Deciding What to Do.....

[MyNewStrength]

Thank you jFred.

[25yearsmlc]

MSN

This is not meant as a 2 x 4 but may sound like it at first. Bear with me.

Your long post had some conflicting but mostly "stuck" unproductive approaches in it.

You speak a lot about what is fair and unfair and see yourself as a victim. I get that but it's NOT helpful. And when you take charge of your life you will stop being a victim. it's actually totally up to YOU, not your h.

You took him back after an affair...and so what? I mean, when my h and I reconciled, subconsciously I felt he 'owed' me.

After all, look at WHAT I FORGAVE!!

But that is NOT how your h sees it and in truth it's not even that accurate.

You reconciled b/c YOU wanted to. And you probably did not require new behavior or tools from either one of you.

You probably assumed since you saw yourself as being heroic, He would too, and he'd owe you and HE would change, and all would be well.

Didn't happen of course. You did not get the tools you are NOW seeking and that's a real tragedy. I suspect you did not change and apparently neither did he.

Still I really commend you for having a DB coach.

I just think after an affair and a reconciliation, no matter how poorly executed that recon, it's exponentially harder to DB successfully.

NOT HOPELESS, but a lot harder.

Try not to wallow too much in the "injustice of it all" b/c in the grand scheme of things, I hate to say this, b/c I know you are in a lot of pain, but your h left you. And so what? I mean, you CAN get out of this pain. You CAN get past this.

He left you before and he's done it again. It's a lousy thing to do, But This is NOT brain cancer.

It's not rape or murder or starvation or denying you the right to worship, or vote or drive or have a job, and you can go to a hospital and get seen, etc. Your standard of living just by being in America, even if you are on welfare,

is better than 90% of women in the world. SOAK THAT FACT IN and be a little bit grateful that thru no act of your own, you were given freedoms and wealth most women do not have.

And your h isn't even being that much of a jerk in his eyes. I mean, in fairness to him, given that HE BELIEVES it's pointless to discuss the m, he's being 'reasonable" although to you it feels cold and final.

At least he's not flaunting his "newfound REAL happiness" in your face. You'd be surprised what we see around here.

But you are right about how much of this happens in our world.
We have a lot of walking wounded.

I'm always curous about my surgeon or doctor doing a procedure on me. Like I want to ask them "is everything OK at home??" B/C I don't know how they get thru their days.

So the self pity beyond a certain point

is self defeating and unproductive. It keeps you stuck there.

(And as you know, it's NOT appealing or attractive to anyone, so it hurts your social life at just the time you need an increase in it. Be alone LESS, not more. Don't isolate or get into a rut).

Learn how to set boundaries and how to keep them (on yourself as well) and that one big lesson will help you in your future. A lot...

and for now, let him go.

What choice to do you really have?

Plead/argue with him, which embarasses you AND pushes him away

or behave with dignity and grace, despite his terrible choices?


When you see this^^ clearly, other "Complications" won't be so complicated after all.

Get thru this hour, then this evening and then this week...and in TIME

you will feel better.

We don't know or control or affect HIM,

so we need to keep the focus exclusively solely ALL ON YOU.

What are your GAL activities?

Seriously...what are they? I can't recall one. You need them. WE HAMMER IT FOR A REASON--IT WORKS

Hang in there and good luck!

[AnotherStander]

I'm always curous about my surgeon or doctor doing a procedure on me. Like I want to ask them "is everything OK at home??"

Oh great 25, I never even thought of that but now that you've said it, if I ever have to go through surgury I'm going to be thinking "gee, I hope they didn't just go through BD" LOL!

[MyNewStrength]

25 - I sincerely appreciate the light 2x4.

Yes, it is true, I feel stuck. The enormity of the pressure is more profound that ever before. I am trying to recover from yet another betrayal. I am embarrassed and ashamed. I don't talk with anyone because I ashamed that this has happened again and that I still love this man.

I know I have not posted a response to you in a few days, but I needed to read and re-read your post several times and truly thought about its application to my situation.

I BELIEVED that he was truly remorseful and committed to recharging our marriage and relationship. It was false, I realize that now. However, it is too late, too far gone (in the steps he has taken this time around) for him to ever re-consider the path to divorce.

