Where do I go now?

[Psych77]

I used to post here frequently, but fell away. I don't know if that is the reason that things went wrong, but I think there is a lot more to it than that.

In August, after a lot of work on learning to control my temper, going to a batterer's intervention group for a year (my temper had me yelling at W and - unintentionally - intimidating her), and finally agreeing to sleep separately until she felt more comfortable, W told me that continuing to work on M was torture for her. She informed me that she would no longer go to MC, that she was not going to continue to work on M, and that she wanted us to no longer have any expectations of each other. She concluded the conversation with, "As far as I am concerned, this marriage is irrevocably broken." Those words are indellibly etched in my mind.

Now, we are still living in the same house - we cannot afford 2 households on my income, and besides I have no intention of becoming "uncle daddy," who comes and visits a couple times a week. No, I am going to be a daily part of their lives! (No offense to those of you who have had to move out - we all do the best we can under the circumstances) I sleep in a rollaway bed in the unfinished basement. Sometimes I feel like a spare thing that we have no room for. But my family needs my income, and at least my children need my presence.

It has often been really tense. Sometimes when I make a stupid mistake (like putting the wrong kind of cheese in a recipe), W accuses me of having done it deliberately just to spite her. Unfortunately, my responses have not always reflected the greatest degree of grace - although I will say this for myself: I haven't gone back to yelling at her, and I let go of the arguments much sooner than I used to.

But things are getting calmer now. I used to tiptoe around her, saying only the minimal things necessary, and trying to be as unobtrusive as possible (I was just trying to avoid fights). Eventually, I discovered that this only made her angrier. So, now I tell her what has to be said in a calm, confident tone of voice, staying very businesslike, and she responds in a civil and reasonably pleasant tone.

I am struggling with GAL - I want to do some things for myself, but I am really anxious about losing even one evening a week with the kids, as they are kind of my lifeline now (of course, I make sure that I am there for them and do not "lean" on them emotionally). I work 50-60 hours a week, and it is hard to find a social life outside home in the time that remains.

I am posting this in "Divorced, but not done," because I still hold out the hope that, sometime in the far future (I don't expect it any time soon) we might be able to find each other again. But I guess I feel kind of aimless...I know that I have to live as though this marriage is never coming back, but my heart can't close off that possibility. I just don't know how to tackle life at this point.

I remember last time I was here, I got support, I felt welcome valued by the other people here. I hope to have somebody here to talk to again.

[Cadet]

Why did you move out of the MBR and not her?

Dont move out of the house until a judge orders it.

She should move if she wants a divorce.

[Cadet]

Just went and read a little on your old posts.
Last year your wife was pregnant.

Maybe she is now going through post partom depression?

Sounds like she has been on a real rollercoaster of hormones.

You have 6 kids?

She might be scared you will impregnate her again.

[Psych77]

Cadet -

You got it. I moved out of the MBR because W and the baby sleep there now. Can't exactly ask them to sleep in the basement, now can I?

I don't know if she has postpartum depression. I don't even get that close to her, that I would be able to tell. She doesn't want me that close to her.

I've thought she might be afraid of getting pg again, but at this point we are way past just not ML...we aren't talking, and she doesn't want to try to talk.

We're not actually D, nor has W suggested it. Like I said, the kids are really attached to me, and both they and W need my income, which wouldn't support both them and a separate apartment for me. Besides, because of our faith, neither one of us would consider dating again. We both believe that marriage is a lifetime commitment.

It's really uncomfortable, and I am just trying to cope with making my life work in this situation - trying not to be miserable all the time, finding some way to be happy, which I am sure will make me more pleasant to be around for everybody, including myself.

I don't look forward to coming home anymore, and I hardly eat anything at dinner when the family is seated all together. I feel too self-conscious and anxious. I read to my younger kids every night, something which they anticipate eagerly, and which is my closest human contact for the whole day, so it is a high point for me, too. After that, twice a week I prepare a meal for the next day (W has the baby, so it seems right to do something to help out), but all I really look forward to from that point on is going to sleep. I've gotten used to sleeping alone, and even have learned to enjoy the privacy. But sometimes I just feel like I'm hiding...trying not to be a problem in a house where the other adult seems to wish I weren't there.

I'm seeing a therapist for depression, and my antidepressant has just been increased. We'll see what that does for me.

Well, I just got off on a long tangent, didn't I? Listen, thanks a lot for replying to me. It means a whole lot to know that someone is listening, even if it's just in type.

