How Do You Stop Driving Yourself Crazy

[ThisDayForward]

Kaffe thanks for the brutal honesty. Obviously my fear and anxiety is showing up here and has wreaked havoc on my life and my M. I guess a counselor would be the best bet for "angst" and maybe some more reading and exercise. It is tough right now on me because part of angst is not knowing. Right now my life is not knowing. Thanks again. I truly appreciate it

[~ kd ~]

get a therapist/counselor if you can. Truth is, I was a nutbag when my sitch started... it took a while for me to find this site and I'm sure there are lots who would say I was still all over the place emotionally... a wreck as it were.

I hope that I at least "appear normal" now...

[ThisDayForward]

Can I ask this. Just because I'm not pursuing does not mean it is "LRT" correct. I consider LRT just going dark. Did I misinterpret that section of DB

[steady]

My 1st thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...167#Post2215167

Thanks everyone! Let me clarify. I begged, pleaded, cried, manipulated, tried every tactic under the sun while I was at home for over a year straight which LED to the physical S.

I did the same thing. Pushed my relationship right off the cliff. The physical separation will be the best thing for you even though you may not see it from the position you are currently in.

Now that we are physically in separate houses I do not pursue or ever mention the R at all. I am reading DR, using a coach, and have a SBT locally.

I know you say you're not pursuing or mentioning the R at all. But let me take a stab here - you're thinking about it most of the time. The same thoughts are obsessively whirling around in your head and no matter what you do you just can't seem to make them stop.

Doing any stalking? Drive by's?

As far as GAL I joined a local card club. I quit drinking but the cards get me out on the nights that I do not have kids. I also am involved in the church more. I'm thinking about reactivating gym membership and going mountain biking again.

Why are you really doing all of that? Maybe to impress the W?

One thing that just happened just now at kid pick up she made a comment that came across that the separation was going to be long term. (suppose to be a trial to stop the vicious cycle) I just smiled and laughed went on my way with the kids. Nice 180 actually.

Beats crying in front of her. When she says something like that to you and you actually don't get phased by it, then you'll be free. She stabbed you in the heart, you winced and grit your teeth - a step above before.

I truly wish I had DB, DR, and this forum before we had to physically separate. I would have done lots of things differently. Oh well I didn't.

Stop wishing. It doesn't do a damn thing except allow us to give ourselves more of a beating.

You weren't supposed to have DB until you got it.

The toughest parts are the things I mentioned earlier in this thread. After I say goodnight to my kids at night I don't hear a peep from her at all.

Try this on for size. How do you know her not making a peep at you is bringing her closer to you or further away? What if her peeping at you every night just pushed her further away. Would you be so distraught at her not peeping if you knew that?

She does do small things here and there that give me hope (or more like mixed messages)

Forget hope. It's a four letter word. Herein lies the problem. We think we know what things mean but we have no idea. We can read that sentence and understand it's absolutely true, but it doesn't do anything to stop us from acting and thinking as if we know what things mean. It's absolutely ridiculous how stupid our minds are to itself.

She does something small and it gives you hope. (Because you think it means you're moving in the direction you want it to move) Then something happens and it takes away your hope. (Because you think it means you're moving in a direction away from where you want it to move).

But how do you know? How can you possibly know if what's happening now is moving in any direction?

My W screwed me a month before she told me she was done and wanted a D. This was after a year of her 'trying' and me working my ass off to change. Oh boy, when that happened, it was surely a sign things were swinging my way. After all, it had been a year since we had sex.

So much for predicting.

What if I knew the future and I could tell you that you have to absolutely get to the point where you don't care which way things turn out in order for you to keep your relationship. That you both need to physically separate, that everything that's happening now and in the future needs to happen in order to get where you need to be. What would you do now and how would you feel now?

I'm trying to detach the best I can but man that is tough.

Most important thing and also the hardest thing. Why couldn't they make the most important thing the easiest?

You're trying to let go of someone you love but love her from a distance.

