How can I listen if she won’t talk?

[lily]

Andy, maybe it's the little headache I have that prevents me from understanding part of your last post to my thread.

. . .low part of the roller coaster when things start to look up. . .

I like the content of the stuff being posted on your thread. This numbness fits it. Got to lose it so that I can listen, really listen. You too?

My H's ancestry is Spanish. He's spouting French phrases (I'm clueless) these last couple of months. At first my hackles rose because one of ow's son's names is Etienne (sp?) and I figured H and she spoke French together. I knew H's sister had studied French so I asked H and he said he'd had a year of it.
I'm realizing that H keeps his mind chock full of data so that he can avoid thoughts re the last year. I think a lot of his mental R work takes plae when he gets stuck doing some meticulus repetiive task. The French is just another way for him to dodge. Beautiful language but totally baffles me when I try to read it.

[Phoenix]

Gee, this seems to be shaping up to a special kind of hell for you Andy...buncha chicks wanting you to listen to them .

I almost feel sorry for ya .

[Jamesjohn]

Andy -

Are you a big "fixer"? Do you always know the solution to problems? Do you have to really restrain yourself from having to solve other's dilemmas?

I was there, and I found it to be a BIG problem in my communication skills with my wife. She would take my "helping" her as me thinking she couldn't handle things on her own. This built up a giant wall, and immediately put her on the defensive. Our talks went absolutely nowhere but down.

I've found that the more I let her talk things through, the better. When she keeps her thoughts inside of her head, they start to get all jumbled up, and go off in wierd directions sometimes. "Thinking out loud" really helps her, and she really appreciates it.

The code for us now is, "Honey, I'm just thinking out loud, so don't hold anything I say against me". Or "I don't want you to feel you have to fix this for me, I just need to talk this through".

We often have to interupt each other, too, to keep us from interupting each other! I think she rambles all over the place, but if I let her just go on, things eventually come around full circle to the root of what she's feeling. She thinks I take too long to get to my point (which I definitely do at times!), so I try to give her the Reader's Digest condensed version whenever possible.

Don't know if any of this may help you, but it might give you a few different ideas to try, or some things to think about!

[matilda]

Hi, Andy.

H an I had lunch together today. He made a remark, which I THOUGHT I understood perfectly well. Later when I got home I sent him an E-mail about his remark -- supposed to be funny. Well, I happened to be on the phone with him when he opened the e-mail. He read the first line and said "that's not what I meant." "Is that what you said?" "Yes, but this is how I meant it." Hmmmm?

Matilda

[Phoenix]

That's a whole other can of worms. We've spent a LOT of time here learning how to say what we mean and mean what we say. Mind reading is not only not likely, but would anyone really want that?

[ANS]

Frankly, I'd want it. My W has told me things that range from (and I paraphrase) "You're a controlling person. I'm not going to let you jack me around anymore" to "I really appreciate all that you've done for me and our family."

I wish I could read hermind just long enough to figure out if she's posturing to get what she wants, or placating me out of sympathy.

The ttile of my thread is "How can I listen if she won’t talk?", but the other problem is that when she talks, how do I know if she really means it?

Andy

[Daisy]

Andy,

There isn't an answer for that question. I guess she means what she is saying at that particular point in time, but may feel differently later? I think we all realize that words spoken in anger are often not the true feelings, so I guess that is all we have to go on. Confusion in W's mind will cause her to say contradictory things...I know I get that a lot from my H.

Try asking for confirmation that what you "hear" is what she "said". I have come to realize that after being together 16 yrs, my H makes a lot of assumptions and has often decided what I was going to say or how I was going to react in advance. It's a major roadblock to communication.

Listening is an art we all need to work on.

Daisy

[ANS]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Sorry if I don’t respond to each poster individually. It’s all thought provoking stuff, and very useful.

But, I think that at this point, I have to rein in my thoughts. Things are pretty cool right now, so I don’t think it’s time to stir the pot.

Yes, I have a lot of hurt from things W said and did. Do I really want to know if she’s posturing/placating?

I guess the answer is yes as long as the answer is “posturing.” Problem is that I don’t even know if W knows. She tells me things because she wants to be honest, and wants me to know that my past behavior has consequences. Unfortunately, I cannot use this information. I cannot unring the bell.

I’ve DB’d my butt off, and all of you long time readers of my threads know how disappointed I was when I found out how little effect it had on W. I’ve gone back to the drawing board several times.

I guess it’s just time to go with the flow.

TTFN,
Andy

[matilda]

Hi, Andy.

I'm glad to hear that things are "cool"now. Yeah, it is time to go with the flow. I think that sometimes we get so caught up in DB'ing and looking for all the "little signs" that we forget to just be happy with what we've got right in front of us. For you, you've got a W who's there with you and still trying to figure things out. Can you really expect a whole lot more?

Nobody said that if you DB'd your butt off that things would be perfect and you'd live happily ever after. Unless you consider the fact that you're still married, you know your W cares for you and is trying to make sense of everything -- maybe that is happily ever after, after all! Who knows.

Love,

Matilda

[ANS]

Thanks, Matilda.

Yeah, things are cool, but I hafta admit that I still want things to get hot I gave up looking for little signs a long time ago. I get down when W ignores me for awhile. I feel better when she makes some sort of effort.

I know it sounds pathetic, but yesterday she went for a walk, and asked me along. That felt good. The other night, she told me some stuff that she was told in confidence. It’s these small things that make all the difference.

BTW, the confidence that I spoke of was from TF’s W (TF is my troubled friend that I referred to in other threads). She cut him off from sex as punishment for being grumpy. W finds this very distasteful. I think it’s horrible.

As to me, I still miss the affection. W isn’t punishing me. She just doesn’t want it. I think that hurts even more than if she was being vindictive. I feel so undesirable and unloved when the only one who initiates a hug is me. I feel awful when she never says ILY, and only responds with a grunt or a nod when I say it.

I’ve noticed that this happens more often when she’s particularly tired, so I try to prepare myself.

The flow isn’t necessarily a good thing, but I have to go with it. When – like this weekend – the flow goes my way (sorta), then it’s easier.

I’m not looking for “happy ever after.” But I guess some sort of effort on her part would be nice.

Just have to manage my expectations I suppose. A coupla weeks ago, she told me that she thought I was waiting for her to change, and that it wouldn’t happen. I denied it, but I suppose she’s right

Just gotta stay while I wait it out.

Andy