Willowwept

[LolaL]

Hi Willow:

First, (((Hug))), because the situation you are in is very painful. It is hard to see the person you love turn away from you, and not understand why.

I have been posting for about a year, and I want to share that DBing is about making you a better you. This may go hand in hand with saving your M, and getting your H back from the OW, but it CANNOT be the main focus. Right now, the main focus has to be you working on taking care of you, because if you don't, no one else will. If in the process it saves your M, then it is good. But regardless, it is about you being okay and strong, no matter what happens.

DON'T THINK SUICIDE!! Why give him the easy way out? You are stronger than that. At one time or another, many on this board have had the same thoughts. If they are not just fleeting thoughts, you need to see a counselor. Regardless, counseling does help.

I have read a number of books, and they all are basically the same. Take care of you. If you come off as weak, moody, and angry, then your H is going to turn away. If you can't hide your mood, get out of the room, out of the house.

It is also okay for you to remember it is NOT okay that he is doing this. In the process of dealing with this issue I read a book that says that women generally suppress the need to be angry. You can feel angry, sad, hurt, like bashing his face in. You just cant do any of it

Feel. That is the biggest thing. If you don't allow yourself to feel, then you won't be able to get it all out.

And breath...

Lola

[Creed]

Willow

I add my greetings along with all the other posters.

As someone mentioned, when you're in the position that you are now (and we all have been), there's no way but up. So don't give up on yourself!

I just also wanted to add , most lawyers will tell you to NOT be the one that leaves the family home. I'm not sure what the laws are in your area, but here it is no-fault. My L strongly suggested that I not move out of the home while xh and I were separated. Xh was already living in an apt with OW at the time. I wanted to be able to find an apt and leave HIM with the mess of cleaning out our home of 22 years, deal with the realtors, etc. My L said no, to stay there as long as possible. I would imagine it has to do with the financial agreements during separation/divorce.

It might not hurt for you to have a consultation with a L at this point. It does NOT mean that you are considering/want a divorce..but it will give you a heads up as to what you need to consider before you make any decisions based on your emotions at the time. I would suggest making no decisions based on your or your Hs emotions. Things have to be treated as a business arrangement, and no less when it comes to property/living arrangements/financial agreements. As you've found out,when our emotions are in a tailspin, we're out of control and make bad decisions and act out poorly...both things that can damage our chances for a more equitable outcome if necessary.

The more in control you feel of your own self-worth, the more you will be able to step back and not let the emotions control you and your actions.

I agree with the others...the OW is a tool for your H to feel better about himself. You know...the knight in shining armor?? He's feeling badly about himself, and she makes him feel that he has worth and reason in life. Doesn't mean that you didn't..but she is new and doesn't know all his faults/warts like you have learned over the years. He can be whomever he wants with her..she's a clean slate.

Just remember...this is about him...not about you or necessarily your marriage. I'm sure you made mistakes in this relationship too...we all have...but this about his own self-worth and fears. The OW is willing to be whomever he wants/needs for the time being. But never fear, in time her true colors will show and she will demand more of him than he's capable of or wants to extend to her.

I can only imagine the betrayal you must feel because of the friends that knew what was going on and didn't tell you. Try not to hold it against them...some people would rather pretend to be ignorant that be the messenger that brings such devastating news to someone they're close to. But I also wouldn't forget which side of the fence they decided to stay on in the future. Be careful that you don't talk to your friends or family about this whole situation. Don't give anyone the ammo to be used against you in the future. And it makes it much harder if you and your H reconcile in the future. If too many people know all the details, it's hard to find support if you want him back later on.

Again, welcome..and I hope you will find the support and advice that you need from this board. It's a wonderful collection of people and opinions.

[job]

Willow,
How are you today? I see others have come to visit. They all have posted excellent information.

Please take care of yourself. I'm concerned about you.

[Willowweep]

Thank you all so much for your kind and generous advice and comments. You guys all seem so together. How do I get to that place???

I think I've made a big mistake. Should I say ANOTHER big mistake.