You can't let go of someone you actually love. I know it sounds like semantics but you can't ever hold something you love. Love doesn't hold onto anything. Letting go implies a having, a possession. That's not love. It's dysfunctional. But don't worry, I've come to the conclusion that most, if not all, (me included) people who come here suffer the same dysfunctional emotional coping mechanisms. In other words, we're emotional children for one reason or another and have never truly emotionally grew up to adulthood.

You're trying to cater (for the kids sake) to her but not smother her.

Interesting word - cater
Interesting plant of reason - for the kids sake
Interesting choice of 'not smother her'

Trying to trust she won't let some snake of guy slither in when she is vulnerable.

Really? If you really knew the absurdity of this line of thought you may possibly not have to do it.

Accepting that everything is out of my control accept my own actions is so obvious but so hard to do.

You'd be surprised to learn you can't even control your own actions. If you could, would you actually put yourself through the obsessive thinking that torments you? Thoughts come and go. You don't create them, you just notice them. By the way, all those thoughts are bullsh^t. 99.9% of them are wrong. But we latch onto them and spin ourselves into a thought frenzy.

I've always worried about things I have no control of. I know this is a 180 area I need to work on. I think lots of people do actually.

Try everyone that's here.

Anyways I appreciate all the feedback. I'm not pursuing, being pleasant, staying busy as I can, but every day is a struggle. Oh yeah the last thing I'm trying to break is talking to any family members about the situation.

Giant tip. Delete your FB account. It was liberating and eliminated 75% of my anxiety.

Do you still peak at hers?

[labug]

Great post, tough, but great.

[~ kd ~]

Great post by steady.

Just to answer your question about LRT and dark, NM...

Dark is very specifically NO CONTACT. No contacting her, no responses to her attempts to contact you, no "chance meetings" at a club you know she's going to or at the grocery store. Actually intentionally having ZERO CONTACT with your W.

Dark is to protect yourself emotionally, until you work through much of the grieving and are able to control your emotional outbursts of sadness or anger when you are in contact with her. NOT to be punitive or as some "technique" to win her back. It does not work to get your spouse back.

Both dark AND LRT are discussed as temporary measures. How ever long YOU need to help YOU get back into a stable frame of mind.

After that, your goal is to edge towards communication, 180s, and GAL and working on yourself, as ways to SHOW your spouse that you CAN change and being consistent and persistent with the positive changes so that they become real and your spouse can trust them. That takes time.

The LBS must SHOW their positive changes, NOT verbally share them. The WAS will not believe our words. They will only believe consistent acts and actions.

[ThisDayForward]

Steady thanks for the reply.

Doing any stalking? Drive by's?
A. Nope I don't do any of that. Actually we have a pretty good relationship since I stopped pursuing her. She has the key to my apartment and I have access to house if needed I just txt her. I'm getting a little better at not obsessing over the R. It is hard because I literally see her every day even though we are S. To keep things "normal" for the kids I put my son on the bus everyday for school etc.


Why are you really doing all of that? Maybe to impress the W?

A. No I'm doing it to keep my racing mind busy. I don't even think she knows I do it.

Do you still peak at her FB.

A. I can't. It is completely locked down even if I wanted to. But because we had so many mutual friends and it gave me high anxiety and is actually a big reason why we have so much damage in our marriage I decided to delete it.

Seems like you worked your ass off Steady to get the end result you didn't want. I guess that is what I fear. I just have to take the attitude of saying "at least I gave it my all and never gave up"

New to the forum but just doesn't seem like a lot of happy endings on here.

I can appreciate the comment that you made about not caring which way the relationship goes. Funny thing is my W actually told me that in a round about way when I was still at home. She said maybe if you stopped caring so much things would get better.

I've learned a ton about myself the last 4 weeks and even more about myself today. Thanks again for the reply

[ThisDayForward]

KD thanks for that clarification. I'm on the right path. Believe it or not it is working in small doses. We talk on the phone after the kids say good night. (No R talk) I've hung out a few nights at the homestead on non kids night. I think she finally trusts me to be around and not talk about us at all.

[steady]

A. Nope I don't do any of that. Actually we have a pretty good relationship since I stopped pursuing her.

Funny how that works isn't it?

I'm getting a little better at not obsessing over the R.

