For better or for worse, for richer or for PORES?

[pbetra]

Shining - just realized that I botched my reply to you. Left my computer - then returned & must have just 'submitted' (got my own version of crazy ). Sorry about that . The change of heart (your h) is the 'fear factor' as mentioned - panic. I still think it was nice the way it turned out that day- 'loose possiblity' ... no expectations, but possibility relative to how it's played out.
Keep on shining, p.

[daring]

Shining I am feeling warm and fuzzy reading your latest updates- seriously

It's so interesting how really this is all about our H's forgiving and loving themselves. I think how you have handled things so far is spot on.

Do you know what your H's love language is? My H is physical touch and that's why I have chosen to continue with intimacy ( plus- let's be real- I miss it too!!).
I also try to offer hugs and brief touches here and there. Isn't it funny how much a hug can say now that we've gone through all this??!! I know my sitch is a little different as there was only EA ( as far as I know) but I sure see a difference in his ability to connect when ML is included in our interactions.

Can't wait to hear all about the demise of your H and OW as it sure seems like it's coming. I remember reading Raine had a really funny name for the OW ( twinkle twat maybe?) I'm sure you have a few choice names for the OW in your sitch but she clearly can't hold a candle to you.

Cheering for you!!

[juliegayle]

Shining. Just caught up on your last few days. You are handling things really well. I think the biggest take away is that you have not backtracked from your focus on you.

I too have a much bigger picture of life and the place I hold in it ( and want to hold) since this whole mlc thing began. Don't lose sight of that.

I am rooting for you in every way.

[Shining]

Update.... Quickie as I am still processing.....

H still deeeeeeeeeep replay.
H still into me but also at least one ow and it is never acknowledged nor brought up.
H acts and talks like I'm the only one in his life. I don't ask.
Ow #1 not around as much, partly because I visit house a lot now.
I sense when he's stressing to juggle texting between me and ow etc.
H seems to want me but clearly not ready for r.
R talks getting a bit deeper and sweeter but I can tell when it's time to switch topics or h switches topics and we lighten up
H said he misses me. And other nice things. He doesn't say this in words, but it's still clear H doesn't want to lose me but he doesn't want to be married right now.
H reaching out more to D13. H was always crazy about her
Lots of complimenst to me tonight from H. Eyes were more real.
H VERRRRRRY jealous of thought of guys looking at me.
Also acting very protective and making comments about guys and me and what he is ok with and not ok with....wtf . IM NOT DATING.
H very snuggly tonight. Talks a lot about the past when we were in jr high. The twisted thing is that I was "the girl" h had a crush on and he tells me fantasies he had then.... Creepy or no.....?
More details later.... He's not close to being done with replay at all. I care so much for him and I can't make him stop running. I'll never stop caring. But he is a bit of a stranger and that feels weird. Then moments of intense hugs as I was leaving and feelings come back... Idk. I'm spinning and rambling nonsense.

H texted me 3 times before I got home. He said he had a great visit. I said I did too. He said he didn't want me to leave. I said I didn't want to leave. He replied, "dang". There's more but that's basically it.

Been super busy with S15 bday now S16 AND he got his DL on his bday so yay. Also D13 getting into school activities already. School shopping and JOB hunting which makes me mad. I have no energy for this stuff and I'm feeling resentful but it is what it is.

Getting some sleep then figuring out my life tomorrow.

Spinning spinning spinning..... And hopeful. Years down the road. But I'm glad we have gotten over the initial monster anger for now.

Sorry this is not very well written.... Jotting thoughts. G'night, all:).

[Shining]

Wow.....it's everything they said it was....and worse.

If anyone wants insight into the thought process and text conversation with a double-standard, MLC H who is not wanting to be my H AT ALL, lying about his own "extracurricular activities", but not wanting me to date anyone, here ya go. Comments and advice are welcomed and encouraged!!! Ugh.

It's a long, circular dance, but if you read H words, I believe you can follow his MLCer thought process a little....

The setting: Neither of us acknowledges any current ow, although he knows I found out at S in May, we both act as if she's not around but nothing said either way.

The scene: H trying to find a time to see me, wants to see me sooooooo badly in the moment today while texting me from work, then realizes he already has "plans" for tonight..... Me, getting a little perturbed at the thought of being squeezed into his many many ow bookings....wanted H to hear I may not be standing forever. (I'm not quitting, but I used the opportunity to plant seeds.)

He's not even al dente cooked.... Seared, maybe.