B asked me how I was last night - and being mindful to use the strategies suggested here I told him I was fine. But instead of just shutting up and 'acting as-if' - I told him that I know I've been a mad woman for the past couple of weeks. I told him that this "thing" has really shocked me and I'm not sure that I know how to deal with it. I told him that obviously we coudln't continue to live this way (I think he was shocked by that - seems he has a view that we could continue on this way??)

I told him I'm making arrangements to work from my office in Brisbane for a couple of weeks so we can have some space while we get through this - and that while I'm interstate I'll look for a flat in this city.

That was where it all went wrong. He said I shouldn't have to move out of our house. He would. He said he's been thinking that I should stay at the house with the kids and he's going to move in with her.

I just really can't quite believe this is happening. He hates her house. He has always said it's a dolls house, imagine living in it? She and her husband recently renovated it and we helped in the whole working-bee weekends and he constantly said how he didn't like the style or design of what they did. He's like a completely different man.

I literally felt my heart break when he told me he was going to move in with her. I didn't say anything. I left the room and went and had a shower.

He said we'll talk to the kids tomorrow and tell them what's going on.

I haven't been acting crazy - but I'm broken and I don't know what to do to put myself back together.

[Willowweep]

I feel so alone.

I can't talk to B. I can't talk to my friends because I'm so hurt they've all known about this for months and not told me.

I can't talk to the kids (they're not really kids, they're 18 and 21) because I'm too ashamed. I don't know why I feel shame - but there you go.

I can't talk to my parents because they just will not understand. (When my sister told my mum she was separating from her husband a few years ago, my mum was so upset and told my sister "Good women have hard lives." Mum reckons you should just suck it up for the good of the marriage. My Dad though dotes on her, so she wouldn't know a 'hard life' if she fell over it.

I've got an appointment with a counsellor tomorrow morning. She's been recommended to me by a woman I work with who went through a very difficult family situation recently. Apparently she's very good. I don't know if she's pro-marriage. Should I ask her? Actually, I don't even know if I'm pro-marriage at the moment.

I've never had any sympathy for people who so glibbly say "I wish I were dead" - or "I feel like killing myself" - but I'm starting to understand how you can feel so hopeless you just don't want to wake up in the morning. I'm not going to do it, but for the first time in my life it's in my head. It's a very unpleasant experience.

Thank you for reading along. It helps to know I'm 'speaking' to someone out there.

[FightingFit]

Dear Willow,

your sitch reminds me strongly of mine and I am on my third year. My ex ran off with his teenage NEICE (yea.) and his REASON was "she needs my help". I did it all wrong as they say here, and everyone is right, it drove him to leave the country to go "help" her. so your lucky you found this place.

Im in australia too and can talk to you when you need to, I am not sure if PM's are available here if so we could exchange details, if not I will try to keep an eye on your posts...

your sitch is horrible and Im so sorry - you trusted this woman (as I did) never imagined it even possible (as I did) and everyone knows (as with me). the humiliation is pretty tremendous and im SORRY. and it doesnt really get better just more manageable.

you will find as time goes on yuo may need to make difficult decisions about who to keep in your life and who not to, i certainly did that and cut every person out of my life who knew this was going on and didnt lift a finger to stop it. I did that for my own peace and I am not sorry.

the OW is stuffed up mentally and her 'grief' and 'problems' have made her into a selfish little _(#%&)(%&%. this is exactly the sitch with our "neice". shes got a sad, sad story too. DOnt care; not enough reason to steal someone elses happiness and eat from MY table. you have a complete right to feel OW is beneath you she absolutely IS. Shes so wrapt up in herself and her pain she doest care less what agony she causes as long as SHE gets some comfort and SHE gets some happiness - her view is SHE deserves it, now. BULL DUST. you get what you earn in this life not what you steal.

