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A Message from Michele
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Ok here we go #2456779
06/02/14 09:45 AM
06/02/14 09:45 AM
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Posts: 88
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Cw_wc Offline OP
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Cw_wc  Offline OP
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I'm new,
No real idea who will see this but here we go ( I looked at the abbreviations but I'm winging it)
I thought I'd give my story but I think I'll give the "Coles notes"

Married 19 yrs, separated 2
When we were first married my w was a fun energetic woman. But very quickly into our marriage things started to change. After our son was born and I was hired at a ver good job it was decided that she would stay home. I would work. At the time she had just decided that we should move and 1.5 hrs away from the city to the country because she needed the space . Let me be clear that throughout our marriage this occurred a lot. W made all the decisions. Only because if she didn't get her way she would argue and push and fight and finally withdraw any support should my choice fail. It made daily life kinda miserable and I learned very quickly to let her have her way.

W stayed at home while I commuted and worked. In her mind stay at home meant watching our son. Not doing the laundry cleaning the house of preparing dinners. At least not on a regular basis. Nod eventually it didn't mean watching our son with. As soon as he was old enough off he went to daycare 3 days a week. She need a "little down". When our D came along several years later and the same pattern was applied. W took on part time jobs. And even though my check went into the joint account and paid bills, hers did not. Even today I still never know how much she makes when she is working because she has refused my requests to have her checks deposited in the joint account.
So this continues for years, kids in school w doing little around the house except sleeping and reading and enjoying her friends, but she always had time to make a honeydo list for the weekends whew!
7 years ago started the 5 year stretch without sex. Yes 5 years!!! I couldn't take it. She did something she did frequently, she went through my phone and saw I had written get rid of wife as one of my goals. She confronted me( she always confronted me when she went through my phone of opened my mail). And I finally had the guts to say yes. I want out. Since then it has been an up and down roller coast. I don't love her anymore. She cannot seem to get this. She says she's changed and now she realizes I was the problem all the time!!!

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cw_wc] #2457050
06/03/14 09:00 AM
06/03/14 09:00 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,010
NY
Cadet Offline

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Cadet  Offline

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Posts: 13,010
NY
Welcome to the board

Get out and GAL.

DETACH.

Believe none of what she says and half of what she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

You are on moderation right now on the forum.
SO post in small frequent posts until you get off of it.

Your W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.

USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-65, D32,S31
Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cw_wc] #2457051
06/03/14 09:01 AM
06/03/14 09:01 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,010
NY
Cadet Offline

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Cadet  Offline

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Posts: 13,010
NY
Do you want to be married or divorced?


Me-65, D32,S31
Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cadet] #2457133
06/03/14 04:45 PM
06/03/14 04:45 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 88
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Cw_wc Offline OP
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Cw_wc  Offline OP
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Posts: 88
Divorced

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cadet] #2457134
06/03/14 04:52 PM
06/03/14 04:52 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 88
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Cw_wc Offline OP
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Cw_wc  Offline OP
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Thanks cadet,
I have spent the better part of life fighting depression. I have learned coping skills. Some good some bad. But I'm still here even though I've walked some dark places with myself. W knew this. But saw my actions and occasional behavior as a weakness. She considers herself a strong person.

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cadet] #2457161
06/03/14 06:19 PM
06/03/14 06:19 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 88
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Cw_wc Offline OP
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Cw_wc  Offline OP
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W loves to read everything. Once she does she is an instant expert. After a few ic sessions she's cured. On a path. A better person. A strong person. I however am broken and weak. Everything must be my fault. But she still "loves" and wants to work on marriage. This after receiving a panicked email about how will she live how will she earn a living??? Maybe she could use the masters I paid for. Is it me? Am I being too harsh or does it sound a lot like she might love the paycheck more??
Thoughts?

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cadet] #2457251
06/04/14 12:49 AM
06/04/14 12:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 88
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Cw_wc Offline OP
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Cw_wc  Offline OP
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Posts: 88
Thanks for the response cadet.
W and I are firmly going to divorce. Whew! It's over! I still need to address the children. Working and living away from our house has put a little distance between s18 and d15. But we have started to rebuild. I'm glad I stayed long enough to get them to this age. W feels she was the long stable factor in their lives but recently they have both voice some real concerns. S " tunes her out" because she treats him like a 5 year old and d can't make a choice unless she thinks w will approve. Both need time and space. So now the work begins. W still has all her old habits but has happily masked them behind a new and righteous facade. Oh boy this should be fun...I'll let you know

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cw_wc] #2457707
06/05/14 04:36 PM
06/05/14 04:36 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,010
NY
Cadet Offline

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Cadet  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,010
NY
Originally Posted By: Cw_wc
Divorced


OK but remember this is DIVORCE BUSTING website.

