She was lonely on her own and what you were showing her and the life you led made her realize what she was missing.
Like a kid on Christmas, where the anticipation outweighs the actual experience, she thought "This is it?"
Emotionally, you are right, she is a lot younger, and it seems that she does not want to do the work. Like most of us here at the beginning of our journeys, she assumes love and relationships do not require any effort at all.
All those feelings should just be there. In her words, just by being, everything should fall into place.
She was "being" at her own place and nothing fell into place there either, did it?
25 is right. You are a catch, you are awesome, and I like the two vacay plans.
I always say that you gotta be alright with yourself before you can be alright with anyone else. She has a bit to travel yet.
Just wanted to say Hi, Crim and I've been thinking about you. Sorry things seems to be upside down right now but eh world will right itself again.
I was with a group this weekend and we talked about how difficult it might be to reconcile with someone who hasn't invested in themselves. You and your W are in very different places.
Who knows, maybe seeing what you have has created this dissonance in her and she will try to move toward you. Remember we all start out on this path kicking and screaming.
Don't move toward her.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
Crimson ~ I have nothing to offer but a ((HUG)). I am struggling trying to understand my own sitch so my advice would not be of any help. Sorry, that you are going through this again. Maybe more time & patience will be the answer.
Good luck, wfm
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
Crimson, I feel for you. Man, even in my dire situation, I feel for YOU. That's tough.
I fully agree with 25. I think she needs a wakeup call. It sounds like she is not willing to actually "CHOOSE" how to be. As most of us here know, long term love is more of a choice than a feeling. Now, I am not in a place where I can give advice to you, or to anyone for that matter, but what 25 said really makes sense to me. What 25 says, almost always makes sense to me....as does everything I allow myself to hear on this forum. Sometimes an outside perspective is our only true guide. Please listen to me to when I say; You have done so much work, she would LITERALLY be a fool to leave you. I hope you realize that, Crimson.
Thanks for taking the time to reply, AS. I think that when you are sort of blind-sided you (at least ME anyway) I fall out of DB mode just out of pure shock.
I can understand that, but I think it's because you had (here comes that bad word)... EXPECTATIONS. I think you thought that because she moved back in everything was completely normal again, but to her things are still not normal, and so she feels inclined to act out and that crushed your expectations. So now you're calling it another BD, you have anxiety and probably some depression all over again. But why is that? Have you already become codependent again? I think you have to some extent, and if you have then that may very well be contributing to her fears. It's scaring her off. So again, be the calm, confident, PMA Crimson that you became post-D, that Crimson that she looked back at. Be independent, not codependent. She wants to leave? No problem, because you have your own life now. You will be OK with or without her, remember? Be THAT guy!
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Just a few days ago we were writing down goals of things we would like to to (her request) travel, things around the house, finalizing her move here, and so on. We had even made a goal of going out a socializing with old friends and couples - which we did. Like I said, it wasn't even a week ago. I just don't see how everything turns on a dime like that. My head is spinning.
Those expectations are a beeoch, aren't they? "but she did this, that and the other, that clearly meant she was _____" That's basically what you're saying, and anything you put in that blank spot is an expectation. Drop the expectations. If she comes back then don't expect it to last, don't expect it not to last. Just don't expect anything. Be "Neutral Crimson", no matter what happens you're OK with it. Be the calm in her storm. You're the lighthouse resting on solid rock, she's the stormy seas lashing at the rock, but she can't move you!
Her father hates me and thinks I'm not "right" for her and that all my attempts to save our marriage/family were about me not wanting to pay her. That I care only about money. He will be glad she moved out and away from me. Just a guess there, but I feel pretty confident on that one.
Doesn't matter, we all have one or more of those in our sitches. I doubt he'll be much of an influence on her decisions. He sounds like the type that never approved of any choices she made and was always right there to point her mistakes out to her. She's more likely to defend you to him than to listen to him, because listening to him would basically be admitting that she was wrong about choosing to marry you.
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How can a woman be intimate with someone she has no feelings for?
Don't start believing her now brother Remember the DB tip about not believing anything they say and only half of what they do. She's not out of the tunnel yet. She DOES have feelings for you, otherwise she wouldn't have come back. But she's got to say she has no feelings because she wants to try that on and test to see if it sounds "right" to her. She'll figure things out, just give her time and space to do so.
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Hell, seems like I'm asking the same questions I did 8 months ago! One step forward......
So quit asking!! Because you will NEVER get a satisfactory answer. WAS's emotions are running the show. Logic and reason are on vacation in Tahiti. When emotions are running things, actions don't make sense. Don't try to make sense out of them, focus on YOU and leave her to sort her own issues
Thanks, Mach. I'm trying to keep all of that in mind. I guess reconciliation looked to me exactly like what we were doing. Maybe to her it was about a flood of feelings coming back. Guess that might be where we are different.
Everything just seemed to implode so quickly....I still don't fully grasp it.
She just came my and loaded up all of her things and left. Ouch. Not gonna lie, that hurt. I didn't really say much to her. Just kind of kept my space and helped her when she asked.
I know I keep saying this, but I really did not see this happening. She was just moving more stuff in last week.
Trying to stay PMA.
Crimson
Yea, it sounds like an Emotional decision to me. Her head and her heart aren't reconciled around all of this ....yet.
Her rational side says she does, and her emotions are telling her to run.
Remember all of those WTF moments that you used to post about ? You are just close enough to really see all of that now.
Doesn't mean that it won't or can't happen, it's just not there yet.
Keep on with you buddy, It's not YOUR issue to fix.