First things first, dont you DARE feel ashamed. I spent a LONG time feeling that way and what a waste of time. THIS ISNT YOUR SHAME ITS THEIRS! TALK ABOUT IT AND OUT THIS AND OUT HOW HORRIFIED AND HEART BROKEN YOU ARE TO FAMILY. yea dont you make it easy on them to hide their dirty little secret bc your ashamed; you got NOTHING to be ashamed of, those two do. MONSTERS, to use a situation that was supposed to be one of SUPPORT and COMFORT to get sexual and ruin a family. MONSTERS and dont you forget it either. you did nothing. you have not been such a rotten wife you deserved this. you have not been so plain or ugly or unattentive its no wonder he preferred her. He just preferred her bc she opened HER LEGS. and then he fell into the whole "guilt" and "remorse" thing and now hes busy justifying it all saying she "needs him" and he is "helping her". LIKE HELL he is.

you need to talk to your mum and dad. They are going to be shocked and horrified but you really NEED their support right now and they ARE GOING to support you! your mum sounds like mine, she wanted me to take back the H and I even DID but he kept up the contact (sound familiar) and eventually ran away anyhow then she was FORCED to concede i'd done all I could. you after all, DO want to save the marriage if you can, its not YOU walking away. and like YOUR mum my mum wouldnt know what its like if it hit her with a 2x4, like you my dad is AWESOME, but dont worry, she does know that. you remind her she doesnt know your pain. shes an adult. shes also your mother. she'll support you!

ive gone thru exactly all you have including suicidal thoughts, blaming thoughts, regrets, and anger so extreme it nearly destroyed me. I didnt have these resources and I nearly did myself in. dont you do the same. you hold on now, for you and you be ok no matter what.

listen willow, i know what its like and i lost every friend i had and half my family thru this. but im glad to leave those people behind. im real sorry i didnt know more if I had had beter tools i would have done differently but i didnt so I even though I have regrets i forgive myself too. but i wasnt interested in ever talking to his family or any friends who knew, ever again and thats been powerful for me, even tho its also been really lonely.

i had to move states I had no job and three kids to raise. but i did it all and i am still living. I am proof you can do it and i was with my first lover, first bf, only husband, 20 years teogether and like you, NEVER thought he could DO anything like this and like you, he told me BRUTALLY. he left me destitute! he left me to raise three kids - HIS kids - ALONE with NO FINANCIAL HELP, while HE helped HER! only a few years OLDER for gods sake.

its harsh but its THEIR SIN not yours.

you deserve so much better! and of course you still love him. heck I love mine three years on but its only RECENTLY i decided i wont ever speak or see to him again - for me I have decided to make "going dark" permanent even if he tries to reverse it. ive come to that. thats why im here.

but in your case its EARLY DAYS and lets not assume he wont realise and come back! you still have some hope but you have to not let anger and despair rule you. FIGHT TO WIN,but do it with the tools found here... !

I want you to WIN. id like to see at least YOU win... vicariously it would be huge for me LOL. i hope like heck you do. she doesnt deserve a thing and you deserve to get him back. right now dont assume hes an AH. hes probably mixed up and confused and we ALL MAKE BIG MISTAKES... we can forgive them, so give him the chance to realise it...

hold on

xoxoxo

[peacetoday]

w
right now its a minute a a time
the pain is intense--we know
alanon is a free support group all over the world
the principles are much like DB
meeting are held daily most everywhere..if interested check online or speak to your counselor
churches also hold many support groups..these groups are a way to get thru the pain..meet other women who have been thru it and talk--that helps
great that you have an appointment tomorrow..oncwe a week may not be enough now..so remember do everything you can to take care of you..this pain is temporary--
you will become streonger than before because of it
pray
exercise
eat
get support
peace

[cat04]

Willow,

I have been here what seems like forever. Although I haven't posted before I have learned a lot from just reading.

You ask how you get to the "ok" point. There is no easy answer to that. It is slow. It is something that just sort of happens over time. What is really odd is that as you get ok, you start to see how really not ok the WAS is. That too is hard.

The counseling is great. Just ask if they are pro-marriage. You may not feel like you are now, but as you get past the shock, you will realize which road you really want to take. Sometimes the M can be saved, sometimes it can't. But regardless, you have to save yourself. It is the only way you can move forward in your life, either way.