We are here to save marriages not destroy them.

I am sure there are lots of people that understand divorce too.
Probably myself included.

Keep posting or asking questions.


Me-65, D32,S31
Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cw_wc] #2458036
06/06/14 02:45 PM
06/06/14 02:45 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,244
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Mach1 Offline
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Mach1  Offline
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From your response to Cadet, it seems that you have your mind made up already, so I doubt that I will influence you at all, and I am okay with that.

It is also highly unlikely that you will find much support with your current stance on your marriage.

Many people here are fighting with every ounce of energy that they have, to be in a position of their spouse willing to work through their problems, and let their marriage become disposable...


Originally Posted By: Cw_wc

Married 19 yrs, separated 2
When we were first married my w was a fun energetic woman. But very quickly into our marriage things started to change. After our son was born and I was hired at a ver good job it was decided that she would stay home. I would work. At the time she had just decided that we should move and 1.5 hrs away from the city to the country because she needed the space . Let me be clear that throughout our marriage this occurred a lot. W made all the decisions. Only because if she didn't get her way she would argue and push and fight and finally withdraw any support should my choice fail. It made daily life kinda miserable and I learned very quickly to let her have her way.


Why did she make decisions ?

Because she was in the moment and life more than you, with the hours and energy that you put into working ??

Was working more important than being in that moment with her ??

Very good job, to a Man = a LOT of time away from the home. You worked, and the more that you worked, the more obligation that you felt to the house, and the more obligation that you felt, the more entitled that you became, and the more entitled that you became, the more resentment you built, due to unmet, unspoken expectations...

You did have a say, and an opinion, you just "chose" not to voice it.

You are not a victim of her choices, you are only a victim of your own choices...


Originally Posted By: Cw_wc

W stayed at home while I commuted and worked. In her mind stay at home meant watching our son. Not doing the laundry cleaning the house of preparing dinners. At least not on a regular basis. Nod eventually it didn't mean watching our son with. As soon as he was old enough off he went to daycare 3 days a week. She need a "little down". When our D came along several years later and the same pattern was applied. W took on part time jobs.


Wow, that is a LOT of resentment in those words....

So let me ask you this...

2 young children in the house...

Who do you think was caring for them while you were at work all day ???

Who was changing diapers, feeding, chasing around the house, Doctors appointments, pre-school, field trips, birthday parties, and the list goes on and on ??

Now, YOU may have been at working providing a stable financial life, yet being a full time Mother is just as exhausting, probably more exhausting than the relief that the working partner gets at their job...

I cannot tip my hat far enough, for what a SAHM does during her day. I didn't always get it either....

Did you ever once, stop living within your own head, long enough to be empathetic to her day ??

Did you ever try to listen to what her day consisted of ???

Her trials and tribulations through out raising YOUR children ???

How old was he when he went to Daycare ???



Originally Posted By: Cw_wc

7 years ago started the 5 year stretch without sex. Yes 5 years!!! I couldn't take it. She did something she did frequently, she went through my phone and saw I had written get rid of wife as one of my goals. She confronted me( she always confronted me when she went through my phone of opened my mail). And I finally had the guts to say yes. I want out. Since then it has been an up and down roller coast. I don't love her anymore. She cannot seem to get this. She says she's changed and now she realizes I was the problem all the time!!!


You really should educate yourself on what drives the passion within a Woman...

Men have a very strong tendency to withdraw emotionally from a relationship when they are faced with OUR daily struggles of life...

Women withdraw from meeting a Man's physical needs, when the emotional part is not fulfilled...

Rough day at work ?

Who do we tend to unleash that on..

Bad commute ???

Who hears about that...

Some jerk at the office ???

Who hears our vent about that..

Yea, and when do we find the time to fuel our partners emotional fire ????