Maybe it is that realization that is forcing this extreme pain. I cannot sleep...still. I cannot eat. I go to work, come home and TRY to sleep. I still have my IC that I see, but it is just all talk. I have my ADs, but they don't work even after upping the dosage from 50 mg to 150 mg. I pray everyday.

I have tried to focus on GALng activities. I even signed up an attended an introduction class to Crossfit. It was a good experience, but it left me sore. I am going again on Saturday (so at least I am beginning to get out of the house on weekends). I recently joined a reading group that will meet in 2 weeks. I started looking for a place to live permanently, although that usually brings me to tears.

I am sorry if it feels like a pity party, but I am trying to pull myself up from the broken strings of my life. I thank you for your direct words.

I want to be okay, but is it wrong to want my marriage?

[25yearsmlc]

Gosh No it's not wrong to want your m.


But IF, and I repeat, IF,

if your analysis is accurate

and if he's really "done", plus or he has gone too far for you to imagine another reconciliation,

then I'd say it's not a very healthy thing to keep wanting what you know is not going to be yours AND OR is not going to be good for you.

Bottom line is that I believe where the head goes, the heart will follow,

if we let it.

If you KNOW this man is a serial cheater, (well he was with you and that is all that matters).

Don't wallow in whether he'd have been faithful if only you were worthy, b/c that's NOT how it is.

I posit that HE would not have come back the first time, OR married you, if you were not worthy, AND maybe HE IS JUST REALLY FLAWED and looks for external change to fix what is missing in Him...

and if so, how long do you want to spend time feeling so badly about choices HE has made that have nothing much to do with You?

You're literally letting someone else dictate how YOU feel in a given hour on a given day...and he's not there, he could be miles away.

That's no way to live MSN.

Let your head talk to your heart and GAL a lot more. You have to JOIN, VOLUNTEER or ATTEND New groups and things...this month. Volunteer over Thanksgsiving weekend. Do you have extended family or nieces or nephews. Do both of you have no children? Anyhow,

Here are some of the things I did when I was fighting some depression and a stressful marital challenge
AND had a newborn baby (and 2 other kids)
AND I was living in the interior of Alaska...

I worked out and got in shape and I really looked my best

(Since I had a newborn, I scheduled with our older kids to help, or used the gym that had daycare)

I joined a writer's group. There, I mMet some smart people who had interesting things to say and cool ways of saying them.

I used a tanning booth (B/c even though skin cancer risks were bad, it was still better than blowing my brains out...if you take my point) It FELT like an anti depressant.

I saw a therapist, and in the winter I took some anti-depressants.


I volunteered at a woman's shelter. I helped people, they were grateful and I felt glad to be in my own life. Felt empowered.


I took a Conversational French class and later, studied Italian cooking class.

I also did stand up comedy there (they needed to laugh!)

I auditioned for local community theater roles. Met super fun people.

I learned to cross country ski, and went deep sea fishing and yes I hunted some big game too. Did a lot of target shooting too.

Joined the Bd of Director's for Alaskan Wrestling, as our son wrestled and it was a good way to meet other parents and support the team.

I learned to fly a plane, and I got my pilot's license AND I went skydiving. (Thaese two things were the ONLY GAL activities that costs much.
The symbolism of skydiving was crucial for ME, internally and spiritually).

I edited a hunting book. Jobs were scarce, I could do it from home. Turned out to be a best seller in its genre.

I volunteered at the kids' schools for PTA and field trips when possible.

I coached a girls softball team, twice.


I studied pottery class (Very unlike me).

I painted a few colorful paintings to get some color on our WHITE walls (with the snow outside the landscape often looked like black and white film).

I finally joined the Officer's Wives Club (I had resisted that for out-dated reasons). I'd been a fool for delaying.

I made two LIFE LONG friends there, and without those women, I am not sure I'd have made it through 3 winters there.

I'd visit a sunny area each January and get my sunshine fix.

I learned to snow mobile nearly every day in the winter, so I'd be outside.



