Fog is lifting for my german wife

[sandi2]

I would like to add this to what I said before. When I said what I did about being caught up in the fantasy world......even though I had decided to stay in the M, it was b/c I could not afford to support myself and that's why I did not move out. So, it was a long time before I could reach the place of deciding to let the OM go and stop the EA. Then I had to go through the grieving process and that takes a long time. Fighting Fit said it best in her thread when she said that when a WAW doesn't have "closure" to an EA and feels "forced" to end it while the OM is still seen as her knight in shining armour......she has a terrible time putting those fantasies to rest. She is correct! If the OM does something to make the WAW mad or hurt her or whatever....then that is better b/c she can get over him quicker.

You see, the difference in how men battle sexual temptation and how women handle it, is very far from each other. Women's battle is in their minds. Men's battle is more about the "physical" and they are tempted through the eyes, and replaying what they've seen. But, women fantasize and it is always beyond anything reality could offer. I fantasized about my OM, and there is no way he could have lived up to my dreams about him. That was what one woman told me as soon as I came here to the board. She was smart and she had my number!

The book, "Every Woman's Battle" by Shannon Ethridge, was the best book I've ever read that told the truth about women and their fantasies of other men. I found it at a Christian bookstore, and it was such a relief to finally find a Christian who had the courage to step up and tell it like it is. It would help the LBH to read it so he could realize how his W has to do battle within herself. The OM is kept alive by her fantasy and that is a hard thing to kill.

Hope that helps.

Sandi

[givingitmyall]

Sandi,

I ordered that book this am. You keep adding to my library.

[Thinker]

I'll buy it as well.

Sandi, I can see exactly what you are saying - and can see it happening in real time here in my own sitch. Although my W has completely denied it the few times I (in a moment of DAMness) brought it up, I know (and have seen evidence) that my W is still fantasizing about OM. He's the white knight, and I am the barrier (or the ogre, to keep the analogy going) that is separating her from happiness.

All of which leaves the LBS with a very tough question - "How do you compete with a secret fantasy?" Answer: "You can't!"

[Gardener]

Don't know whey the WAS's will not acknowledge our changes

giving,
I forget where I read it but I keep in mind the following (probable) answer
to that question:

The Walkaway Spouse knows two things:
1) They know their spouse.
2) They know their spouse will never change.

To #2 could be added, "...not really.change, anyway. And certainly not permanently (any and all evidence to the contrary)." So their decision to walk away remains valid.

[sandi2]

Glad you guys ordered the book and I think it will be very informative. It was for me and I'm a woman! I thought I was weird but come to find out......that is the way females are!

Thinker, in response to what you said about not being able to compete with her "fantasy" of OM......sadly, you are right. Nobody can compete with that fantasy.....INCLUDING THE OM. That is what you have to remember and in time (that old four letter word...TIME), she will finally see that the OM is not what she dreamed he would be. I have been reading Fighting Fit's beginning thread and it is very good. May help if you all read her explain the POV from a WAW. She was a WAW, then her H was a WAH. Sad story.

#2 could be added, "...not really.change, anyway. And certainly not permanently (any and all evidence to the contrary)." So their decision to walk away remains valid.

I think that we WAW's "give up" on our spouse ever changing permanently. I know over the years when I would sit my H down to have one of those long talk about how unhappy I was and wanted him to make some changes.....it would last about two days! Then it was right back to the same old stuff. It is exactly Michele describes in her article of the WAW.

The hope I give to you men is the fact that "I" woke up from my fantasy and saw through the fog. So, as long as your W does not M the OM.....there is always a chance. I encourage you to read Fighting Fit's old thread about her description of WAW's.

Later,
Sandi

[BigJohn]

The Walkaway Spouse knows two things:
1) They know their spouse.
2) They know their spouse will never change.

To #2 could be added, "...not really.change, anyway. And certainly not permanently (any and all evidence to the contrary)." So their decision to walk away remains valid.

Boy you sure got that right Gardener, especially #2. According to my W's thinking, damn near anybody can change for the better- especially her OM- but not her H. Apparently us LBHs are the only members of the human species who can't adapt/change, therefore your right, our WAWs really have no choice but to discard us and find someone who is perfect.

