in a long time that I attempted to break through the wall of her "all smiles and business" demeanor.

And I HAVE really stepped it up with regard to the things she always complained about. Primarily the "take charge" attitude that I lacked for so long. But I have always tried to make her understand that reconciliation means starting over. Squashing all the stuff that we did to each other in the past and not holding grudges.

But I'm really convinced despite all her denials that there is still some OM in the picture and it's probably getting more serious. If so, I'm sure this relationship has influence over her decisions.

Regardless, I feel like I'm keeping my chin up for the most part. I'm happy with the changes I've made and I feel like I have an even better relationship with my kids. Taking over the house on my own is going to be tough, but it's exactly what I need. The last couple of day were real downers. But the weekend is here and I'm taking Monday off to go down the shore and unwind.

[Gordie]

I'm happy that you have your chin up and that you have made changes for you. Enjoy the shore! Going by yourself or with the kids? How long will it take for the D to get finalized?

[BluWave]

I hope I wasn't too harsh and I did not mean to do a "we told you so," I promise. I like you tho and I think you are a nice guy. I also think you deserve far better than to be pining over a woman that is Ding you and most likely cheating. When we are heart broken, we so desperately want our life back, that we can lose perspective of our own value. That is what I like about DB--the ultimate goal is becoming stronger and a better self, not just winning someone back. That doesn't actually work. Tricking our S back is not the M anyone wants.

To me, once people "give up", thats when DBing actually starts.

I agree with what Kaizen wrote. Here is my take on it. We can all come here and follow the 37 rules--DB, GAL, 180, etc--but we are somewhat faking it until we make it. The "faking it" are the actions that we do, so that ultimately we are "making it," which are the actual feelings of detachment and the "giving up." I don't mean to get all hippy dippy, but the S can feel an energy shift that happens when we "give up." Even just reading the posts here, we can feel who is still clinging and who it entering detachment. You mention that it will come in time, but I am suggesting otherwise--you have to work hard at it. You have to continually position yourself--physically and mentally--so that you can let go.

Even if you are doing all the correct things, she still feels your attachment to her. Being a MNG makes this all the more challenging for you. It is ingrained in you to be kind and considerate of her. It is very hard for you to see that this kills any attraction for her. She knows that she can have you back in the snap of a finger. So until you actually change your actions, and then your thinking, so that this is no longer true, she will not even consider a R. Once you decide you deserve better than to be treated this way, you can start to let go--she will feel it and we will read it here in your writing. This has become very apparent to me in the threads here--I can tell who is working towards detachment and who is not, and the ones that are, are seeing more results.

So how do you change this? Here is the thing, our personal actions are very powerful over our feelings. There is a TED talk that encourages people to stand up tall and position themselves in a strong and powerful stance before walking into a meeting or interview where they may otherwise feel intimidated. So that is a small example. It will be a conscious daily effort for you to position yourself into a man that is strong, confident, and knows that he deserves a W that respects him and desires him. You have so start living each day doing things that will lead you to this belief system. Then as I adopt these beliefs, do things that reinforce them, I can feel closer to him.

So my H is a MNG big time. We have been piecing for 2.5 years, but after his betrayal, it has been very hard for me to settle into a M with him. I have to make a conscious choice often to do what I believe is the right thing and then my feelings slowly catch up. The M program we are in makes it very clear that M is a choice, love is a choice, and forgiveness is a choice. All verbs. This goes against every fiber of my being so I have to keep doing things that reinforce this belief system. (none of this is romantic, trust me)

You know what keeps me from being a WAW? He is a darn good DBer naturally! (I have never told him details about the book/site and have asked him to respect my privacy, which I believe he has) He has read the MNG book and he has worked on himself and his boundaries. He is an expert validator. He does not pursue when I pull back. He is mastering no longer being a doormat, and actually sometimes he can be firm when he stands up to me. He checks me when I need it. He never used to be this way! He has learned to demand respect and even though I know the game (all the rules he is mastering), it still works on me! You see, before his A and our separation, he was very much a people pleaser and had poor boundaries. Even though I didn't leave him, I can see that I didn't respect him for this NG behavior.

I know our sitches our different, but my point is that women are attracted to strong and confident men. My H is one of the nicest guys I know. I still hear this from friends and family (and yes they know he had an A and had bailed). But that is not what keeps me from leaving him. It is that he has learned to respect himself and he has strong boundaries now. He has had to work really hard at this and it has not come naturally for him.

So yes, I am suggesting that you start being more of a d-ck to your wife. (you and Parkema/Mark). She is betraying you in the worst way and so it confuses her (and turns her off) that you continue to be so nice. Start pretending that you are that guy that doesn't want a lying, cheating, crying, selfish, manipulating W. Because I promise you, your W, wants that guy.

Blu

[BluWave]

opps, not sure how I did that but this Then as I adopt these beliefs, do things that reinforce them, I can feel closer to him. was supposed to be at the end of the following paragraph.

[TBSakaJ9]

Blu...thank you for this it makes a lot of sense and is a really good post. I have felt myself mentally start to pull away from my W over the past couple of weeks. I think were I struggle is with the financial peace. Any advice on that? I make more than double what she makes and when she moved out we divided up the bills based on our incomes and since I make more I am paying for more than she is. She is still paying for her own rent, cell phone, utilities, etc. but she has called me a couple of times when she overspent. One time I had to buy her groceries to help her out when my D's were with her. By helping her like that am I showing her I am still attached and is that being too nice of guy?

[Chris73]

Thanks Blu. This is a lot to digest and I will re-read it a few more times when I'm not so busy at work. But just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to reply.

I'm heading to Atlantic City on Sunday for some serious GAL. The plan is to hang at the bar, watch football, take naps at the pool, play some poker, grab a late night dinner at the sushi bar, catch up on sleep, and probably hit the spa. Not going with anyone, which is a bit of a drag, but I could use the quiet time, plus I'm sure I'll start up some conversations with people while I'm there. And I'll have the MNG book with me