In sum, I forced myself to MEET NEW PEOPLE, LEARN NEW THINGS,
GO TO NEW DIFFERENT places...and Do new things, discovered things about myself, like that I'm versatile and outgoing and I like me.

MSN, you're upset of course. But instead of feeling shame, let that be HIS and you instead can be proud that you trusted and forgave, and now you learned that you don't have to work on that anymore for now. He's not even asking you to.

For me, and I suspect you, INERTIA was the greatest obstacle.

I did not EVER regret getting out of the house for one of these GAL activities but yet I seemed to want to make excuses a lot not to. Don't surrended to the excuses to hide from the world.

That's inertia and depression and surrendering and getting/staying in a rut.

Recognize that for what it is, and OVERCOME it.
YOU CAN and YOU MUST.

[MyNewStrength]

25yearmlc -

I hope you know that YOUR posts really speak to me the most. I really don't know where my H is relative to his "being done." My feelings are based on what he has TOLD me. He really believes he is done. I am suppose to ignore that?

I know that I have been wallowing in my depression and circumstances. I do understand that it is not helping me to feel this way, and sometimes I forget because of the pain that I still feel. Even during my session today with my IC, I was negative about my life. I have been looking at my life (and not just my married life), and while some may say that I have survived a lot, I still feel like I have a tag on my back that screams "I am NOT deserving".

Full disclosure - I was sexually abused by my mother's husband, molested by mother's father, my biological father and his family denied my existence, and my Husband has left me not once, but this is the third time. I cannot have children after having a miscarriage. I think about all of this and I am discouraged, and sometimes blame God, but I still thank God every day.

Right now, I only have peace when I pray to God and believe that my prayer was heard. I am lost when I cannot hear God....which has been often. So I start to wonder if he is interested in my pain and suffering?

I know.. that is nonsense, but I don't feel leveled in my thinking. I am getting there, but I have a long road.

You were a warrior when it came to GALing and I am hoping to push through and dedicate myself to doing things that I have not had an opportunity to do. I am slowly getting out of the house. But I guess I have held myself back because I am thinking that if I start doing things to make me happy that I will lose interest in saving my marriage or that my H will see that as me not being interested in a reconciliation if expresses interest.

STUPID right!!!! I know... slap me with a 2x4.

See I do understand I know what I should be doing. It is just hard to let go, but as you said "Don't surrender to the excuses to hide from the world."

Thank you so much for your words - they mean so very much to me.

[Mimi00]

I'm so sorry for all of your pain that you have been through now and previously in your life. We are all here b/c we are suffering great pain right now... for some of us this D process may be the worst pain we've ever experienced....for others this is just another notch on their "belt of pain".

I was raised to love and trust in God and to ALWAYS do the RIGHT thing when it came to others no matter what. And I am screaming at God for this trial in my life after so many suffering experiences in the past. And I know we all have past experiences.

I like you questioned God when my H BD.
I grew up in church, I always put others before myself, I always live in a way that represents Christ no matter where I go or who I am with (I have never said a curse word, I have never drank alcohol, I have never smoked, I waited until marriage to have sex). I've tried to be perfect through out my life....and have been pretty successful at that. So I asked, why God would you put me through this pain???

When my H and I first began getting to know each other I prayed that God take him away if he was not for me, to show me some red flags b/c I really liked him but if he wasn't want God wanted for me, I did not want him, so please take him away before anything serious.........clearly he wasn't taken away from me. Instead our courtship was perfect.....but now he leaves me?????????? WHY GOD? What did I do??? There are others I know who did not honor you with their lives the way I have and their marriages are still together!!!! WHY ME?????

Then one day I woke up and asked my self, who am I that I don't deserve "pain" in my life?

What makes me any better than anyone in this world who is suffering pain, pain wayyyy worst than this D process is paining me? Nothing.

Nothing makes me any better that anyone else here on this forum, nor any one in this world suffering death, sickness, illnesses, hunger.

God never promised only sunshine and rainbows in life.
If all we had was good, we would never learn and grow.
Every one has suffering in their lives, unfortunately some more than others...and some people haven't done anything to deserve it (especially innocent babies)....unfortunately we are here on Earth, and this is life, life includes ups and downs, pains and celebrations, we are here to navigate through it all in the best way we can....and that is my conclusion.