[Gardener]

BigJohn,

Boy you sure got that right Gardener, especially #2. According to my W's thinking, damn near anybody can change for the better- especially her OM- but not her H. Apparently us LBHs are the only members of the human species who can't adapt/change, therefore your right, our WAWs really have no choice but to discard us and find someone who is perfect.

Yeah, I know. Still don't think my wife has an OM, though. My DIL (in whom my wife confides somewhat) tells me no way. Of course the last time DIL shared with me was to say that my wife can't make up her mind what to do and the next day my wife asked for a D(!)

Gucci Loafer says "the signs are all there" that my wife is having an A. He didn't elaborate, and he hasn't returned to my thread since I asked him to explain.

How the hell does one find out? I won't snoop. Or should I stay with my gut of knowing this woman's core and knowing, somehow, in my gut, that she's just not having an A? Am I just borrowing non-existent trouble?

[jaguilar]

PD,

Stay strong my friend.

[BigJohn]

BigJohn,

Boy you sure got that right Gardener, especially #2. According to my W's thinking, damn near anybody can change for the better- especially her OM- but not her H. Apparently us LBHs are the only members of the human species who can't adapt/change, therefore your right, our WAWs really have no choice but to discard us and find someone who is perfect.

Yeah, I know. Still don't think my wife has an OM, though. My DIL (in whom my wife confides somewhat) tells me no way. Of course the last time DIL shared with me was to say that my wife can't make up her mind what to do and the next day my wife asked for a D(!)

Gucci Loafer says "the signs are all there" that my wife is having an A. He didn't elaborate, and he hasn't returned to my thread since I asked him to explain.

How the hell does one find out? I won't snoop. Or should I stay with my gut of knowing this woman's core and knowing, somehow, in my gut, that she's just not having an A? Am I just borrowing non-existent trouble?

Gardener,

I don't recall your entire sitch but I'd say that there may be a strong possibility of an OM. Look, I would have never in a million years thought my W would EVER cheat on me! She is the most wonderful woman I have ever known, which is why I entrusted my heart, body and soul to her. She is the only woman that I love unconditionally- the only woman that I want to be married to! I would trust her with my life! Yet, she -apparently inadvertently- got ensnared in an EA in the midst of the biggest downturn in her life, it snowballed and now I find myself fighting my a** off for our M.

I don't know exactly what you consider to be snooping, but I would highly consider loosening your standards a little bit in an effort to get more informed as to what is going on with your W. Recall what happened in my sitch. If I hadn't stumbled across that email to the OM while cleaning up my email account I would have never found out about my W's EA until it was far too late to start DBing or doing anything constructive. Like you, my "gut feelings" about my W at the time would not have entertained the possibility of her having an A. I would never have had the opportunity to learn what I have about my W's EA and more importantly understand the serious crisis she is in had I not found that email.

Your W could be in serious trouble and involved in something way in over her head that she may or may not have actively chosen to get herself into. As her H, you have an obligation to your W to find out what the hell is going on with her. She apparently is not going to be forthcoming about what that is so you are going to have to be proactive.

The first place I would start would be to check all of the email accounts for possible correspondence with OM. Check the "Trash" folder first followed by the "Sent" folder. If she is just in the beginning stages of something like an EA she likely won't be thinking too hard about erasing her tracks. Next, check her cell phone bill for calls and text messages to unfamiliar phone numbers. Also check the home phone bill for unfamiliar phone numbers. Next, get on your home computer(s)and check the "History" on the web browser(s). If you are in luck, she will not have had the foresight to erase the browser history and you can get an idea of what websites she has been visiting.

If she has a Facebook and/or MySpace page, I'd check those out too to see who has been posting comments.

Now don't make me get my 2x4 out and bonk you with it. Get busy and let us know what you find out.

[PortlandDad]

@BigJohn
Knowing is very important, at least initially. It's what you do with that knowledge, however, that makes all the difference.

Going on the 4th day since her blow up and no contact whatsoever. I know she needs to stew in her juices for a while, but I am finding that I had really picked the rope back up there for a while.

The sad thing is that my S13 had been calling the W every day and the W ignores his calls. He sent her a text yesterday and she finally got around to texting him back and told him that she would call him sometime today (likely after I have left for work).

Nothing has changed, so I need to trust in my celexa and just keep on being superdad.