The shame is normal. Although you did nothing wrong, you feel like you must have had some role in it. We all have some role to play, changes we can make in ourselves, but I sort of put this akin to rape. You did nothing to cause it, you didn't want it, but you still feel like you could have stopped it and there is shame associated with it. You wonder how you could have missed it. You question your entire thought process and how could you have trusted this person who so blatently lied to you and you didn't even see it. It is because we trust and love. It is because we think we know these people. But when this is happening they are not the people that we know.

You did not really do anything wrong in talking to him. We can all only take so much. I live with my H and most days it is ok but there are days when I just want him to not be here because it is difficult. Only you can decide what you can handle right now. DB is great in theory, however, it is not an exact roadmap of what to do. It is more like a guide book. The goal is not for us to become doormats, but to become empowered. What works for one person will not work for all. My H, well because of our issues, sometimes I just have to go against DB to an extent. My MO was to keep my feelings, unless they were anger or happiness. I didn't cry in front of him because it has always made him uncomfortable. Now, months and months later, now that I am strong within myself, I cry if I feel like it. At first it made him angry. But I just told him that if he couldn't deal with how I felt that was his problem. Now, after 20 years, he has actually asked me what was wrong on more than one occasion. Yes I can see that he is still uncomfortable but he is also concerned. Maybe it is a small step to him leaving the MLC alien behind, I really don't know, or just simply him realizing that I too am human. But my point is you have to do what works for you. So not exactly good DB in some ways (isn't exactly staying upbeat and acting as-if) but a total 180.

As for him moving out, well to me that is telling, especially if he is willing to leave his kids in your care. He is willing to leave all of his responsibilities behind. That is classic depression. And although it may not be the best situation, it may be good for you to stay in the home. Hang in there, work on yourself, eat, sleep, stay busy. Tell only people you are comfortable telling. You are just at the beginning and this is your entire life you are trying to figure out. The answers, the right answers, will come to you when you least expect them. Take time, that is one of the biggest things you can do for yourself right now is to give yourself the time to make choices. Not everyone will support you if you choose to wait and ride out the rollercoaster. People just don't always understand that choice in a world where divorce is so prevalant. But although your mother's thoughts seem a little archaic, they may actually be on the right path. Not that we are meant to suffer in silence and just live with it (which is what she is saying) but that the quick fix isn't always the right answer.

[1hope]

Willow (((HUGS)))

The friends here have given you some excellent advice. I have been here a bit more than a year, and can honestly tell you that this site, and the DB books saved my life.

I have been thru this not once, but twice. I was married to my first H for 19 years when I found out he was having an A with our good friend/neighbor. Like you, everyone knew...except me. I lost friends and family when I divorced him. I knew nothing about DB back then and it took years to heal myself.

Fast forward to my 2nd H, he was truly my best friend and a man I could trust after I thought I would never trust again. Guess what? Life happened, and he did what I never believed he would do. (check out my link to previous threads if you'd like) The difference this time was I had this site, the books and enough experience to realize that D is not(always)the answer. I settled in to do the DB homework and to make myself as strong and as good a person that I could be.

We have been able to reconcile and are now working on a strong and happy marriage, together.

The reason I tell you this is because I want you to know that there is hope. Today you can't possibly see that there will be a tomorrow. But it will come. Eventually you will get to a point when the pain eases enough that you can breathe a little. You will find your strength. Us girls are strong. Hold your head up and fight like a girl!

I see several good points in your post. If he needs to move out of the house, let him. If you can stay in your home I would do it. Don't make any decisions for awhile if you can help it. Try to keep calm, and if you can, detach from him a bit. If he didn't like her house before, trust me, as soon as real life sets in and his fog begins to lift he will really not like it again. We all know that nothing kills a romance like real life. It will be very hard for them to build anything solid on a foundation of lies. They will never be able to trust each other, and they haven't even begun to discover the damage they are causing.

Take care of yourself and keep breathing. You are safe here.