I'm not Bible scholar, but IMO, the difference between those who choose not believe in God in crisis and those who do..... is that the ones who do are able to overcome their pain with peace, grace, less stress, strength and mental stability that only God can provide.

We praise God for the good times, so how are we to react in the bad times? Blaming Him? Hating Him? Asking Him WHYYY????

No we are to continue to praise Him because in the good times He is God and in the bad times, guess what? He is still that same God from the good times.

Why when I have ALWAYS done right by my husband, my mom, my sisters, niece, and nephews.

I said this like this at first, that I've always been amazing to my H and family....but then I was honest with my self. No I haven't. Sometimes they irritate me, some times I react in my emotions instead of reacting in a way that God would be proud of and I make snarky remarks etc....

Maybe in your life you have been a 100% perfect person to everyone in your life and you have nothing that needs to change...if you have, kudos to you. But if not, I suggest you really take a good look at your self and if there is some truth to see, own it...it will be a growth moment for you to leave behind the idea that you have been nothing but awesome to everyone in every way.

We (my husband and I) bought a small house for my mother after she recovered from brain cancer, a stroke, and a heart attack 5 years ago and now he saying that we spent all of our money on her. THIS was NEVER an issue before because we made the decision to buy and wanted her to be comfortable.

I'm sorry your husband began to resent helping your mother by purchasing the house.

Unfortunately truth is, sometimes spouses are scared of our reactions, so sometimes they agree to things they really don't want to do and they end up resenting us for it....that resentment builds b/c of a break down in communication.

Divorce is now a marker of achievement. This world is not just.. How and why do the evil, wicked, sinful, and deceitful prosper and are happy? And the wronged are wrought with despair and betrayal? Please don't say that God wants us to be closer to him or that he is making room for something else in our lives, because I have heard that. That theory conflicts with the other teachings from the bible.

What Bible do you read? There are many examples o those who went through suffering, those who were asked to give up something or had things taken from them. One big example is Job.

Have you ever read that book? He lost his means of income, all his children were killed, he was hit with a flesh eating disease..etc..etc..etc.... His wife told him to go ahead and curse God for bringing all of this hurt and pain into his life. What was Jobs response? "You're talking like a godless fool. We accept the good that God gives us. Shouldn't we also accept the bad?"(Job 2:10)

God has turned his face away from me, as have others.

Has He really turned His face from you, or is it you who has run from Him?

My soul and my faith has been rocked recently by all of this because it "I" DID NOT (YOU DID NOT) deserve this? Where is God when there is so much hurt and pain? I was a good daughter, wife, sister, and aunt.

God is right here waiting for you.
Wanting you to hand your pain to Him.
Wanting you to trust him completely with your sitch.

The question is will you continue to blame him and run.
Or will you come to Him and rest?

I assure you when you do, you will begin to have peace that will surpassed all of these things in your sitch that you do not understand.

I say all this to you in love, b/c I experienced the same thoughts and feelings in the weeks following my H's BD.
I spent weeks crying and laying in bed.

Angry.

Angry at myself, angry at my H, angry at God.

It wasn't until I picked my self up (mind you while still angry) and began going to church again and hearing things that began to change my heart back in to the woman I was before I allowed the pain of my sitch to take over.

I am convinced that the goal of Believing and having Faith in God is not to get "good things" out of life or to have the "perfect life" free of sorrow.... the goal is to have complete trust in Him. He watching our reactions to every event. Will we be like a child who only loves our parents when they give us candy, yet hates our parents when we are scolded. Or will we be mature in our faith and decided trust and praise Him even in the middle of our storm?

How you make it through this storm is totally up to you.
God's way is actually not too different from DB. He wants you to live and leave your Husband and your pain in his hands to deal with. The choice is yours.

[MyNewStrength]

Mimi

Thank you for your post. It clarified my thoughts of myself - I have not always been perfect, I have made mistakes, I was not the ideal mate. I get it. So in the last few days - reflection.....lots of it. While it has been a few days since my last post, I am still trying but not succeeding in getting my mind of my situation. I left work early today because I ended up crying for about half hour, for nothing. Not good. Then I came home and called my mom. She was happy to hear from me since it had been about 2 weeks since our last conversation. Then I think I frustrated her because I cried and said something she did not appreciate - that she didn't understand.