[Psych77]

I'm wondering if I shouldn't have posted this thread in "Surviving the Big D." I guess right now trying to have a life without W is what I am struggling with.

[Cadet]

Well I dont have 6 kids but the rest of your story I have lived through.

It sounds like you are making the best of it.

You will get more responses in newcomers or MLC, but here is OK too.

I check in here fairly regularly.

If your religion is really preventing your divorce then that is great.
In my religion you must have a special "get" to be able to remarry and the man controls that.
So I am divorced according to the laws of the US, but not according to my religion.

Keep being the best DAD that you can possibly be because if anything is going to draw you back together again it is going to be your children.

I agree that it may take some TIME or a lot of TIME.

Keep posting someone will listen.

[Psych77]

Thanks, again, Cadet, for talking to me.

Wow, I have never heard of a religion that put all power over D into the hands of the man. I have to admit, my first reaction was one of offense - why should the man get to decide whether the woman he does not want anymore should be allowed to remarry? - but then I remembered that I frequently have to listen to other people telling my how sexist my religion (RC) is, and how sick I get of it, when it is something in which I truly believe. I guess when you are outside someone else's faith, it is easy to look and be shocked.

Still, it really puts you behind an eight ball. I am sorry for your situation.

Actually, I didn't really even think of my religion preventing divorce as "great," but I guess it is. I wasn't really thinking of it that way, because right now things seem so bleak and dark. Most of the time all I can envision for the future is me sleeping in a basement next to the boiler for the rest of my life, or at least until the baby is grown up and no longer needs Dad to be there.

There's only just that faint glimmer of hope, that tells me that maybe, someday, I will be in love again.

I may try one of those other lists as well. Thanks.

[Cadet]

Most of the time all I can envision for the future is me sleeping in a basement next to the boiler for the rest of my life, or at least until the baby is grown up and no longer needs Dad to be there.

There's only just that faint glimmer of hope, that tells me that maybe, someday, I will be in love again.

Well forever is a long time.
And as far as hope, that is something that is contained within YOU.
There can always be hope as long as it is inside of us.
As long as you have NO EXPECTATIONS, there can be HOPE.

I have been studying this stuff for going on 4 years now.
Things can and do change but sometimes it occurs at less than a snails pace.

The best advice I have read and give is to have Patience, lots and lots of it.

Those people that just get on living their lives can survive this.

Once you know that you are going to be OK one way or the other, then thats when change can be born.

Have you read Admiral Stockdale's quote when he was a POW in Vietnam?
Try googling it.

[4311]

Have you read Admiral Stockdale's quote when he was a POW in Vietnam?Try googling it.

In a business book by James C. Collins called Good to Great, Collins writes about a conversation he had with Stockdale regarding his coping strategy during his period in the Vietnamese POW camp.

"I never lost faith in the end of the story, I never doubted not only that I would get out, but also that I would prevail in the end and turn the experience into the defining event of my life, which, in retrospect, I would not trade."

When Collins asked who didn't make it out of Vietnam, Stockdale replied:

"Oh, that's easy, the optimists. Oh, they were the ones who said, 'We're going to be out by Christmas.' And Christmas would come, and Christmas would go. Then they'd say, 'We're going to be out by Easter.' And Easter would come, and Easter would go. And then Thanksgiving, and then it would be Christmas again. And they died of a broken heart."

"This is a very important lesson. You must never confuse faith that you will prevail in the end—which you can never afford to lose—with the discipline to confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be."

[Psych77]

Thanks, 4311.

I guess that is an important thing that I need to look at. Accepting what is (as lousy as that is right now), and believing in something better...eventually. Believing that it will all be worth it in the end.

I am right now looking back on what I have been doing for the past 2 years (started DBing back in 2011), and realizing that what I am focusing on now is largely the same thing I have been focusing on for the last year: becoming a person again. I threw my whole self into learning to support my family and wanting to be a good husband, and let go of any sense of identity I had myself. Now that W, who really was the center of my life, has abdicated that position, I am trying to remember who I am.

I guess the progress made is that about a year ago that was one theme among many, and far from the center. Now it is a major goal in my life. Being somebody for my own sake. And since I cannot say for certain that I will ever have W back, I really need to have a life and an identity worth having independently of her.

Years ago I used to take Karate classes, and I am planning on starting again on Monday. I NEED to start again on Monday. There were some friends there I talked to casually, and it would be helpful to have another adult who regarded me more positively than W does. Maybe smiles at me once in a while. And the exercise, having some goals of my own, apart from W and family - just might help me shake off some depression.

Thanks, everyone, for being here.