Here's the convo:

H. How about tomorrow? Saturday I am going on a fishing trip with (work vendor). It might be Monday if not tomorrow or today

M. I'll see how tomorrow goes

H. Ok. You busy tomorrow?

M. I did have plans but I'll think about it

H. Hot date?
Nevermind it's ok
Not my business

M. What about after your dinner with dad tonight?

H. I don't know how long I will be so it is hard to plan
It's ok if you have plans.

M. I don't tonight just tomorrow night....

H. I got that

M. If you happen to get done with your dinner early, lmk?

H. Tomorrow is important?

M. No
Debating

H. You said you had plans. I figured it was a date or something good for you

M. It's social yes
Getting out is good
Right?

H. Dating thing?

M. No I'm not dating

H. I know you arnt but usually social involves guys and dating potential... I shouldn't be asking
Sorry

M. You are right. There are definitely guys. There is dating potential. But, I don't want that now by choice.

H. Then why go?
Nevermind
Sorry
I'll stop

M. lol it's ok
I go because I have fun:).

H. Ok

M. Or I don't go if I don't feel like it idk
I'm not going to sit home alone every night right?

H. Can I ask what?

M. Ask what?
Oh what I'm doing?

H. Yes

M. There is a group going out and meeting tomorrow after work for dinner and then hang out at a house after.

H. Ok your being ambiguous and that is okay.

M. It isn't super important

H. I get it
You should go

M. I'm considering blowing it off but idk
I mean I like getting out and being social and not sitting around. But I also don't like that being nice and smiling and talking gives off an impression that I'm interested so it gets discouraging sometimes
Not that it matters to you
It's not the evening that's important. It's just trying to get out and have a life

H. It sounds like a dating thing

M. It's not a dating thing

H. Social meeting thing

M. Not for me
It's just a group
Not a hookup group

H. It's ok really

M. I'm not interested in dating anyone. Zero.
I do like the attention. But that's just superficial anyway
It's not what I want.

H. It must be important. So there is more to it. But that is ok. Not judging you. We can plan on Monday

M. Tomorrow is not more important than being with you, for sure.
There isn't more to it.... other than the fact that I realize you don't want a relationship right now, and I have to accept that because that's what you need. I truly want you happy.
I'm just trying to get out and make a life for myself.

H. It's ok if that makes you happy then you should do it.

M. It doesn't make me happy. Thats not where real happiness comes from, going out.

H. Then why go? I'm confused

M. I can easily not go and cancel. I would do that for you if you wanted me to spend the evening with you. You are most important and you always will be to me.
I just feel like, in a way, I would be canceling people that want me there to be with someone who doesn't want me...
Am I not correct?

H. I am very much enjoying my time with you.
I am confused tho. It sounds like a group dating social thing. People want you there. You enjoy the attention. You say it doesn't make you happy. You must be getting something out of it if you feel compelled to go. I can't tell you what to do. And I have no right. It just sounds like there is more to it. Is it a sex thing?

M. I'm sorry it's confusing. The biggest thing I'm getting is the confidence that I know I can have a life, and I will be ok whether I'm single or not.
Again, I completely accept and respect your need for space away right now.
But I don't want to be single and I won't be forever. That being said, I am nowhere near wanting anyone else. Not even close.
Yes, the attention is nice. But it doesn't fulfill me. Even if it was just sex, it wouldn't be fulfilling, no matter how good in the moment. Without love and intimacy it would be empty.
Besides, I don't want sex with anyone else. That's just my choice right now.

H. So it is a social dating thing?

M. It is not a social dating thing, no.

H. I feel like I am pulling teeth lol. Clearly you don't want to give detail.s it's ok I won't ask and it's none of my business. I'm sorry I was digging.

M. It's ok, really:).
All you would have to do is say, "Shining, I want you to cancel your plans and spend Friday with me"
...and it's done. No teeth pulling necessary, lol.

H. The pulling teeth was finding out what the group was.

M. Oh... I'm sorry. I misunderstood.

H. Shining, will you cancel your Friday plans and spend the whole evening with me?

M. DONE.
Gladly.
Excitedly!
Yes, thank you:).

H. :-)

M. Me too. (-:

[Takevowsserious]

Hi Shining ~

Here's maybe how the convo could have gone:

H. How about tomorrow? Saturday I am going on a fishing trip with (work vendor). It might be Monday if not tomorrow or today

You : I have plans tomorrow, let's try for Monday.

H. Hot date?
Nevermind it's ok
Not my business

You: I have plans with some friends. Let me know if you want to get together Monday. Gotta go, ttyl

The round and round is exhausting, isn't it? You really don't owe him an explanation of your plans, and you certainly aren't obligated to cancel your plans to suit him. If he wanted to see you so badly, he could have cancelled HIS plans.