Water off of a duck's back, cause you are gonna be fine either way....
(MAYBE let him and your mom have some drinks together and hash that out but leave you two alone.)
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Wow, I am overwhelmed by the kind words, guidance and advice. Sincerely grateful that so many of you here can help be my “shore line” when I am drifting and lost.
Val – you are correct in your assessment that there are still moments where my decisions and actions are somewhat guiding by fears. As she was living here, I found myself getting over it to a certain degree….speaking out more, be honest with feelings. For example, in a perplexed moment she said it always seems like I get bummed out when she makes plans with her friends some nights. I told her that that is true, but it’s not because I am angry – but rather I miss the time with her when she was gone. That honesty actually resulted in positive results. Still, when things go sideways (like now) fear does take hold again. I am working on pushing through it.
Accuray – I think that I am making a sincere effort to drop the rope while she is out of town. I really have no intentions of reaching out It’s a start, but it the past it has been the right thing for me to do. As far as OM goes, maybe I have my head buried in the sand, but if one exists she has done a masterful job concealing it. She often states in casual conversation that during her period alone there was no one….no one hitting on her…no one she went on dates with – and so on. I want to believe that, but of course that’s because I WANT to believe that. Rather, I think her remarks about feelings are comparative – but more about some internal expectation that she has to automatically feel a certain way and if it’s not there something is wrong. Regrettably, I do not agree but as you said – I can’t make her want this.
25 – as usual, you make complete sense to me. I guess the problem is, I’m not sure if xw can differentiate between what’s a frustrating moment or habit and what would be detrimental to our relationship. Right now I think it’s like a PTSD situation when a recent combat vet hears a car backfire and drops to the ground for cover. Anything that even REMOTELY looks or feels like “old” me it a firm indicator that we are heading down the same route and the urge to flee arises. Even though she KNOWS I am a different person these days. She has articulated as much.
To answer you question “why did she bring those things to the house if she knew she was leaving two days later”…..eff if I know. I honestly do NOT think she was planning on leaving two days prior. Hell….8 HOURS prior. I really think that it was an emotional, somewhat split-second decision in the moment. Hopelessness hit her and she believed that was what she needed to do.
Yes, it IS her emotional “stuff” to own and all I can do is calm down and temper my reactions. (Where can I buy these libido pills you speak of??). Truthfully, 25 – the sex was different…better…more passionate (not to get all SM34 on you guys). I felt that was a good sign…was I wrong? What does this mean for feelings??
To your point, I too have a hard time reconciling all of the positives she said about me against her claim of “feelings not being where they needed to be”. I don’t see how that works. It’s almost as if she SEES it all, but is terrified to open her heart back up for fear of landing where we once were. She said on Sunday that her heart still feels closed from all we went through and she doesn’t want to force it open or force her feelings.
I guess I was so stoked when she wanted to move back on a trial basis that I dropped my shields. She really actually pushed for us trying it. Maybe it was a bad idea in the absence of simultaneous counseling. You say let her fear losing me….but really, would she? Would someone who so quickly ejects from someone fear LOSING that person, too?? Part of me feels that there would be a sense of relief on her part if I just gave up. Maybe I’m wrong…..maybe I am being too hard on myself in light of recent events.
You said I need to make sure that she realizes this is a choice…leaving is a choice….love is a choice….opening your heart is a choice. But how? How does one do that? I have said it before to her, but I don’t think it resonates.
I have a deep well of unconditional love for that woman. By now she MUST be aware of that – how could she not be? And I have a bottomless well of love for our son. I feel like that would be so hard to find out there. Hell, my single female friends TELL me it is barely out there at all. Why then does it seem so easy for her to turn her back on?
AS – You hit the nail painfully on the head. As much as I wanted to fight it you are right….I DID develop expectations. I think when she sorta pushed to move back, then started moving stuff in, then started making long to mid-range plans it happened. I allowed it to happen. I needed to believe so badly that she was here for good I lost focus and got attached….codependent. I say that because now I am feeling those emotional pains when someone leaves. You pinned me to the wall with your post. In the midst of my up and down feelings these days I need to find “neutral” Crimson again. Thank you for the insight.
Mach – As has been the case with most things – I think this was a 100% emotional decision for her. I think in times of fear or uncertainty (which, justifiably, she has) she turns to her emotions or what she calls her “gut instinct” or “vibes” to guide her. Sad thing is that with many (including myself) those things are often just the manifestation of our own beliefs and decisions that we attribute to some divine intervention. Does that make sense?
I have been reading all the great advice you have been getting and Im quietly scared of what reconciliation would look like if it were to ever happen with my W. I think the key is to have no expectations and be prepared for the changing dynamics. Just the other day I thought i had lost my love for my W and then i was really ready to move on. I saw her yesterday and all of a sudden, all that love for her came straight back and knocked me out.
I think DB'ing is like life, everytime you get knocked down you can chose to lay there....or pick yourself up, dust yourself off and dig deep deep inside to find that reason to just keep going.
You are stronger now than you were before...you know what to do, because you have done it already. Get back on those tracks Crimson...the future is uncertain and it was never meant to be any other way. Be in the moment...not in the future or the past.
Me - 37 W - 37 M -5 T - 15
S=5 S=3
Seperated - 12/12 BD - 20/03/13 Still seperated - no R or M talk yet.
Remember the DB tip about not believing anything they say and only half of what they do. She's not out of the tunnel yet. She DOES have feelings for you, otherwise she wouldn't have come back. But she's got to say she has no feelings because she wants to try that on and test to see if it sounds "right" to her. She'll figure things out, just give her time and space to do so.