Mindfulness type programs can help you with the obsessing. Mindful meditation, mindful cognitive behavior therapy, emotional intelligence. Google any of those and you'll get the idea.

Obsessive thought patterns are a learned behavior. They take over and over-run the part of your mind which is supposed to be able to throttle the emotional/mental response to match the actual "threat" that's perceived.

It is hard because I literally see her every day even though we are S.To keep things "normal" for the kids I put my son on the bus everyday for school etc.

Do you really have to see her every day? Is there a way you can 'not' see her a few times a week?

Why are you really doing all of that? Maybe to impress the W?

A. No I'm doing it to keep my racing mind busy. I don't even think she knows I do it.

Do you still peak at her FB.

A. I can't. It is completely locked down even if I wanted to. But because we had so many mutual friends and it gave me high anxiety and is actually a big reason why we have so much damage in our marriage I decided to delete it.

Good, good and good.

Seems like you worked your ass off Steady to get the end result you didn't want. I guess that is what I fear. I just have to take the attitude of saying "at least I gave it my all and never gave up"

The jury is still out on whether I get the end result I wanted. VERY often there's a difference between what we need and what we want. But I did get a lot of what I wanted.

I wanted:

to be in a position where it didn't matter to me whether my M was saved or not... got it.

to be in a position to know I have no idea where anything is actually heading or where anything will land.... got it

to be standing on my own two feet and living my life... got it.

to not be obsessing about 'her' .... got it.

to have 50% custody of my kids... got it

oh the list can go on for quite a while.

New to the forum but just doesn't seem like a lot of happy endings on here.

Lots of eventual happy endings. Not so many 'saved' marriages. I use the term saved very lightly.

I can appreciate the comment that you made about not caring which way the relationship goes. Funny thing is my W actually told me that in a round about way when I was still at home. She said maybe if you stopped caring so much things would get better.

Just don't take that and beat yourself over the head. It was probably more in line with leaving her alone at the time. The not caring is detachment to outcome, that's for YOU... that's your freedom.

I've learned a ton about myself the last 4 weeks and even more about myself today. Thanks again for the reply

Ultimately that's why you're here. You may not know it yet.

You may want to gander at these:

Detaching
A few posts below that:
Detachment as it relates to 180's

Here's a story I love. If you can embrace this way of being you'll be golden:

We'll See...

There is a Taoist story of an old farmer who had worked his crops for many years. One day his horse ran away. Upon hearing the news, his neighbors came to visit.

"Such bad luck," they said sympathetically.

"We'll see," the farmer replied.

The next morning the horse returned, bringing with it three other wild horses.

"How wonderful," the neighbors exclaimed.

"We'll see," replied the old man.

The following day, his son tried to ride one of the untamed horses, was thrown, and broke his leg. The neighbors again came to offer their sympathy on his misfortune.

"We'll see," answered the farmer.

The day after, military officials came to the village to draft young men into the army. Seeing that the son's leg was broken, they passed him by. The neighbors congratulated the farmer on how well things had turned out.

"We'll see" said the farmer.

[ThisDayForward]

Thanks for the reply. A little discouraged by the not so many save marriages but such is life. That is out of my control.

I see her everyday only for putting my son on the bus. He really likes me doing it. So I'm sort of in a pickle there. Very brief interactions. But I 100% hear you on that. This is the "cater" part I was speaking of. He also likes me bringing him to his after school activities. So it does stink from that aspect. Trying to do what is best for kids. Remember this is a "trial" (lol I know) and the D bomb not dropped yet. Accept in heated arguments when still at home.

Thanks for tips on mindfulness. Surprised its learned behavior. I'm sure it has something to do with my awful upbringing. I'll research more into. I know this is a 180 area that I need to work on for sure. Not only with R but other aspects in my life. I've always thought the sky was falling. At work if layoffs were coming it was always me first. (in my warped mind)

Really enjoyed the story man.

This must have been tough:

to be in a position where it didn't matter to me whether my M was saved or not... got it.

to not be obsessing about 'her' .... got it.

Thanks again for replies. They help. They show me some of the good positive strides I'm making and areas I need work.

NM