Well I got the riot act and it was probably deserved. She told me a story about my baby sister who passed away a few years ago and what my mother went through. My Mom NEVER talked about her feelings and today I got a small insight into her view of pain.

Very grateful and I had to call her back to apologize. The last 2 days were not bad. I had a session with my IC on Saturday and I have another appointment later today which I know I NEED. I pray - but I do wonder if God feels compelled to help me now. I think I know that answer to that - I have not really given my situation over to him for me to find peace.

I guess I am not sure where I should be right now. I know I should start to focus on me, but I am not sure HOW to do that. That is my struggle and so I tend to go between praying, working, crying, to laughing.

I know - get it together......(me telling myself).

But at least the crying is getting far along between episodes, so that is progress right?

[melissag]

MNS, I am so sorry for what you are going through. There are so many people here who know all too well how you feel - this is the best place you can be.

You cannot expect to get it together in one day, MNS. It has only been 6.5 weeks since my BD and I am still on a major roller coaster every day. I am not sure there is a day that has gone by that I have not cried. Sometimes I just get choked up and manage to stuff it down and concentrate on something more positive, but a lot of the time, I cry my eyes out. During those times, I allow myself to cry, but I remind myself that later, I will be feeling much better - this helps me to drop the gloom and doom and hopelessness and accept that it is all part of the process. Grieving and healing are not linear. You will not necessarily feel a little better each day, but you will see an overall trend of healing.

The intellectual understanding of where you need to go is easier than actually doing it. HOW am I supposed to pretend I am happy when I feel awful? HOW am I supposed to go enjoy other activities when all I can think of is how my world is falling apart? The answer is - you just DO IT. The first few times (maybe the first dozen times), yes, you might spend the whole time hating it and being sad. But do it anyway. Keep doing it. Soon you will start to see that you can find joy (and better yet, distraction! Even if for a short time) in things. Do not isolate yourself. Talk to people. When you find that someone is not supportive, do not talk to that person. I am not going to judge your mother, but it sounds like she is not someone who is going to be good for you to talk to. Reach out to friends, acquaintances, family - even people you haven't talked to in years. You will be amazed at who is really there for you.

Please exercise. Do something that is high impact. Run. Take a kickboxing class. Play basketball or tennis. It helps. A LOT. Look at yourself and your shortcomings. Don't beat yourself up about them. Figure out which ones you can and should change, and work on that. Know that you will be a better person. Behave with dignity and know that in time, you will look back at this, and no matter how it turns out, you will be proud of the way you handled it.

Hang in there, and keep posting! You are stronger than you think - you've got this!!

[Mimi00]

I pray - but I do wonder if God feels compelled to help me now.

Faith with out works is dead.

For example: I can't pray for a job then sit at home all day, not fill out any applications and expect a job to just fall in to my lap.

Therenis important work that needs to be done inside you that you have to do.
If you want help you have to first help yourself. You have to be worth it to you.

So if you want to feel better, pray, then act on it.

Push your self out of bed and say "today will be a great day" (even if you feel like crap)
What are your hobbies or what activites make you feel good? do those things.
What are some things you've always wanted to do but never had the time?

I had to listen to positive music in my car b/c listening to the radio certain songs would come on that reminded me of H, then I'd spend the next 10 mins thinking about him and what we could have done better...questioning things then crying the next 5 minutes while driving. I had to stop the cycle. So listening to empowering songs or songs of hope helped me to purposefully change my thoughts.

Also reading books on self improvement that have nothing to do with marriage, listening to church sermons on CD etc...and when my mind starts to drift I immediately try to snap out of it and focus on a positive saying, scripture, or idea.

It took a month straight of actively doing those things and my mental attitude is 97.5% better. I haven't broken down crying in a little over a month...I do sometimes get teary eyed when certain things happen....but I will take that over weeping and beating my self up about this and even my dog goes into the other room b/c he doesn't want to be near me; When the dog is embarrassed for you, you know things have to change lol

I hope this week is better for you.