Men fuel their fire through the physical side of the relationship, women fuel their passion through the emotional side...

I would assume that the lack of sex was an EQUAL part of the routine...

You didn't feed the emotion, she didn't feed the physical...

And typically, when there is the lack of feeding those key elements, there is an outside reason when Men give up trying...hence her searching through your phone.

Was it the right thing to do ???

Probably not, and I do understand your resentment...

Although, if you are honest, she DID have good reason to be suspicious now didn't she ???


Look,it is real easy to sit back and find blame for one person during the demise of a relationship, and it is a lot easier to blame our spouse for our own deficiencies...

You sound angry, you sound entitled, and a little arrogant about how much that YOU gave to the Marriage. And I really hope that you are willing to take a look at YOUR role in the failure of your Marriage....because I am pretty sure, that SHE gave just as much, you just choose to not see it....

From what I read here, the mis-communication ran wild throughout your relationship. A lot of assuming on both parts, and the eventual punishing of each other though words AND actions. And I do not see you owning any of your part.



You said that you want to be Divorced...

So what exactly would you like to take from posting HERE ???

You will get help here, just maybe the not the help that you are expecting...

With your words, this becomes about healing you....

If you read this, and choose NOT to continue, then I wish you luck in your next relationship....

Re: Ok here we go [Re: Cadet] #2458053
06/06/14 03:10 PM
06/06/14 03:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,132
CT/USA
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ericmsant2 Offline
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Cw_wc

Something about your post stood out to me...

"Ownership" is the word that comes to mind. I see a lot of the old me in your posts. A lot of blaming your W for the demise of the M. IMO, it take TWO to make and break an M. Since you have NO control over HER…why not take the energy and frustration that is apparent in your post and apply it to making yourself become the best man possible.

Here is what I see in your posts…

Originally Posted By: Cw_wc
No real idea who will see this but here we go ( I looked at the abbreviations but I'm winging it)
I thought I'd give my story but I think I'll give the "Coles notes"

First you are posting on a public forum so trust me some one is going to see it. I find the way you wrote this to be a little condescending. Most of time people come here and are in pain and looking for answers to their problems. You seem to already have the answer i.e. you want to get a divorce. Personally, I have a funny feeling that although this is how you “feel” or rather this is what you “feel” you want, that deep down inside you are not sure. That is just my hunch.

Your first post is all about bashing your W. It comes across as if you had no issues in the M. As if you were perfect and she was a total wreck. I doubt that was the case. I suspect that somewhere in the middle is the truth. In other words, you f’ed up and she did too, which is normal dude. It happens. The key though…imo, is to ‘own” your chit and allow her to “own” hers. Here let me show you what I mean….


Quote:
When we were first married my w was a fun energetic woman. But very quickly into our marriage things started to change.

If you look at this comment ^^^^…here is what I see.

1) YOU blame her for her loose of “fun and energy”. Have you consider that maybe she was upset with some of the things that you were doing? That maybe she did not know how to communicate how she was feeling to you and so she began to shut down? So CW_wc……. What type of chit did you do in the M. Were you the typical dude that just worked, paid the bills, spent time with the kids BUT NEVER really listened, understood or validated your W? FTR, I was that guy. My point is where do YOU feel your shortcomings were?
2) “Very quickly things started to change”. Ummm….now you sound like a victim. So things changed “quickly” but you stuck it out for 20 years. Let me ask you a question is that HER fault that YOU stuck it out as long as you did or is it YOUR (psstt….unless she was packing a pistol and had it to your head I think you know the answer). So if you can step back from your anger for a bit and take a look at what you wrote you may see what I see.

In keeping with my…thought on how your post seem to blame her for everything…..

Quote:
After our son was born and I was hired at a very good job it was decided that she would stay home.

“it was decided”. Okay, was it a joint decision or did you or her decide? Now if you tell me that she TOLD you that she was staying home, then my response is….. did you feel that You needed to agree? If so, why? Did you not feel like you could stand your ground? If so, then whos’s fault is that – hers or yours? (Psstt…… FTR, we control OUR lives – no one else).

Quote:
After our son was born and I was hired at a ver good job it was decided that she would stay home. I would work. At the time she had just decided that we should move and 1.5 hrs away from the city to the country because she needed the space .

Man…this really reminds me of my old self.

