Piecing - Round 1

[angel61]

About SS - why don't you just both provide both ways? You be the toughie, she gives him touchy-feely stuff. We all need both. Not just at the same time....thats how we are with our D. I notice when I am being the toughie, my H gets all touchy feely with her, then vice versa.

But we still both uphold the rules. Like if she's wrong, she's wrong for both of us, but whereas I would yell at her, H would sometimes just approach her nicely and talk to her with some topics, then say "Hey, I know you upset Mom today. You know, you really have to.....etc. etc. " I do that to when H is the one all yelling and upset at D (the other scenario is more likely though, as I am the tough love kind of person actually).

I'm working on that though. One of the reasons our sitch started was because of my tough love for H in the past ....my attitude used to be shape up or else.....I got the "or else" in the end....DB has taught me differently and now I use that with my D as well, and it works. have to learn how to use it with my parents

[Sad_but_happy]

Hi angel,
I respectfully disagree. The cheating spouse has the obligation to make sure that the cheated on spouse feel secure. That's not control. That's love. That's respect. That's empathy.

And at this stage open communication is key. Denver felt insecure. He had a right to. He should not surpress his feelings.

Now trust me, I know my MO is a hard line approach. Its that way because they wronged us and they nned to make it right. In whatever way necessary. Now don't think I'm one sided here. Denver did wrong by emotionally leaving and he has to make it right in any way necessary to meet her needs.

And btw, I 100% believe in db'ing. It worked for me. I chose to leave cause I didn't want to feel insecure for the next 10 years. I needed a clean slate. My ex regrets what she did every day. And she would be married to me still if I said the word. I'm not bragging. I'm acknowledging that the system works.

Yes, we all will have different approaches. I saved myself by leaving. Others will save themselves by staying. None more right than any other. This angel, we agree on.

[Denver_2010]

Angel was talking about my W and I dealing with my step son. Some parenting issues. I don't think that she talked about my R with W. Just want to clear that up.

Thanks Angel. We do do that. Unfortunately, SS has not been responding well to either of us lately. We've knocked heads about how to deal with that. He is on an IEP for behavioral issues at school. So he's pretty tough to deal with sometimes. I haven't talked about it much on the board, but it's definitely a stress between W and I and always has been. It can also be exhausting for both of us which causes additional tension.

---

SBH - I'm glad that you saved yourself, however it had to happen. I don't think that it matters what others might think, you have to do what you have to do to be happy. Towards the end of my separation with W, I really did reach a point where I finally felt that I was going to be okay with either outcome. It was at that point that I realized that my old R with my W had completely died. That realization has helped me now, looking at my current R with my W, as something brand new. That helps me move beyond most of what has happened between us. It helps me forgive her, and I think that it helps her forgive me.

Anyway, I would still love to hear how everything with you and your W transpired. If and when you ever feel like posting about it. I understand, of course, if your feeling is that you'd rather not.

Take care.

[figgeroni]

Denver...

I understand the ss issues and IEP issues very well. My sons are both on IEPs (for EBD but not the EBD that most people think of...not the emotional outburst, bad behavior but they need to make an emotional connection to their work)

but

my Cori's daughter has RAD so I know full well, the difficulty of behavioral issues.

Also, as a teacher, I am privvy to some educational type interventions as well...

if you need any new strategies to try, let me know

[Denver_2010]

Hahaha... I totally missed the posts from SBH and Angel ... whoops

"The thing from the other night that SBH was referencing really was nothing. Insecurity on my part that was unwarranted, albeit normal after what I've been through, given the actual circumstances."


Denver, it's not "nothing". Your insecurity is not unfounded. This is where I fear that healing can not take place.

In a normal situation, where there was no infidelity, I would agree that the incident was "nothing".

But here is what I see as the ground floor honest and harsh reality.

She's not getting it. And you're in denial.

Nah SBH, it really is nothing. There was a time, when I was younger and before I knew my W, that I had a big time jealous streak. For no reason really. I had to get that under control because of some problems that it caused in prior relationships (before W). So with W, I was the complete opposite. Even when I felt that jealous streak, I had learned to totally suppress it. This was more in line with that part of me than it was having anything to do with what happened with OM.

Actually, what happened with OM has taught me to awaken a bit of that jealous part of me... to the extent that I need to be aware of what is going on around me. In other words, I need to take care of being a decent H and being aware of who is around our lives... from both of our ends.