Think about it this way... Even if you were to reconcile somewhere down the line, you need to be in a good place, have a social life outside of him and your marriage.

[Shining]

Thank you, TVS, lol.... After seeing how long we spent on this thing, you have a very good point! It is exhausting. I will try and cut it shorter going forward. I'm learning (apparently the hard way, but, meh, nothing better to do at the time).

In the spirit of wanting H to stew in the "thought" of me potentially seeing other guys, I suppose, I allowed it to continue far longer than necessary.

I didn't actually have plans at all....Only an invitation to a "goodbye" happy hour for the summer interns.... (that I wasn't going to attend anyway)...so I pretty much fibbed on that this time around. I wanted H to think I had plans since this was, I think... the first time he asked since BD.

I'm currently very busy with kids, church, and job hunting and have been for the past couple of weeks, but overall I do have a fairly decent social life. All things considered, at least.

My energy is dropping with the stress of job hunting (Hi, Heather.....thank you for being in the same boat, darling!).

I agree, I do need more going on outside of him for sure. Hopefully after new job is found and stable, and and kids are into their school schedules, I can focus more on the fun parts of GAL for real.

[BrightFuture]

This is just hilarious , I was laughing so hard reading your exchange with H. He is so just pathetic. TWS has a good point, but the whole conversation was worth it this time. It does show how badly he wants to know of your are dating or not. And you did manage to get a couple of points across, like you will be moving on with your life.

I would not do this again though.

[Shining]

Thanks, BF, I KNOW!!!!! Omg it was comical...especially, "is it a sex thing"??? -__-

There were so many really good comebacks and responses in my head that I had to hold back.... Omg.

I won't do this again. I don't need to anymore....curiosity satisfied. This was one of the longer exchanges we had, so clearly it was bothering him. And that was fine with me that he was bothered.

If this conversation was a drinking game, and people had to do a shot every time he said, "dating", they'd be HAMMERED!!!

Side note: Lies....LIES, I SAY!!!
1. There isn't a real fishing trip.
2. I happen to know H dad is out of town....
3. Ow car was in front of house tonight (not snooping, we live down the street). I knew this going in and didn't care. H had me over the last 2 nights, so I'm guessing ow was getting a bit suspicious....LOL. And tomorrow..... She has to be wondering why he's suddenly not accessible. It's just funny. And I want him less now than ever....and he's kinda bugging me. A lot.

H saw my bra strap (new bra, new color) a couple of nights ago. I could tell he was noticing and he actually did comment....."oh, THAT's new". (Not to mention I have lost 4 sizes of clothing, I may actually need a new bra....). A few comments about the fact that I never did blah blah blah when we were together etc....(even tho I did, he's rewriting history).

So yesterday H had on the UGLIEST floral shirt that he never would have worn before. Omg it was the color of vomit and not good for his skin tone.... He hasn't pierced anything I can see so far, and no noticeable tats yet.... New glasses. Hair is much darker. Tanning booth a lot but last time he looked like he had spray tanned....orange. It's so sad because H is a really really sexy handsome guy and I loved his thick salt-and-pepper curly head of hair..... Now it's super short and almost black.

The time I see H isn't romantic at all. Not even sexy. We hug, snuggle, smooch a little but I usually pull away first because it kind of bothers me. I can't explain exactly.

He talks nonstop.....he used to be a quiet guy. He talks about himself and brags. He used to be so humble and shy. Ick. That and I know he's lying to me all the time. Like everything. He must think of things to say to keep talking and just make stuff up.

He is not himself. It's difficult being around him, but it's helping me understand, and be able to drop the rope if/when the time comes. I have a sense that I will need to detach more after the house is sold and closed, and if he does move into his own place. Lots of decisions to make at that point. I don't want to be married to a single guy.

In fact I don't want this guy at all. I'm paving and detaching in hopes that real H is under there and listening. If we never have a marriage relationship again, I still want to at the very least, be his friend through this from the side. I am concerned about his previous suicide attempt. I can't stop him if he ultimately decided to do this again, but I can show compassion and friendship. And non-judgment. <<<<<THAT one is a hard 180 for me.

He was a good man to us for many years. Until he wasn't.

Praying lots! Uffda.

[beatrice]

He talks nonstop.....he used to be a quiet guy. He talks about himself and brags. He used to be so humble and shy. Ick. That and I know he's lying to me all the time. Like everything. He must think of things to say to keep talking and just make stuff up.

Are you sure you want to spend Friday evening with this guy?? Just wondering . . .