“I worked” – Okay, I get that, what else did you do? Did you stop romancing her, did you stop doing the things that may her fall in love with you to begin with, did you stop have porn star sex with her, where you so preoccupied with your “very good job”…that you left her off to side to stay home and take care of the kid? Look man, I am not trying to bash you …I just want you to consider her perspective and what SHE may have been feeling.

You say she wanted to move 1.5 hours away. Did you have to move? Did she force you? Have you considered the following….

1) Was a cheaper to move 1.5 hours away? Were you able to get more house for the money, or bigger space?
2) Was it a better move for the kids? Would it keep them grounded and healthy?

What I see in your post about the move….is almost like you are painting her as wanting to move just to piss you off or just because she wanted to be alone. Somehow I doubt that. Somehow I feel like she did it more so for the kids. Maybe a better school district….maybe because society teaches us (at least if you are 44 like myself) that “man works and takes care of the family and women stay home and raise kids”…..maybe dude, she wanted to raise the kids. Nothing wrong with that imo. The only issue I see so far is that maybe NEITHER of YOU knew how to communicate to each other.

Let’s keep looking at your post…..

Quote:
Let me be clear that throughout our marriage this occurred a lot. W made all the decisions.

Okay….this is YOU playing the victim again. I wonder how tall are you? Is your W bigger than you? Was she a bully? Did she scare you?

Really dude, take a look at what you wrote. She was a bully or you were a whimp. One of the two. Bottom line….one of the things that I learned here was that women really want a man to lead. They really want a man to lead the “right way” though. They want to be “heard”…the want to be “validated”…that want to be “wanted”…

So Cw_Wc….did you do that to your W or did she just bully you?


Quote:
Only because if she didn't get her way she would argue and push and fight and finally withdraw any support should my choice fail. It made daily life kinda miserable and I learned very quickly to let her have her way.

Once again….you are putting all of the blame on her. Poor old CW…his W was bully. She would argue with him and “not support him”….and because of that CW life was “miserable”.

Dude, own your feeling and YOUR choices.

If you felt miserable…did you consider therapy, did you consider have some porn star sex with her (trust me it helps), did you try other things? You gave into to her (assuming she argued) – own it – stop blaming her.

As I mentioned above, women want men to lead. So what if she did not “support you”. For example…if you felt that opening a business was the right move and she disagreed, did you guys sit down and talk about what it would be that she “needed” to feel better about YOUR choices?

Quote:
W stayed at home while I commuted and worked. In her mind stay at home meant watching our son. Not doing the laundry cleaning the house of preparing dinners. At least not on a regular basis.

Remember what I was saying earlier…about “man vs women roles”….this comment ^^^ screams it.

Read it…

“W stayed at home while I commuted and worked” – Notice you said you worked, which implies that she does not. Notice that you stressed how she stayed home and you commuted, which implies that you had it harder than her. Notice it is subtle way to bash her and minimize her role. Can you see how maybe she felt minimized? Part of that IMO, is her fault and on her – part of it is how you probably came across.

Notice how you point out her role was to cook and clean….what about YOU dude? You could have cooked or you could have shared some of the responsibility with her.

Please dude…for you sake read your words again…


Quote:
7 years ago started the 5 year stretch without sex. Yes 5 years!!!

First off…I’m wondering….how many jar of lotion did you go through in 5 years – just kidding, it was a joke.

Dude, I am not sure what to say on this one….the only thing I would say is this……

I have not met a women…who if you….

Validate

Take care of

Show they matter

Make sure that sex is NOT one sided

Show them how to lead

Respect them

Have fun with them

And Pursue them


Would not have sex with their partner.




So CW…why is it that you think she did not have sex with you?

OH…and based on your update….you were married for 20 years….so let me get this straight….

Your W stood with you for 20 years

Dealt with what I would say is a minimizing husband

Had 2 kids

Gave up a career

And stood with you for 5 years while never give you sex….

Because…..?

Dude, you had a role in this.

You want a divorce – fine go get one. Here is the thing though……

IMO, unless you start looking at your role in this, you will have the same chit happen…with just a different women.

So my advice is take a look inside dude….take a look hard look inside. You may not like what you see….and it will be hard to change…but when YOU do….

Ohhh…it is so worth it.


"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter".
"Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!"
"Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
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