I don't worry about W meeting some guy and having some sort of one night affair. I don't worry about that at all, in fact. I worry about our lives becoming unhappy again and what either of us might do if that were to happen. So my focus is on making sure that we are doing the right things to stay happy... to stay connected. I think that there's a book that reminds me of what I am trying to say... affair proof my M.



Why?

Because right now, at this stage of the game, she needs to have a HIGHTENED sense of your needs. If she is talking to a man in your presence then she needs to do SOMETHING to SHOW you that YOU are the only man for her. Something small.

How would you have felt if she DID....

* Grab your hand?
* Give you a loving smile?
* Send a fast "I love you" text in the moment?
* Introduced you into the convo?

Would that have relieved your jealousy? I bet you would have felt like a million dollars.


I'm not asking for mushy gushy hanging all over you. I'm saying a simple gesture of acknowledgement that says... "I'm talking to him but it's you I love."

She actually did do something that made me know that she was aware. She put her hand on my arm as she was talking to the guy. And I had been introduced to the guy earlier. Had talked with him a bit in fact. It was just that her conversation was about being a musical performer... how he had gotten to where he is... and where W was with her career. It was kind of a musician to musician thing. And it only lasted maybe 3 minutes. I am almost embarrassed to say that I got jealous about it to be honest SBH.

I do get your point SBH. In some ways I agree. But my experience has been similar to Angel's. My W has gone above and beyond what I've asked of her as far as transparency goes. In fact, I never really demanded any of it.

Either way, I have no concerns about that aspect of things. OM is out of the picture, W has totally committed to the M, she took the initiative to resize her wedding ring and put it back on, she is doing things for me like she used to, ie, putting tons of effort and time into throwing me a 40th birthday party. BTW, she's throwing me a Boardwalk Empire/roaring 20's party with piano player coming in to play so she can sing some, a DJ/Karoke guy... I'm psyched because it should be a blast.

But I digress. My point is that instances such as the one that I mentioned are few and far between. And I think that what Angel said is true. We have to learn how we control our reactions to things. Ultimately, I can't control my W, or anyone else for that matter. There is no point in being with someone if you can't trust them. Sure, there is a risk to putting trust in anyone. Especially with someone who has broken that trust before. But, IMO, that risk is the same with ANYONE that you will ever be with. We can start over with someone new, but who is to say that that person won't violate your trust someday? There are no guarantees with anything in life. For me, I will take the bet on my W and I and what we have learned from this experience, over something brand new with someone that I don't have this life experience with. That's just my opinion on the subject.

[Denver_2010]

Denver...

I understand the ss issues and IEP issues very well. My sons are both on IEPs (for EBD but not the EBD that most people think of...not the emotional outburst, bad behavior but they need to make an emotional connection to their work)

but

my Cori's daughter has RAD so I know full well, the difficulty of behavioral issues.

Also, as a teacher, I am privvy to some educational type interventions as well...

if you need any new strategies to try, let me know

Thanks Fig! Yeah, that sounds very familiar. It is difficult. We have to get him through 4 1/2 more years of school. More importantly, get him to a place where he can be successful. It is a stress. And sometimes, you just feel like giving up. My biggest personal issue is how disrespectful he is to both of us and some of his teachers. He is especially disrespectful to my W. IMO, because she is too soft on him and isn't consistent enough with consequences. Whereas he knows that he can push me to the point where he needs to actually be concerned. For example, lately, he will just flat out refuse to comply. "No. I am not going to do that." If I had done that with my dad, I would have had my a$$ beat! LOL! And in some respects, I feel that SS needs a little of that attitude from us. But W disagrees with that completely. So we butt heads there. And for me it is tough because he is not my son. My W wants me to co-parent with her and she definitely allows me to impose discipline, but she puts the brakes on with certain things. It can be a bit frustrating.

I appreciate the offer. My W is a teacher as well and has a few different colleagues who deal with this kind of stuff who she relies upon. If you have anything that you can put on the board for me to look at I would definitely look at it though.

[LITB]

Denver,

There are always some interesting topics covered in your threads.

I wanted to share this. We were watching October Baby over the weekend. I found this line to be very profound, "Hate the crime, not the criminal." To me, that speaks of forgiveness.

Anyhow, I want to touch on forgiveness and focus. I believe they go hand in hand to some degree.

I'm sure you have heard the story about feeding the positive and negative dog:

We all have two dogs inside of us. One dog is positive, happy, optimistic, and hopeful. The other dog is negative, mad, sad, pessimistic, and fearful. These two dogs often fight inside us, but guess who wins the fight? The one you feed the most.

Which reminds me, I really need to get my hands on this book(The Positive Dog: A Story About the Power of Positivity).

There isn't a doubt in my mind, when we put our focus on our spouses past offenses, it holds us back from completely letting go and experiencing true forgiveness.

It's a long process. Perhaps a never ending process and I am sure we all go through the steps at different paces.

I digress. Back to your regularly scheduled program.

[Denver_2010]

Denver,

There are always some interesting topics covered in your threads.

I wanted to share this. We were watching October Baby over the weekend. I found this line to be very profound, "Hate the crime, not the criminal." To me, that speaks of forgiveness.

Anyhow, I want to touch on forgiveness and focus. I believe they go hand in hand to some degree.

I'm sure you have heard the story about feeding the positive and negative dog:

We all have two dogs inside of us. One dog is positive, happy, optimistic, and hopeful. The other dog is negative, mad, sad, pessimistic, and fearful. These two dogs often fight inside us, but guess who wins the fight? The one you feed the most.

Which reminds me, I really need to get my hands on this book(The Positive Dog: A Story About the Power of Positivity).

There isn't a doubt in my mind, when we put our focus on our spouses past offenses, it holds us back from completely letting go and experiencing true forgiveness.

It's a long process. Perhaps a never ending process and I am sure we all go through the steps at different paces.

I digress. Back to your regularly scheduled program.

Absolutely agree with ^^^ LITB!

[Sad_but_happy]

Well Denver,
I have to conceed. In the best sense.

It does sound like your W is and has made positive steps toward healing and forgivness.

I wear my emotions on my sleve when it comes to adultry because the pain can cut so deep. I always said that I could never get past an affair. And when tested, I was right. At least for me. That said I know my W never made me feel 100% secure again. Had she, maybe my result would have been different too. Who knows really?

I'm passionate about this because I do care.

I will post my journey from my ex's ea to my final divorce soon. I just got my final divorce decree in the mail today.

Now the hard part for my W. I've removed her from all medical, dental and vision. She's having to work full time for the first time in her life. Long hours. Her car is dying and she's not able to do the vacations and trips she once enjoyed.

For those that cheat I urge you to consider the full consequences of your actions. The fun lasts only as long as the music plays. And as you can see, the music has stopped for my ex. And the "fun" with it!!!

I take no satisfaction in this. Only sadness for her. And in some respects... Myself!

[Denver_2010]

Well Denver,
I have to conceed. In the best sense.

It does sound like your W is and has made positive steps toward healing and forgivness.

I wear my emotions on my sleve when it comes to adultry because the pain can cut so deep. I always said that I could never get past an affair. And when tested, I was right. At least for me. That said I know my W never made me feel 100% secure again. Had she, maybe my result would have been different too. Who knows really?

I'm passionate about this because I do care.

I will post my journey from my ex's ea to my final divorce soon. I just got my final divorce decree in the mail today.

Now the hard part for my W. I've removed her from all medical, dental and vision. She's having to work full time for the first time in her life. Long hours. Her car is dying and she's not able to do the vacations and trips she once enjoyed.

For those that cheat I urge you to consider the full consequences of your actions. The fun lasts only as long as the music plays. And as you can see, the music has stopped for my ex. And the "fun" with it!!!

I take no satisfaction in this. Only sadness for her. And in some respects... Myself!

I'm sorry to hear about your D SBH, but it does sound like you are doing relatively well.

I do agree with you that being made to feel secure again is a necessity. It also something that doesn't just stop... it has to be ongoing. But I think that is true of all relationships too, regardless of whether or not there has been infidelity.

I've said this before, had my W's choices come under different circumstances, ie, had we been doing well and we been happy when all hell broke loose, my outcome probably would have been different too. The circumstances of my R with my w at the time, our history together, and each of our personal histories, all allowed me to find some understanding of what happened. My work here allowed me to find the ability to forgive.

I also agree with your statement to the potential consequences of engaging in infidelity. As someone who had never really though much about it, this experience has taught me to think twice about those temptations. It has also taught me the pain that all of this can cause. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy... well maybe one! LOL

I look forward to reading your story SBH.